Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[2daMoon]

Yeah Duffer, the mental monopoly of "design all cars to consume repair parts" may finally be as obsolete as ICE.

 

[vikings123]

Thanks, I was just reading this one: https://www.nasdaqtrader.com/content/productsservices/trading/crosses/openclose_faqs.pdf

TBH it reads like some of the grimoires I was interested in as a teenager...

Edit: so you still need sell orders of 120m shares to be placed, there's nothing "pre-arranged" per-se, but the orders can be placed with an order type to execute at the closing price, which obviously wouldn't shift the SP.

After that, normal AH trading begins and then it's up to the seller to decide whether they want to sell at the closing price or not, and then up to the indexes whether they want to chase that up, or take their chances waiting until the same event occurs at open on Monday.

Meh, it's too complex...

Yeah this thing is way too complicated. If there is a sell side imbalance we drop? And vice versa. That makes sense but I’m confused as to why these sellers will suddenly show up at closing hours and basically just hand them over to the index funds at the closing price.

Oh boy I hope S&P knows what they are doing. I think they probably have a fair idea as to how this is going to turn out. BTW here’s a video if you want to waste ten minutes of your life.

Edit: we need a new button dedicated to S&P inclusion: Confused.

 

[dww12]

Well, technically the stock is up $200 from when SP&500 was announced. That's nothing to sniff at.

Right, not complaining.

 

[lafrisbee]

That’s a cheap one. They come with remote controls now; heated seats, water temp adjustment, lights, timers, blowers, personal settings etc..

I want a camera, joystick and First person Shooter Game Software.

 

[2daMoon]

This one comes with a cat! Warm and fluffy.

Way better

You can use the cat to dry with, right?

 

[lafrisbee]

From a MikeMP3 post:
"This is part of why the closing cross is around. Everyone can put their orders in for a trade at the close and if there is an imbalance between the buys and sells the price will get adjusted to encourage other people to come in and balance the trade."

Why do sellers take part in a closing cross event?

 

[Runarbt]

I want a camera, joystick and First person Shooter Game Software.

A camera and a joystick to play with, while on the bidet?
I bet want to, you dirty you. onlyfans?

 

[lafrisbee]

You can use the cat to dry with, right?

 

[lafrisbee]

You want to know who is The God of Wall Street?
Find the guy that got to decide Closing Cross would be $622.

 

[vikings123]

From a MikeMP3 post:
"This is part of why the closing cross is around. Everyone can put their orders in for a trade at the close and if there is an imbalance between the buys and sells the price will get adjusted to encourage other people to come in and balance the trade."

Why do sellers take part in a closing cross event?

I think the theory is that there will be enough liquidity because of quarterly rebalancing. Maybe S&P has some insights into how much rebalancing other institutions are likely do to based on historical data. I still think something crazy can still happen, all this low volume trading is telling me people are not sure and will likely reevaluate based on what the closing cross will reveal. Anybody agree with this?

“There's a widely held belief in financial circles that hedge funds, pension funds, and insurance companies always rebalance their portfolios at the end of each quarter. While no proof or evidence has ever been put forward to confirm this practice or its prevalence, the very idea reinforces the concept that the end of a quarter is significant.”

What Does the End of the Quarter Mean for Portfolio Management?

 

[Drumheller]

The empty bottles are selling on ebay for over $1200 bucks

OT:

I ordered two bottles and am willing to sell one (unopened), though I do intend to mark it up. I'd prefer to interact with someone local, in Arizona. If anyone is interested, send me a direct message.

 

[StealthP3D]

Watch these index funds magically have the shares they need while tsla is reporting record low volume days with share price dropping throughout the entire 6 trading days. That will be one of the biggest FUs to option gamblers ever. Guess selling calls and puts are the way to go as you are the house, not the gambler.

The house is ALWAYS the house. They get their guaranteed cut whether you are writing the contracts or buying them. The individual is ALWAYS the gambler.

 

[dl003]

From a MikeMP3 post:
"This is part of why the closing cross is around. Everyone can put their orders in for a trade at the close and if there is an imbalance between the buys and sells the price will get adjusted to encourage other people to come in and balance the trade."

Why do sellers take part in a closing cross event?

Game Theory. Sellers don't trust other sellers to hold out and so they all try to unload their shares at a price they can live with before the forced buying event ends. If the equilibrium price is higher than the closing price we will go up and vice versa. And I can't stress this enough: next week is the week before Christmas. Anyone expecting a bidding war before WS goes on vacation will likely be disappointed.

 

[corduroy]

You want to know who is The God of Wall Street?
Find the guy that got to decide Closing Cross would be $622.

I think that would be this guy

 

[adiggs]

I am with you.
So what seller in his right mind would not sell during the day instead of wait around and maybe get to sell at the closing cross price?
I can understand how buyers like to buy at a closing cross but not sellers. Anyone able to explain the sense for them to participate?

One reason I can see - it provides sellers an opportunity to transact a bunch of shares at a known price without moving the market a lot (the market moves an reaction to all of the simultaneous big moves.

Mostly, I expect market makers to show up with incremental shares to help the closing / opening crosses subject to their own share needs, and enabling their task of enabling the market to function.


But that's for more typical crosses in the <1M range. I've not even known about this mechanism until this week (like most of us I think), but seems unlikely for >100M shares to trade hands on Friday using this mechanism. But that's not based on actual knowledge or experience on my part.

 

[ZeApelido]

That’s a cheap one. They come with remote controls now; heated seats, water temp adjustment, lights, timers, blowers, personal settings etc..

 

[lafrisbee]

Game Theory. Sellers don't trust other sellers to hold out and so they all try to unload their shares at a price they can live with before the forced buying event ends. If the equilibrium price is higher than the closing price we will go up and vice versa. And I can't stress this enough: next week is the week before Christmas. Anyone expecting a bidding war before WS goes on vacation will likely be disappointed.

If that is the real answer then I still don't understand greed...or closing cross

 

[ZeApelido]

Well, technically the stock is up $200 from when SP&500 was announced. That's nothing to sniff at.

If someone told me last year at ~ $350 that in a year TSLA went from $2000 to $3000 just on S&P announcement, I'd doubt I would be disappointed it didn't spike to $4000 too.

 

[Nocturnal]

If that is the real answer then I still don't understand greed...or closing cross

I'm still trying to figure out how a quadruple Witcher comes into play and if I should toss him a coin or 4.

 

[lafrisbee]

One reason I can see - it provides sellers an opportunity to transact a bunch of shares at a known price without moving the market a lot (the market moves an reaction to all of the simultaneous big moves.

Mostly, I expect market makers to show up with incremental shares to help the closing / opening crosses subject to their own share needs, and enabling their task of enabling the market to function.


But that's for more typical crosses in the <1M range. I've not even known about this mechanism until this week (like most of us I think), but seems unlikely for >100M shares to trade hands on Friday using this mechanism. But that's not based on actual knowledge or experience on my part.

So who sells shares and doesn't want to have the price go up while they do it?

EDIT: That sounds like a rancher taking cattle to the auction and he stops the auctioneer when he feels the price is honest. And then sells all the other cattle he brought to the auction for the same price.
I know some not so bright cowboys, but none that "not so bright."