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Tesla needs to refresh the Model S, asap.
- Thread starter AMPd
- Start date
Supercharging speed is about air temp mostly (entirely probably).
Since we don't have access to battery temps, we need a controlled experiment. S and 3 parked in a 50 degree garage overnight that go together to a close supercharger and plug in.
I don't think most buyers are on the forums and know about the 2170 cell issue. I could be wrong. The S style is a bit long in the tooth but still an eye catcher. Outside of CA, it still is unique enough that it doesn't need a refresh.
What is to be expected. Sales in CA will decline without a refresh. But the increased awareness everywhere else may actually keep sales reasonably flat. There are also buyers that are "style" conscious and those that aren't. A new exterior would not flick my demand lever one bit but it would for my colleague who got rid of his 2014 P85+ at the 3 year guarantee because it wasn't "fresh" anymore. He must have the latest, greatest.
I wouldn't buy right now because I would hate to miss a major refresh. But not in market anyway no matter what (barring a car accident). And I am a forum reader --- not average customer.
Since we don't have access to battery temps, we need a controlled experiment. S and 3 parked in a 50 degree garage overnight that go together to a close supercharger and plug in.
I don't think most buyers are on the forums and know about the 2170 cell issue. I could be wrong. The S style is a bit long in the tooth but still an eye catcher. Outside of CA, it still is unique enough that it doesn't need a refresh.
What is to be expected. Sales in CA will decline without a refresh. But the increased awareness everywhere else may actually keep sales reasonably flat. There are also buyers that are "style" conscious and those that aren't. A new exterior would not flick my demand lever one bit but it would for my colleague who got rid of his 2014 P85+ at the 3 year guarantee because it wasn't "fresh" anymore. He must have the latest, greatest.
I wouldn't buy right now because I would hate to miss a major refresh. But not in market anyway no matter what (barring a car accident). And I am a forum reader --- not average customer.
whitex
Well-Known Member
Battery is not going to have any impact on your drive today. No 2170 battery sounds like an excuse. Not sure if you're lying to yourself or just to the world, but I'm sure you'll find another excuse even if the Model S moves to new batteries. If 2170 was your top priority, you'd have a Model 3 today.
ucmndd
Well-Known Member
With the battery at full operating temp no doubt. It’s the battery temp that matters, not the ambient.
Tic-tac-toe
Member
The ambient temp is not as important as the pack temp. Wha't important is what was you pack temp prior to the SC, were you driving hard, long, or did you charge before. I would bet your pack was not even close to that temp.
Range is my top priority. 2170 cells would increase the range. I have a Model X so not sure what all the BS about excuses is. Tesla needs to update the range ASAP, bottom line.
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I don't think many people asking for an interior "update" necessarily want the Spartan Model 3 interior. They like the Model S minimalist interior but would like it to be more premium. For example, most cars in this price range have 4 zone climate control with the rear passengers being able to control their own climate and heated seats.
reddy
Active Member
Count me as one who will upgrade only after a compelling reason emerges. Such as 400 mile range, better autopilot, or exterior redesign. For now my 2013 is holding up great and I'll keep it until we have another quantum leap.
Those disagreeing with me on this, can you explain why?
What benefit has tesla received by spending money on R&D for a product that’s difficult to sell?
Tesla has a history of overpromising and under delivering, the semi is for businesses and a business is not as likely to accept that.
1- There are currently no superchargers a semi truck can use easily without disconnecting the trailer.
2- supercharging price, tesla guaranteed low prices but as we see that’s not the case unless tesla subsidizes the cost, and how long would they do that? Again, money pit
3- No one is going to buy that truck for long haul without a complete supercharger network, again COMPLETE 100% of US covered. Companies won’t be happy refusing good paying freight to locations because the truck can’t get there. Which means tesla has to spend way more money than they already spent on the current network in order to sell to that customer base.
My brother owns a trucking company and I tried selling him on the semi. His response, not until the truck can reach every corner of the US.
I firmly believe tesla should have perfected the personal automobile business before getting into commercial vehicles.
Rather than trying their hand at everything at once and failing in the process.
