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Tesla forced an update of my P85D to 2019.16.2
- Thread starter HankLloydRight
- Start date
whitex
Well-Known Member
If you believe that, you will part out your Tesla and send the parts out to people who need them, for fee. Think how many other Tesla owners needs this will satisfy, against just your single personal need.
sublimejackman
Member
Oh Geez… I thought you were talking about a professional here
haha. He's cool.
I'm on the list for a Model Y. So once I have that as my daily driver, I think I'm going to dive into messing with the Model S.
Don’t be dense and argue false equivalencies.
As I said, Tesla created this problem by allowing people a choice they never should have had to begin with
Update as they please and those who don’t like it can buy another brand.
If people stop buying Tesla’s than that’s the signal you are right.
Since Tesla is aiming to produce 1000 V9 cars daily - they clearly do not give a f about the v8 whiners.
Read the link I posted. It’s all there. Whether you choose to believe it or not, Tesla has been talking about charging for premium access since the Model S was launched. Back then they said it will be “free for five years”. Just because they still can’t figure out how to charge me doesn’t mean there’s any contract in place. Your argument holds no water.
There is absolutely no explicit or implicit agreement that using the premium network services obligates me to accept, without notice, everything and anything Tesla sends down the wire(or air).
Bet TSLA
Active Member
sublimejackman
Member
Fine. I went to the link you posted. It has nothing to do with us.
How do the new connectivity options impact current Tesla owners?
All Tesla cars ordered on or before June 30, 2018 will continue to have access to their existing Premium Connectivity features at no cost for as long as the car is active. As additional apps and services become available in the future, owners will have the opportunity to upgrade their connectivity plan.
Dude. Bro. Lady. Ma'm. Whatever. You want V8. That's cool, install V8 and use your phone for Google Maps or Waze or whatever. IDK. Just stop complaining about Tesla doing exactly what they should do and what any of us would do if we were them. Why in the hell would they not force update the fleet of 2 ton moving projectiles with (in their analysis) safer software. I'm just so tired of arguing over something that so clearly makes sense. Pretty please, with a cherry on top, stop.
Yes, I honestly believe that. I know it to be true. I know what I agreed to. My binding contracts with them are in writing. I'm sure reporting it to the FBI would be about as effective as reporting them for the software (GPL) licenses they continue to violate. (Talk about not holding up one end of an agreement!)
Anyway, I understand what you're saying even if I don't 100% agree. It's reasonable. I think I'm done with the discussion since I don't have anything else to say, really. Cheers!
I’m sorry, no disrespect intended, but your comment makes absolutely no sense to me. You indicated your arguments are based on TOS. My point is that not everyone (at least me and likely many early purchasers) never had any TOS as part of the car buying process and hence could not agree (affirmatively or passively) to any such TOS regarding software updates. As a lawyer with almost 40 years of practice, the TOS you refer to would be unenforceable against such persons where it was not a part of the purchase process or agreed to at a later date.
In any event, you feel the OP (and possibly others) are adamant about not wanting Tesla to issue updates or for him (them) to accept such updates. I believe that is incorrect. The OP only asked for notice so he would be informed that a forced update was going to be installed. He does not want surprises. That seems reasonable to me.
As for me, I ask that an update not “break” critical elements of the car. To me and many others, that means selecting a foreground color/font that is easily readable against a selected background color. Tesla had this correct with versions 6 and 7, but “broke” it starting with version 8. Based on your comments, it sounds like you have no problems reading the screens. At some point your eyesight will change and you will know the difficulties the aging process brings with respect to reading the screens. As much as I like the car and could never go back to an ICE vehicle (I am also a stockholder) I refuse to buy a new one because the only thing I can clearly read on the two screens now with a quick (eg, fraction of a second) glance is the digital representation of the speed of travel. I can no longer read the navigation directions, the distance and time to a destination, etc without spending an inordinate amount of time staring at the screens, and that’s a serious safety issue. The general population in the US, Japan and other countries is getting older and this issue will only get worse over time, especially when the UI is being designed by “youngsters” that have no comprehension of the specific needs of the aging population. I’m not the only person with this specific complaint. There was a long thread in TMC years ago on this very issue when version 8 was released.
