-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable
- Thread starter AudubonB
- Start date
If all you take issue with that it's $4.5B for his collateral and $5B is my speculation, fine because it was and I think I made that very clear in my initial post. But if I have later given impression that $5B was a hard fact, that's my mistake. Still $4.5B as collateral is significant. Even for a guy with the net worth of Elon Musk, I don't think it materially changes anything.
It was said at the time that Model S was for early adopters and there to help fund the Model 3 project.
I appreciate all the little ways Model S improved but let's be honest: the 2017 model 3 is technically superior to the 2019 Model S, even the incremental improvement now starting to ship as we speak. Model S production plateaud years ago and it is simply not a flagship worthy car for Tesla or other premium brands. In 2013 it was cute and different, now there are 100,000s of them on the road having started out a series production car. How long did it take for the browser to practically work? You know all the other examples that can be offered. To Tesla's standards, Model S is a very hard laggard. As is Model X. And Model 3 doesn't offer any sales results upside to compensate.
I'll be frank: the original S85 is my dream car. Somewhat affordable now, looks amazing especially with chrome delete. Huge frunk which the new S doesn't have. Nice hatch which for some reason the 3 doesn't have. Not the consumption of the silly SP cars. Swap the original 85 motor for a Model 3 motor and it's even better for me. The battery pack is even better than the 90's, much more resilient under repeated DC fast charging and no throttling that I'm aware of.
I know Tesla can and does do better than the S85 nowadays in most respects but the increments have diminished quickly and further apart.
Price development of the S looks favorable in light of incremental improvements but if you consider what could have been with a Model 3 like production process and drivetrain tech, it should be a $45-50K car, not $75K. A longer hood, extra screen and wider body don't add cost to justify a $40K price hike.
bdy0627
Active Member
I'm not planning to read it, but at least the title seems fair and not clickbait. My wife and I have both tried NoA numerous times and found that it does require quite a bit of driver intervention, primarily to avoid embarrassment regarding the car's decision making. It often makes poor decisions regarding optional lane changes. We find it more relaxing to just use regular AP and make lane changes by flicking the directional stick on occasion when needed.This consumer reports article on autopilot released today unfortunately is quite blatantly biased:
Tesla's Navigate on Autopilot Requires Significant Driver Intervention
While I agree with some of their gripes, the overall tone of the article is definitely biased. Seems like it's the cool thing to be biased against Tesla atm
JohnDinger
Member
This consumer reports article on autopilot released today unfortunately is quite blatantly biased:
Tesla's Navigate on Autopilot Requires Significant Driver Intervention
While I agree with some of their gripes, the overall tone of the article is definitely biased. Seems like it's the cool thing to be biased against Tesla atm
I don't think this is biased. Elon claimed that NoA would get you from the on-ramp to the off-ramp with no human intervention.
In my experience, human intervention is typical required.
bdy0627
Active Member
In 2017, Elon had borrowings of nearly $280M to banks outside of the the syndicate that underwrote the March 2017 cap raise. It's not a mere hypothetical.
I have. A few times. And I have not been off-roading. Have you ever seen cars in winter that look white from a coating of road salt/sand? That's what has covered my turn signal and backup cameras. A quick wipe with a finger is all it took but it still requires manual intervention. I've also seen AP not available due to some rain. And I'm not talking about a big downpour. This happens in light rain and road spray from cars on the highway. Now maybe the latter will be solved by hardware 3 processing speed but 2.5 has it's issues.
I could totally see Elon interviewing the guy and handing him his phone right there and then with a "tweet something funny to see what you got". At least, that's my image of what cool Elon would do.
As TSLA issues more shares and doubles its fleet in little more than a year, I can only imagine the share of individual permalongs, the kinds of people we find on this thread who admit to have ever only owned one company's shares, is diminishing.
The purchase power of the loyal permalongs can no longer fight market forces that rely on financials and management performance. Also, Model 3 owner who weren't already Model S/X owners seem less likely to make an investment similar to those before them. And simply caring much less about the companyon average, Model 3 is to a greater extent a budget consideration than S and X ever were.
Perhaps the piece of the pie not held by permalongs will gradually reduce price volatility and with it, the eagerness of large players to use TSLA as a bouncy ball that helps them expand their empires. Permalongs sitting on their shares and loyally adding more on evvery dip for a long times seemed to be a key ingredient to this wonderful deep sawtooth with reliable bandwidth.