I disagree that the semi development is a mistake.
I think it could already be useful for operators on a point-to-point service, where the charging could be done at the endpoints.
I think it's mandatory for reducing fossil fuel emissions.
I agree that it might not make economic sense yet, but if no one ever takes it up, it never will. There are advantages to being a first mover.
There are certainly customers who believe in it. Walmart ordered 30.
I think it could already be useful for operators on a point-to-point service, where the charging could be done at the endpoints.
I think it's mandatory for reducing fossil fuel emissions.
I agree that it might not make economic sense yet, but if no one ever takes it up, it never will. There are advantages to being a first mover.
There are certainly customers who believe in it. Walmart ordered 30.
I was saying it’s a mistake to enter that market right now, they should have waited until the company was more stable with steady profit.
Walmart ordering 30 is a PR move more than anything.
The semi as is will be great for some local work. Not all but some.
It definitely won’t work for our company as our local trucks run on a 24 hour cycle. 3 shifts keep the truck running.
And I’m sure we’re not alone, but I’m sure there are carriers who will buy it because their trucks have the necessary down time needed to charge the truck.
whitex
Well-Known Member
If range was your top priority, you would have bought a Model S and not Model X. You are obviously not interested in the Model S, so stating you're not dropping a penny on a Model S until they switch to 2170 batteries is neither here or there. Not to mention that switching to the 2170 might not give the Model S any more range, Tesla may simply keep the range the same and lower the price.
Uncle Paul
Well-Known Member
Tesla Semi is not initially being developed for the long haul market. It is designed for short hauls, especially in congested areas. Mostly will be charged up while they are loading or unloading. Probably with 2 or more chargers plugged into the same truck. Benefits are less pollution, lower fuel costs, quieter, autopilot, better performance, easier to drive, especially in slower traffic. Regional trucks will go electic first. It is only a matter of time before the cities will ban Diesels from their city centers. Most of the buses in many cities have been converted to Natural gas or clean Propane.
The long haul buyers will need to wait for battery and charging technology to advance. Many Diesel operators drive in pairs, and can go coast to coast with minimal refueling stops. Pollution is not as big a problem in the wide open spaces, but in the cities Diesel trucks are despised by all.
The long haul buyers will need to wait for battery and charging technology to advance. Many Diesel operators drive in pairs, and can go coast to coast with minimal refueling stops. Pollution is not as big a problem in the wide open spaces, but in the cities Diesel trucks are despised by all.
The money they (tesla) poured into the semi would have better been spent bringing the model Y to market.
Once they are established and are operating their factories on autopilot (pun intended) they can branch out and take on the commercial vehicle market.
Also “charged while loading or unloading” many large companies that ordered the truck don’t have their drivers wait to get loaded or unloaded.
They simply arrive, drop loaded trailer, grab empty trailer and keep going.
I’m in the business and I don’t know of any large company that has their drivers wait to unload or load at their terminals. That’s highly inefficient.
I don't think anyone is advocating for the autonomous taxi interior that the 3 has. You're right, that would be a deal breaker if Tesla went with that trash.
JoRey
Current Volt Owner, Aspiring Model III Owner
I wonder how much the driving dynamics could improve if Tesla made a 100kwh pack with the new 2070 cells? I mean the Model S is a bit of a energy hog and updating the electric motors could yield significant efficiency gains.
Wal-Mart ordering 30 isn't even a rounding error on their balance sheet. Sales last year were half of a Trillion, although net income was down to 10 billion.
Exactly. And I think this is what's coming soon, plus a couple of other things:
- Dual charge ports
- Minor sheet metal work to make the car visibly different from current production.
- Additional sheet metal work to differentiate the P1XXD from the 1XXD
Tesla has been outstanding at predicting and influencing future interior design language. The current S/X interior seemed wildly spartan compared to the "sea of buttons" that existed in all premium cars when it came out. And slowly other cars are all moving that way - from physical buttons to touch screens, and much simpler looking interiors.
Similarly, the low dash, enormous visibility is an extension of that. I'm betting that's how all cars are going to go in the next decade. I also expect we'll see more HUDs.
