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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

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We're getting far afield from the original point, which is that all HDW4 cars will be collecting data for FSD training, not just the ones with paid FSD. Tesla's ability to 'query-the-fleet' by broadcasting requests for video clips which match certain situations will vastly improve the quality of clips collected, and accelerate the march of nines. That's why Tesla plans to have v12 shadow mode running in customer cars in a few weeks.
Right. I'm not saying shadow mode is not important. It is extremely important. But it serves a different purpose from the feedback you get from disengagements.

You also need to test FSD running in the real world with real humans behind the wheel ready to take over. And you want to know how often they disengage. If they disengage less and less, that means the system is getting better.

And since the HW3 and HW4 versions of FSD are different, you want to make sure that both are performing well with regard to disengagements.
 
Plenty of L4 competitors but I can't find any credible L5 competitor. The ones who claims they are working on L5 still have yet to activate them so it's impossible to judge how well they work ...everywhere. Tesla is the only one with almost half a million cars running all over the US providing real feedback on their L5's shortcomings while mobile eye is showing video of pretty much Omar's equivalent location specific drive in their promo video and claims they have similar L5 system.

IDK about a bunch of stupid ads that just annoy everyone but some nicely chosen sponsorships could be interesting. One example that comes to mind is the Tour of Utah, which used to be sponsored by a big Toyota dealer. That got killed off by covid and never made a comeback. Something about cycle races with EV chase cars instead of athletes sucking exhaust fumes seems appealing. If nothing else you could point to some societal benefit and I'll bet it wouldn't be that expensive.
You'll be glad to know the 2023 multi day Tour of Norway UCI world tour cycling race had EV'S for every teams chase cars. It was mentioned on every broadcast I watched.
 
Same here. I plug my Leaf into a regular wall outlet instead of using the L2 charger which gets used for the Tesla. I have a hunch the trickle charge is better for the health of the Leaf's battery.
Don't buy that. We've been charging Denise's Leaf L2 since 2015. No battery issues other than the expected range reduction.
 
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With the smallish batteries the vast majority of plug-in hybrids can easily charge overnight with 120v. There is no real need for an L2. For example my RAV4 Prime takes 12 hours on 120v. And the car is almost always in the garage that much. Sure I can charge in 3.5 hours with Level 2 but who cares if the car is full by 10pm or 7am.
You definitely aren't in California. With L2 you can charge during off-peak times but L1 you must also be charging at peak time.

I see you have solar as well so for your case it probably doesn't matter. In many cases an L2 charger would be beneficial.
 
Tesla doesn't need people to buy FSD to leverage the car and hardware for training data.

FSD price always needed to include the contingency cost of a hardware upgrade. If they are confident in that no longer being a risk, they can reduce or remove that amount from the price (a form of warranty reserves).

It also covered the R&D costs of development. If the labor and compute costs (present and forward looking) are reduced along with an increase in sales, it reduces needed pricing.
In particular. 300,000 lines of C++ code being reduced to 3,000 lines means a lot of C++ developers are no longer needed for the FSD project. They can be redeployed to other areas. Offsetting this is the training hardware cost, but more hardware typically works out cheaper and more predictable than more software.
 
A long, long time ago, when I was still a teenager, my father took me aside and explained about Car Loans. (Note: This was all very much pre-computer and PC).

Case #1: One does not have money in the bank to buy a car outright, so one takes out a loan. He very carefully calculated out how much one would have to pay for that loan, complete with the car loan interest rate. At the end of that time, plus maybe a few years, one still doesn't have that much money in the bank, so one has to take out another car loan. For those not truly well-off, one gets stuck in this rat race.

Case #2: Hold off buying the car, but deposit a certain amount of money every month into an interest-bearing account. (This was back when, well, banks actually paid reasonable interest on deposits. Today, one would use a bond fund or something for the purpose.) Since one is aiming at buying a car down the road, the amount being saved becomes larger over time due to compounding interest, so the amount put away every month is substantially less than what one would have to pay for with a loan.

When enough money is accumulated, go out and buy the car. With cash. Drives the dealerships beserk; they like those loan origination fees. And the chance to diddle the loan interest rates. And, if played right, gives one a leg up on the dealer's usual machinations of trying to extract the most from a buyer.

Once one has the car: Keep on putting money aside for the next car. At the end of each cycle of this method, one has a heck of a lot more money.

I have never taken out an auto loan in, what, five decades of owning cars.

