Tesla EV Tax Credits coming back?

[aparan]

Word to the wise: DO NOT beard the IRS in its den.

If you give the impression that you bought an EV as a speculative profit venture you are asking for trouble. Even if you end up prevailing, the time, aggravation and costs involved will not be worth it.

I agree that messing up with IRS is not at all a good idea. However, for discussions sake, cannot figure out what exactly this means as its written? "is acquired for use by the taxpayer and not for resale" . Is there a reasonable time limit to demonstrate that original intent was not for resale? What if someone got the car with the intent to keep it for 25 years but doesn't like the car after 1 week? IRS guidelines I am aware of are not left for interpretation so confused with this

 

[Corndart]

I agree that messing up with IRS is not at all a good idea. However, for discussions sake, cannot figure out what exactly this means as its written? "is acquired for use by the taxpayer and not for resale" . Is there a reasonable time limit to demonstrate that original intent was not for resale? What if someone got the car with the intent to keep it for 25 years but doesn't like the car after 1 week? IRS guidelines I am aware of are not left for interpretation so confused with this

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I've also heard of (in the past) car dealers "selling" to employees to hit manufacturer quota / sales numbers in order to reap large bonuses, then turn around and sell them for a few $k off MSRP with almost no miles. Since Tesla doesn't maintain a traditional inventory / dealer network and is instead made to order with limited configurations, it seems unlikely to be an issue for them, but the law isn't a "Tesla law" , it's for all EV's.

 

[SageBrush]

IRS guidelines I am aware of are not left for interpretation so confused with this

You would be surprised. In the end, tax court prevails based on tax law. You end up in tax court based on the whimsy of the auditor. And even in tax court, the judge applies reasoning to ferret out the intent of the law. In tax court the presumption that you are innocent until proven guilty is not present. A glib 'I changed my mind about the car after a week of ownership, and I don't see how the tax man can prove otherwise' will not fly.

If a plurality of people here at TMC listened to your story, and after asking questions that you have to answer truthfully conclude that you are a speculator, you can BET that the IRS will have a good collection day from you.

--
My personal case might raise questions. I have a Model Y LR on order, even though what I really want is a Made in Austin, longer than LR EV (LRR.) It is at least possible that I take ownership of the LR and then a few weeks later Tesla offers the LLR. In ordinary times I would try to wait for the LLR to come out, but due to the high used car prices I figure that I can hedge the Tesla timeline with minimal cost or even profit. I might be able to convince the auditor that I bought the LR with intent to keep the car but a new car model changed my mind. The story would have the advantage of being true and honest, but I could still easily end up in tax court.

 

[Two-rocks]

All this talk of tax and the IRS, should be noted that there is an allocation of BILLION$ for IRS enforcement in this bill.

Self employed, so want the tax credit, but more audits by an over funded IRS tasked with generating more ‘revenue’? Not so much (been there before).

 

[Corndart]

You would be surprised. In the end, tax court prevails based on tax law. You end up in tax court based on the whimsy of the auditor. And even in tax court, the judge applies reasoning to ferret out the intent of the law. In tax court the presumption that you are innocent until proven guilty is not present. A glib 'I changed my mind about the car after a week of ownership, and I don't see how the tax man can prove otherwise' will not fly.

If a plurality of people here at TMC listened to your story, and after asking questions that you have to answer truthfully conclude that you are a speculator, you can BET that the IRS will have a good collection day from you.

Well stated.

If you're asking yourself "can I get away with it?" and make money on both sides of a Tesla purchase (EV credit, upside down used car market), you should probably also put that money aside for help during an audit/day in court if needed, and to pay whatever penalties are incurred.

Ultimately we're all just speculating here, and although I've no doubt we've got some highly intelligent people who may be tax experts and/or lawyers, relying on interpretation and advice vended here on this specific topic, seems pretty foolish.

 

[Teslitored]

I talked to a SA last week to have my EDD on Hold until Jan. 2nd, 2022.

I received the below email this morning from Tesla... it said my order is going to be canceled????...so I replied immediately....