I think we can agree that almost everyone (if not everyone) on TMC appreciates features that have been added via the various updates, whether such features are safety related (such as reducing risk of a fire) or convenience (such as increasing Supercharging speed).
sublimejackman
Member
I truly empathize with your inability to clearly read the screen. For me, the aging process has brought about a form of arthritis that impacts people in their 30s. I do not want to discount you or anyone else in my analysis. I (as I have stated multiple times before and during this post) have huge problems with Tesla software in general. My point is that Tesla provides a service to us. As existing owners, we are provided every day with navigation updates, software updates, real time traffic and reading Gmail; all done at an expense to Tesla. This expense is regardless of stock holdings or even of the money we spent when purchased the car. It is done because Tesla wants to promote a safe and cutting edge brand. Nothing more and nothing less. I can't imagine anyone with the task of managing a 500k car fleet and with the power to update that fleet at any moment, not taking every opportunity to do so. Anyone can opt out and thousands have, maybe not by swiping an icon or some other very easy method, but it is possible. So in the end (and this is my last post on this subject) if you want V8 (a version that the manufacturer has deemed less safe and deprecated) then more power to you.
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Since you seem to think you're such a great legal mind, show me in my 2016 contract where unlimited supercharging can be taken away for any reason at any time is, and where the software Terms of Service are, and where I agreed to any of the BS your stating. The blind ignorance is stunning, it comes from not knowing what your talking about.
Since you seem to think you're such a great legal mind, show me in my 2016 contract where unlimited supercharging can be taken away for any reason at any time is, and where the software Terms of Service are, and where I agreed to any of the BS your stating. The blind ignorance is stunning, it comes from not knowing what your talking about.
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Brass Guy
Active Member
They might deem it safer, but it absolutely is less safe - for pre AP cars at the very least.
Ah, I see the problem now. You just aren’t reading my posts.
I said in post #1 that I don’t want to pester Tesla for a rollback (or anyone else). I am happy to move forward with V9 in the name of progress and fart mode. I may not like it as much as V8,7,6, but I’ve stated CLEARLY that I am not downgrading.
I simply want a clear and stated policy on firmware updates and sunsetting older FW versions. Because forcing unannounced and unscheduled updates on people is not the way to engender your loyal customer base.
“Transparency” has never been a word in the Tesla HQ hive mind. We, as their loyal customers and shareholders, need to demand that it is.
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One of the key things I've complained about with Tesla from day one is the "black box" style software updates.
Car says there's an update. Okay great... what is it? What's it change? Is it a security update I should be concerned with an install right away? Is it going to make my user experience better/worse/whatever? Nope, we don't even know what version is staged on the car for install, let alone what's changed, before actually finishing the install.
This is almost the equivalent of a doctor telling you, "Here, take these." "What are they?" "Don't worry about it, you just have to take them." ... Not sure I'd be cool with that.
I do find it amusing they've added not updating the car as an excuse to void the warranty. Would love to see how that particular clause goes over in court one day.
At the end of the day, v9 is Tesla's merging the Model 3 and S/X UIs... and a bunch of what the Model 3 is lacking poured over on to S/X, and they don't really care.
Keep in mind, unless you're leasing or driving a loaner, it is your car... not Tesla's. Maybe Tesla will figure that out one day. Probably not, but can hope.
Car says there's an update. Okay great... what is it? What's it change? Is it a security update I should be concerned with an install right away? Is it going to make my user experience better/worse/whatever? Nope, we don't even know what version is staged on the car for install, let alone what's changed, before actually finishing the install.
This is almost the equivalent of a doctor telling you, "Here, take these." "What are they?" "Don't worry about it, you just have to take them." ... Not sure I'd be cool with that.
I do find it amusing they've added not updating the car as an excuse to void the warranty. Would love to see how that particular clause goes over in court one day.
At the end of the day, v9 is Tesla's merging the Model 3 and S/X UIs... and a bunch of what the Model 3 is lacking poured over on to S/X, and they don't really care.
Keep in mind, unless you're leasing or driving a loaner, it is your car... not Tesla's. Maybe Tesla will figure that out one day. Probably not, but can hope.
Please note, I did say "sane and reasonable". Elon I'm sure is a driver in many of the changes for V9 in MS/MX. He is a brilliant engineer and visionary. UI/UX designer he is not (even though he thinks he is). And I've seen Franz wear glasses quite a bit to correct his vision.
I bought my second Tesla used.
Please show me where I agreed to allow Tesla to modifying MY CAR/MY PROPERTY without my consent? Or without even a warning or notice?
I'll wait.
Bobasaurus
Member
Sell it? You seem very upset. What if they did not update and your car spontaneously Singapore's up?
Let me briefly point out that there is no update that's "fixed" battery fires... because there isn't really anything that needs fixing here. They've tweaked the BMS active thermal limits in recent updates, but they do this 5x per year or more as it is, so nothing new. v6.0 is just as "safe" as v9.0 in that regard. I'd actually argue that the thermal limits allowed in the latest v9 are looser than those in v6,7,8 and thus arguably less safe... but, not really the case since it's just an ongoing evolution and changes based on years of real world data.
I'd buy an even better Raven Performance Model S with the insurance.
Not sure what your point is.