The above is, I'm sure, no surprise to anybody who hangs out on an investment forum. But it's amazing how few consumers realize how bad the rat race of buying stuff on time is.
Case #3: I walk and put my spare change in $TSLA
 
I believe you are right. Initially, Tesla was not legally allowed to attend any car shows in the state of Michigan. Something has since changed.
That's not true.
Yes. But what’s that got to do with the fact they weren’t allowed to participate in any Michigan car shows? Last I recall they weren’t allowed in 2015, 2016, 2017 etc…
They could, but didn't.
Yes, entirely not allowed by law. Not sure when the rules changed. Didn’t Tesla have a lawsuit going in that state? I haven’t been keeping up to date on all the state issues since it no longer became a question of Tesla succeeding.
Auto show attendance was never illegal.

Tesla chose not to attend after dealership law was tweaked to lock Tesla out of Michigan.
Legislation hasn't changed and you can't 'buy' a Tesla in Michigan.
However, Tesla can:
Service your car (via wholly owned subsidiary)
Deliver your car
Take your trade in
Help you order
Help you with paperwork
Help you purchase a car (where the title transfer occurs in another state)
https://www.michigan.gov/ag/-/media...n_and_Motion_for_Entry_of_Dismissal_12220.pdf
 
That's not true.

They could, but didn't.

Auto show attendance was never illegal.

Tesla chose not to attend after dealership law was tweaked to lock Tesla out of Michigan.
Legislation hasn't changed and you can't 'buy' a Tesla in Michigan.
However, Tesla can:
Service your car (via wholly owned subsidiary)
Deliver your car
Take your trade in
Help you order
Help you with paperwork
Help you purchase a car (where the title transfer occurs in another state)
https://www.michigan.gov/ag/-/media...n_and_Motion_for_Entry_of_Dismissal_12220.pdf
Basically correct, but I thought you had to be invited by the organizers. I don't think you can just show up.
 
Basically correct, but I thought you had to be invited by the organizers. I don't think you can just show up.
I thought exhibitors bought floor space on a first come first served basis, but all searches only lead to the 2023 event. We may be able to find out in a week or two...

September is so much better than January.
 
That's not true.

They could, but didn't.

Auto show attendance was never illegal.

Tesla chose not to attend after dealership law was tweaked to lock Tesla out of Michigan.
Legislation hasn't changed and you can't 'buy' a Tesla in Michigan.
However, Tesla can:
Service your car (via wholly owned subsidiary)
Deliver your car
Take your trade in
Help you order
Help you with paperwork
Help you purchase a car (where the title transfer occurs in another state)
https://www.michigan.gov/ag/-/media...n_and_Motion_for_Entry_of_Dismissal_12220.pdf
I remember it quite differently, but it was almost a decade ago so my memory may be faulty.
 
Hmmm...hope the delay isn't this long:
Tesla Mexico Production

Rob had some more details on his tesla daily show today - to add to the above, china suppliers were previously told to rapidly get factories etc setup in Mexico to supply GigaMexico ASAP, but recently have been told to “Wait” instead.

Another tesla podcaster yesterday said he has a local viewer down there who says most of the reporting/press releases from local authorities around Gigamexico have been complete BS when he has driven to the site to check out any progress.

Something is not right down there…

It is not my intention to slander, but perhaps one problematic area is there maybe is to many palms asking to be greased that is causing hesitancy from Tesla. If that is indeed happening, what guarantees that it wont be a factor for as long as the factory is operating?

Would rather Tesla build in a slow but steady country (Germany etc) when it comes to operating, rather than one that might potentially be much faster but is reliant on the whims/”happiness” of local officials.
 
Rob had some more details on his tesla daily show today - to add to the above, china suppliers were previously told to rapidly get factories etc setup in Mexico to supply GigaMexico ASAP, but recently have been told to “Wait” instead.

Another tesla podcaster yesterday said he has a local viewer down there who says most of the reporting/press releases from local authorities around Gigamexico have been complete BS when he has driven to the site to check out any progress.

Something is not right down there…

It is not my intention to slander, but perhaps one problematic area is there maybe is to many palms asking to be greased that is causing hesitancy from Tesla. If that is indeed happening, what guarantees that it wont be a factor for as long as the factory is operating?

Would rather Tesla build in a slow but steady country (Germany etc) when it comes to operating, rather than one that might potentially be much faster but is reliant on the whims/”happiness” of local officials.
Yeah could be as catastrophic as those bats almost delayed Tesla Berlin indefinitely...or could be a nothing burger like those bats being a distant memory. If bureaucracy is causing major delays, Elon usually have blasted them on X already, like what happened to his displeasure with Berlin, the FAA, and the SEC.