Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

This site may earn commission on affiliate links.
Downvotes are a good key for deciphering whose who. For ex. a post that gets all upvotes and the same two guys down voting every time... it's good to see whose who, ya know?
Absolutely the best way to quickly separate the irrelevant from the sincere.

Those who consistently Disagree and do not offer a rebuttal are likely reacting emotionally rather than responding rationally. After earning such distinction their half-hearted clicks upon the thumbs-down can easily be filtered out with the rest of the noise.
 
That was at the end of 2021 so different tax year?
Some losses can be carried forward to future tax years, but I don’t know about losses derived from charitable giving to a foundation. Any CPAs in the house? Also, the stock he transferred over presumably had a very low tax basis, so maybe the 2021 tax loss wasn’t that high anyways. Again, I don’t know what I’m talking about.
 
If I were Elon, given the commentary here and elsewhere over the last weeks and months from folks of whom I would have expected better, I would just say "Bite me humans" and head back to my home planet.

Seriously, look at all that Elon has done across decades to create actual products that help solve dire problems. And folks whine and complain with scarce a scrap of perspective much less—dare I say?—gratitude.

Worse some of you lionize folks like “Uncle Leo" and other speculators (yes, I include you options traders) who somehow equate speculation as being supportive like shareholding when the opposite is true, who bawl for a buyout to bail them out of their bad trades, and, worse, who think buying shares is giving money to Elon—when in fact it is Elon, Tesla employees, and their customers who have created that wealth in building a great company.

I, for one, thank Elon and all the employees and customers of all his companies, even the recently acquired one. Please keep up the good work.

I wish all here Happy Holidays. I also encourage some of you here take good look at some of your recent posts as well as a hard look in the mirror and consider whether you might learn something from the spirit of the season.
I have friends who bought in the 300s and 200s before Elon dumped his shares on them. Young people in South Korea are investing their life savings in TSLA because they believe in the company. My uncle, who is near retirement age, bought TSLA in the 250s. I think you'll have a hard time finding gratitude there. I've been poor and I've been not so poor and let me tell you this: you wouldn't be criticizing us for criticizing him if it was you who lost a butt load of money picking the right company. That's the part that hurts the most. You do your homework and take the risk and the company delivers but somehow you're poorer than before and it's not because the market is irrational but because the CEO is dumping his shares like there's no tomorrow.

The definition of a a speculator is not someone who uses derivatives to take ownership in a company but one who is in it purely for financial gain. AFAIK, KoGuan Leo never sold TSLA or its derivatives for gains. He bought all the way down from 350 and is still holding with us. I could care less if he bought shares or calls as long as he doesn't flip them for profit. Maybe his risk management was inadequate but he's still in it with us and i find it disgusting that some posters here were cheering for him getting margin called.
 
Last edited:
I've gone on record as saying I don't think Tesla is buying back TSLA this quarter. Even with the stock price where it is, and the additional 1% tax that could be saved by buying back in 2022 versus 2023, I think it was going to be too tight to start a buyback until 2023.

But just like price action and volume the last three days were indications of Elon possibly selling, today's price action and especially volume are to me indications that MAYBE the buyback has started.

Whereas before, I would put the odds of a buyback in 2022 at less than 5%, I am now thinking more like a 20% probability.

I agree. The relative strength is noteworthy.
 
If it is company specific, possibly.

Would have to prove that EM sold because Tesla was failing. Don’t see how Q4 will be anything less than tepid, which will not qualify, especially since EM can easily point to TWTR issues for sale.

And honestly, I think Q4 will be a record. By far.
I’m going to discuss my favorite bogeyman and have you tell me in what way it differs from what you wrote:

“Trevor Milton didn’t sell Nikola shares because he knew his fraudulent house of cards was going to be tumbling. He sold because he needed cash for that mega ranch in Heber City.”
 
But Elon is a student of history, and I'm sure the "Henry Ford" gambit occurred to him when the SEC was suing him in Oct 2018 for unfounded reasons they knew were bullshit, but banks had Elon over a barrel. I think that experience more than anything has affected the way Elon views banks, and debt.

