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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

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Lip service and press events barely mean anything, insulting though they may be.

If the US Govt and current executive branch actually hated Tesla, then the BBB bill would have a cap on the number of credits that can be applied to vehicles from each manufacturer, like the last EV tax credit that was capped at 200k. It is obvious to everyone that Tesla will be responsible for the majority of EV volume in America for the foreseeable future, if not forever. In its current form even the biased tax credit proposal would funnel the majority of the money to Tesla -- probably more than everyone else combined.

Furthermore, the UAW donated a grand total of $9 million to political campaigns, lobbying and PACs in 2020. This is a tiny drop in the bucket in American politics. The winner of the 2020 presidential election alone had raised $1 billion in direct campaign contributions; I think it's safe to say he could lose UAW's donations without blinking.

What no US politician can afford, especially a 1st-term President seeking reelection, is losing Michigan, Ohio and Georgia, which are three populous swing States with a heavy concentration of automotive manufacturing jobs. Moreover, no Democratic politician can afford to give the image of not being supportive of unions even when they know that proposed Union benefits are unlikely to actually pass Congress.

Ultimately, this circus is rooted in this country's long history of slavery and the first-mover disadvantages of being the world's earliest modern democracy. (France formed a similar democracy just a few years later, but they were different in the sense of having a long national identity, rather than being a loose collection of former English colonies trying to figure out what they wanted to be when they grew up.) In the Constitutional Convention held in the 1787 there was lengthy debate about how to elect the President. They also struggled to agree over how many slaves to count in population determinations, because the Southern States with slaves did not want them to be allowed to vote but did want them to be counted to increase their power, so they opposed a national popular vote. Also, the fledgling nation had recently fought off a tyrannical monarch and had to guess about the best way to prevent that from happening again. They did not have the advantage of modern game theory and political science to tell them that their Electoral College compromise was a terrible plan. Two and a half centuries later we are still stuck with this crap, and it leads to all sorts of silly nationally (and internationally) unpopular support for swing States.

The only thing that is surprising to me about this situation is that there is not more support for what is soon to be the largest and best paying manufacturing employer in Texas, considering that Texas is trending to become a swing State right around the same time Tesla begins producing at a annual rate of 10 million cars and a couple hundred gigawatt-hours of batteries.

 
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Patience, Grasshopper.

first-they-ignore-you-then-they-laugh-at-you-then-25737266.png

I think we know enough now that we can add another couple lines to this:

First they ignore you.
Then they laugh at you.
Then they fight you.
Then you win.
Then they demand your money.
Then they give credit to someone else.
 
Patience, Grasshopper.

first-they-ignore-you-then-they-laugh-at-you-then-25737266.png
First they ignore you. Then they ridicule you. And then they attack you and want to burn you. And then they- HEY! MY HUBCAPS ARE ALL GONE! ALL THEY REALLY DID IS THEY SOLE MY HUBCAPS! WHERE'S MY MONUMENT??

Also, it's REALLY easy to hit "Post" too soon and make a fool out of yourself before you finish editing you post! Whew.
 
  • Funny
Reactions: MikkoJ and SOULPEDL
I saw it in Teslarati


One of the worst articles on that site in the past year, and there have been some doozies. I was going to write a detailed take-down in a comment, then just deleted their RSS feed instead. Fixed. :p
 
In my over twenty years living here, I've never stopped at a Buc-ees. I guess I'll have to try them once the Superchargers are opened.
We had to stop a few weeks ago after my wife spotted their billboard near Daytona: "There's a beaver in your future". 😂
She is now Buc-cee fan, and she got so excited when I told her about the Superchargers coming.
 
In its current form even the biased tax credit proposal would funnel the majority of the money to Tesla

I don't see this as being the major issue with the proposed EV tax credit/rebate. The REAL problem is it enshines in Law the ill-conceived notion that plug-in hybrids are EVs and deserve the same credit as a full BEV.

So a factory which cranks out 6,500 lb hybrid pickup trucks with V8 gas engine and a token 17 KWh battery (which is never plugged in to recharge) gets 10 years of life-support, and the oil companies get 10 more years of trillion dollar subsidies.

That's the problem that I see. The EV credit in 'BBB' doesn't fix that problem, it perpetuates it. And mostly because both Detroit and Washington know that they are INCAPABLE of producing batteries at the scale required. Too many special interests with their fingers in the pie to expect otherwise, sadly.

In more positive news, Tesla forsaw this problem in 2016 with Giga Nevada. Cybertruck will CRUSH their U.S. ICE competitors simply by being better, cheaper, stronger, and faster in every measurable way. Its all inevitable now, just following the secret master plan...

Cheers!
 
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Political effects on TSLA leading to tangible consequences... I think it is On Topic to suggest to lower level officeholders, candidates, and others in the current president's party -how badly and blatantly this (his ludicrous Mary Barra video, and his party's pro-union (imagine how GM and Ford's dealers and other legacy auto related businesses owners feel about pandering to the unions they have to try to keep at bay!) hurts lower level elections like in Virginia- (huge loss for the party); I'm planning to contact many of them.

TL;DR??

Somebody WE better WAKE THIS GUY AND HIS PARTY UP RIGHT NOW!