In reality, people who take a short position tend to not stick with that position for years. If two days later they can bag 5%, they'll take it.
Tesla will need to come with something substatial to turn things around big profits quarter after quarter, products that look at least like a best effort on their part. Customer focus and hitting marks. Like a real company, not a startup.
An acquisition by Apple would be really good for TSLA in my opinion. They know product placement and making the most of what they can offer.
The purchase power of the loyal permalongs can no longer fight market forces that rely on financials and management performance. Also, Model 3 owner who weren't already Model S/X owners seem less likely to make an investment similar to those before them. And simply caring much less about the companyon average, Model 3 is to a greater extent a budget consideration than S and X ever were.
Perhaps the piece of the pie not held by permalongs will gradually reduce price volatility and with it, the eagerness of large players to use TSLA as a bouncy ball that helps them expand their empires. Permalongs sitting on their shares and loyally adding more on evvery dip for a long times seemed to be a key ingredient to this wonderful deep sawtooth with reliable bandwidth.
In reality, people who take a short position tend to not stick with that position for years. If two days later they can bag 5%, they'll take it.
Tesla will need to come with something substatial to turn things around big profits quarter after quarter, products that look at least like a best effort on their part. Customer focus and hitting marks. Like a real company, not a startup.
An acquisition by Apple would be really good for TSLA in my opinion. They know product placement and making the most of what they can offer.
OT, last post
That is reasonable, I was reacting to
Now, can the stock get back to the high 300s so the topic stays off the table?
That is reasonable, I was reacting to
which is now clear was a misstatement. I apologize for not just asking for clarification in line with your initial post.
Now, can the stock get back to the high 300s so the topic stays off the table?
JusRelax
Active Member
I specifically said that while I agree with some of the gripes, the overall tone of the article is biased. An example from the article:
"Several CR testers observed Navigate on Autopilot initiate a pass on the right on a two-lane divided highway. We checked with a law enforcement official who confirmed this is considered an “improper pass” in Connecticut and could result in a ticket."
They didn't specify that any of the their testers observed that NoA initiates a pass on the right in Connecticut.
On top of that, there is no mention of the fact that Navigate on Autopilot is a work in progress and will continue to improve in the future, and I don't think mentioned a single thing positive regarding Autopilot.
You're wrong. We have Model 3 and S. The S is a much better car. Even with the old air suspension, it drives MUCH better than a 3. I can't imagine how much better it is going to be with the new suspension. The interior of the S is much nicer as well, among other things.
if NOA is so bad why do I use it every freaken day.
NOA is not a perfect system but who is to say that the other people are perfect drivers. We as drivers make unsafe decision everyday specially on heavy traffic the car to be aggressive as well and Tesla has setting for that. That Consumer Reports article is just a opinion based article; show me data that NoA is causing more accidents. I could care less about pissing off other drivers that are flying on the lane that I am trying to change into when passing a car or the drivers that are following me too closely.
I feel like I am a better driver with AP I don't road rage as much, I drive closer to the speed limit and I haven't almost run into another car because I missed them on my blind spot.
NOA is not a perfect system but who is to say that the other people are perfect drivers. We as drivers make unsafe decision everyday specially on heavy traffic the car to be aggressive as well and Tesla has setting for that. That Consumer Reports article is just a opinion based article; show me data that NoA is causing more accidents. I could care less about pissing off other drivers that are flying on the lane that I am trying to change into when passing a car or the drivers that are following me too closely.
I feel like I am a better driver with AP I don't road rage as much, I drive closer to the speed limit and I haven't almost run into another car because I missed them on my blind spot.
That would actually be fairly crappy of him. It's like talking to a comedian and saying "hey, funny man, you do jokes, right? Say something funny!" as opposed to a proper interview. More likely to give the guy a specific situation and ask him what he can make of it, how he can spin it positively and possibly funny without being offensive.
“We enabled the feature and drove on several highways across Connecticut.”
On the model S delivery forum, somebody just got notification of delivery
On May 25 for the long range model . This is a California delivery.
This is the start, phew!!
On May 25 for the long range model . This is a California delivery.
This is the start, phew!!
How much do those dampers cost extra? Those interior details, what do those cost now really?
Model 3's pricing made Model S overpriced and thus less in demand. For one percenters not necessarily a turn off in terms of price, but inferior tech in a flagship is hard to excuse.
Pras
Member
Similar threads
- Locked
- Locked
- Locked