That’s probably why Elon has gone away from borrowing against Tesla stock and instead is using no debt. It eliminates the real risk of Wall Street hedge funds from ganging up on TSLA stock to force margin sales. He lived through that BS once with Solarcity…
 
Wish the FUD was nipped in the bud last week. (they tried).
To do that they should send a longer reply directly to Reuters. When the story says multiple things and you just call it wrong - nobody knows which part is wrong.

BTW, last quarter (?) there was a rumor about price cut. Tesla denied the rumor. Guess what .... Tesla did cut the price.
 
Common sense tells us the typical non-production line TSLA employee probably doesn't cash out all (or even most of) their options-based compensation as soon as they can do so. I think if we exclude production line employees, the effect of a two-year drop in share price is a net positive to employee's net worth for the same reasons it's a net positive to an investor who is accumulating shares over time as they can afford to do so.

There does exist a probable consequence or after-effect of this drop in price that could negatively impact these employees' long term financial position in life. And that is a human tendency to become financially "shell-shocked". It's unavoidable that many employees who saw the worth of their options go to zero will come out of it with a distorted view of the long-term value of their options. Emotional pain has a way of making people wary. It's natural they will think they should sell them off before the same thing happens again. But this will probably result in leaving millions on the table.

Investors need to caution themselves from falling into the same trap. As we climb out the other side, there will be a tendency for investors who have been financially "shell-shocked" to get out at a small profit, maybe only 1.2X of their cost basis, which will provide some relief to what they are feeling but that is likely leave the bulk of their potential future gains on the table. The hunger to take profits on a portion of their shares will be overpowering for many after such a prolonged period of what they experienced emotionally as "financial pain". Many will sell with relief, even though they don't need the money or have any plan on spending it.

I have not felt much emotional or financial pain through this, so I'm not worried about myself, but I see the pain so many here are experiencing, and they will be at the greatest risk of making the most harmful financial decision of their lives. The way they will rationalize these sales will make perfect sense to them at the time, even though it will make no rational sense at all. And, as it becomes apparent that they have left huge sums on the table as Tesla continues to rise, they will feel more pain of a different sort. But they will rationalize that away as well. This rationalizing of financial mistakes has the unfortunate effect of "hardening" people to the world. They will get by, as all of us will, but it will be far from optimum and leads to a reduced sense of worth that manifests itself in other ways that are not flattering.

The way to avoid investing pitfalls that are so common because we are human is to be conscious of how emotions affect investing and guard against it. The best way is to learn how not to be emotional about things that are financial in nature in the first place. Although that is in your best interest, it's not always possible. The next best thing is an awareness and acceptance of the fact that you have been financially "shell-shocked" because that can help prevent premature selling simply by understanding the risk, how it's caused by the human brains tendency to find relief from emotionally traumatic events. Be aware that the effect is so strong that simple awareness of it may not be able to prevent you from doing it. A concerted effort to not let your guard down at any time will likely be required, a determination to succeed and not fall into known traps.

To be perfectly clear, I'm not saying people should never sell, I'm saying they shouldn't sell for emotional reasons, while justifying it with other "sensible" reasons that may only sound sensible to them at the time. Because this is how the human mind works, it can make almost anything sound sensible if it wants to. It's necessary to understand these self-protective mechanisms, to be aware of them, in order to have a fighting chance of avoiding their pitfalls.
TL;DR -- Only sell what you need for eat'n money for the next year. Keep the rest.
 
Baron's Retail Fund, owns both tlsa and SpaceX

FUN FACT: fat fingers are responsible for nearly half of all volume for Tiziana Life Science PCL

sc.tlsa.10-DayChart.Tiziana Life Sciences PCL2022-12-15.13-00.png


... and 0.82 r^2 correlation with TSLA trading. /s

Cheers!
 
Elon helping margin calls become ... a reality
Whose? His or yours?
Yeah, I feel this might be a good idea. I initially though having Elon's compensation package tied to equity was a good idea. It was based on thinking that he would be holding onto the equities. For a little while at least. "Last to sell" and all that. Boy that didn't pan out well for us investors.

Or just dump Elon. I feel that Tesla could be very successful without him at this point. He can move on to his other interests.
Nothing like joining the subset of Judases. "just dump" him

Not sure I am following, but this seems relevant:
He is a gift that keeps on giving. This really points out what worries me. There have been several wide known imposters that introduce themselves as supporters but they are not, once you look at the big picture.