Or at least try to. Those in his party who just lost should be at least a bit open to education and reflection.
I am still hanging on to the idea that the current admins blatant deception is really towards GM and Ford and the UAW to drag them into the future instead of allowing them to keep up the resistance against the electrification because if they don't figure this out quickly, they will be a huge burden on the fiscal budget with the bailout that will be necessary to prevent a complete meltdown and massive layoffs that will go deep into their supply chain as well. Japan is going to reel from this in a few years.

So who is buying calls for after 12/9
 
We had to stop a few weeks ago after my wife spotted their billboard near Daytona: "There's a beaver in your future". 😂
She is now Buc-cee fan, and she got so excited when I told her about the Superchargers coming.
Wow, news to me and there are many but nothing southwest.
Key question, do they supply squeegees for EV charging? This is a serious problem. Guilt sets in when I borrow one from a "pump." Now commercials are making fun of "No gassy, no squeegee." Perhaps Tesla can come up with a squeegee kit you hook up to your windshield washer... or something!!! No really, this is bugging me. :mad:
 
This is my first post on the Roundtable. (Hope I don't blow it.) Have appreciated many of the insights from you guys as I learn the ins and outs of $TSLA investing. I am by default a HODLer and show no signs of changing now, although my GOODNESS I had no idea how hard HODLing can be when the company adds more valuation than ever added in the history of companies in a span of 12 days.
I think what is lost in all the -deserved- complaining about GM getting -undeserved- praise is that this is a win for the Mission. We (earthlings, not just Tesla investors) need many more factories making EV's; Tesla can't build them all. We need multiple form factors that hit multiple market segments with multiple features, if possible built on-site on multiple continents. Tesla cannot build out all that as fast as we earthlings need. Tesla has done a great job of picking popular segments and found appropriate pricing sweet spots as well as pushing manufacturing technology, but we need to hit all the segments and sweet spots and we need to do so NOW.
Let Tesla continue to blaze the trails and let the other guys widen them into roads behind Tesla. We investors will profit and the Mission will advance.
 
I am still hanging on to the idea that the current admins blatant deception is really towards GM and Ford and the UAW to drag them into the future instead of allowing them to keep up the resistance against the electrification because if they don't figure this out quickly, they will be a huge burden on the fiscal budget with the bailout that will be necessary to prevent a complete meltdown and massive layoffs that will go deep into their supply chain as well. Japan is going to reel from this in a few years.
If you kid is failing Math you don't tell them that they are the #1 math wiz in the world.
 
When I do the math I don't get anywhere near that- the cells are ~3lbs each, there's 576 of em, so 1728 pounds... I find it hard to believe the physical empty pack itself with whatever HW is part of it DOUBLES the the weight from just the cells.

My guess? 3 pounds is probably rounding down (it’s probably like 3.4 pounds per cell), and since they’re pouches, it may not count things as part of the “cell” that are counted in cylindrical cells. Traditional OEMs have played slimy games like this with curb weights forever (like not counting the weights of any fluid whatsoever).

135wh/kg for the hummer battery at the pack level is similar to what the Jaguar I-Pace achieved, so it’s not without precedent. It complete garbage of course compared to the 300+ (Net of structural benefits) that the structural 4680 packs will probably get.
 
For TSLA only? He already said he can use the ML online trading platform to sell CCs for other stocks, but NOT for TSLA.

quote-keep-an-open-mind-but-not-so-open-your-brain-falls-out-robert-low-73-9-0953.jpg

the way i took it, them also not allowing him
to sell stock could have indicated a market data issue. it happens. brokerages connect to exchanges ticker farms alphabetically (at least that used to be one configuration i’ve seen). sometimes you lose NYSE or Nasdaq tickers A-L or N-Z etc. just a thought
 
Ok, another data point. I can sell calls on any other security I own in that account, just not TSLA. I just bought more calls. Not advice but I think shorts going to get super wrkd. If I have a chance later today I’ll call the brokerage and ask why. ha ha.
So what they are saying is their “new system” thought I was writing a spread and that I am not approved for spreads. Need Lvl 4.
 
Is there a source for this?

When I do the math I don't get anywhere near that- the cells are ~3lbs each, there's 576 of em, so 1728 pounds... I find it hard to believe the physical empty pack itself with whatever HW is part of it DOUBLES the the weight from just the cells.
I got the 3000 pound number from the tour NBC did of the factory where I snagged that screen shot. I’m not sure where 3600 pounds is from.
 
Wow, news to me and there are many but nothing southwest.
Key question, do they supply squeegees for EV charging? This is a serious problem. Guilt sets in when I borrow one from a "pump." Now commercials are making fun of "No gassy, no squeegee." Perhaps Tesla can come up with a squeegee kit you hook up to your windshield washer... or something!!! No really, this is bugging me. :mad:
Lasers.
 
I don't see this as being the major issue with the proposed EV tax credit/rebate. The REAL problem is it enshines in Law the ill-conceived notion that plug-in hybrids are EVs and deserve the same credit as a full BEV.

So a 6,500 lb hybrid pickup truck with a V8 gas engine and a 17 KWh battery (that almost no owners ever plug in to recharge) gets 10 years of life-support, while the oil companies continue to rake in trillion dollar subsidies.


This is not accurate.

$3500 of the total available credit requires a battery of 40 kwh or more (goes up to 50 kwh in 2026).

If your argument is more of the credit ought move from the general base value to the large BEV only section I wouldn't disagree. But they don't get the "same" credit, not by thousands of dollars worth.