 

[nate704]

I talked to a SA last week to have my EDD on Hold until Jan. 2nd, 2022.

I received the below email this morning from Tesla... so I replied immediately....

View attachment 736109

Looks like you are way past Tesla's 90 day hold limit already and Tesla is starting to enforce that policy.

 

[Teslitored]

Looks like you are way past Tesla's 90 day hold limit already and Tesla is starting to enforce that policy.

No... I just called last week to ask for a Hold...

 

[SageBrush]

No... I just called last week to ask for a Hold...

Do you have a VIN ? If not, call early Dec, and confirm delivery for Jan onwards.

 

[Corndart]

I talked to a SA last week to have my EDD on Hold until Jan. 2nd, 2022.

I received the below email this morning from Tesla... it said my order is going to be canceled????...so I replied immediately....

Not sure why this belongs in the EV bill discussion thread but hopefully you can get it sorted.

 

[Teslitored]

Not sure why this belongs in the EV bill discussion thread but hopefully you can get it sorted.

Because I put it on Hold to be able to get the EV Tax credit if it is approved.... many people have done the same thing, so I'm sharing what is happening or at least what's happening to me....

 

[pgcoco]

So what is going on with the bill as of today? Sorry not too good at this? Any idea if this will be approved before thanksgiving? I heard Christmas somewhere and somewhere Feb?

 

[Bosco33]

Not sure why this belongs in the EV bill discussion thread but hopefully you can get it sorted.

A lot of us are trying figure out how to navigate our deliveries along with the potential passage of the EV credit. It's important for us to see examples of what people have done and how Tesla is handling it. This is very relevant to this thread.

 

[pgcoco]

Do you have a VIN ? If not, call early Dec, and confirm delivery for Jan onwards.

Is that possible. Hold on delivery for a month?

 

[doomsday997]

So what is going on with the bill as of today? Sorry not too good at this? Any idea if this will be approved before thanksgiving? I heard Christmas somewhere and somewhere Feb?

Lol zero chance of approval by thanksgiving or November. This will be a slog and go well into December. If they are lucky maybe they can send it back to the house by Christmas. In a week the bill will be shelved to fight over the budget then the debt limit

 

[mmatlock]

So what is going on with the bill as of today? Sorry not too good at this? Any idea if this will be approved before thanksgiving? I heard Christmas somewhere and somewhere Feb?

Schumer claims the Senate will have some version of BBB approved by Christmas. If so, it would then go back to the House for approval. I think there's enough support that a version gets passed with EV credits similar to how they appear in the House bill. It's all speculation at this point.

 

[Corndart]

If

Because I put it on Hold to be able to get the EV Tax credit if it is approved.... many people have done the same thing, so I'm sharing what is happening or at least what's happening to me....

I'll have to disagree and here's why:

a) you didn't say anything about this being related to the BBB legislation
b) until there is any evidence of Tesla making order changes (cancel/reprice) specifically because of EV deferrments, there is no relevance

Sorry if I'm being a jerk but let's keep this thread for its intended purpose, there are plenty of other places to discuss order and delivery topics.

 

[Corndart]

Schumer claims the Senate will have some version of BBB approved by Christmas. If so, it would then go back to the House for approval. I think there's enough support that a version gets passed with EV credits similar to how they appear in the House bill. It's all speculation at this point.

Given that Pelosi has publicly stated she's secured support of Manchin and Sinema, unless the more progressive members of the Senate block, it seems pretty likely that it'll pass.

Even if the Senate makes some changes, the EV aspect in particular doesn't seem to be drawing a lot of fire other than the union labor element. There is a potential that particular aspect gets changed or perhaps even scrapped, which would either be a noop or a $4500 boon for Tesla buyers.

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[Firocity]

I received the ”Your Upcoming Model Y cancellation“ email. As long as I reply, will they keep my order placed and on hold?

 

[nate704]

I received the ”Your Upcoming Model Y cancellation“ email. As long as I reply, will they keep my order placed and on hold?

It will be your final. So, if you do not click "I am ready now", Tesla will most likely cancel your order and take your $100 or $250.