Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[JRP3]

Who goes to a dealership to repair a tire? This conversation confuses me.

Tesla doesn't have dealerships

Tesla is constrained in many states in terms of how many store and service centers the franchise auto dealership cartel, er, I mean, the state law, allows in that state, that is, if the cartel, oops I mean the law, even allows Tesla to open even one store/service location in the entire state. I’m almost positive Tesla’s limited in NY state.

I've seen nothing to suggest service centers are limited.

 

[PhaseWhite]

That's still the case here in NY. A few years ago, I sent a letter to them in hopes of opening up a gallery/SC in the Saratoga area which is a tailor made demographic. Lots of downstate summer visitors, money, horse racing, more money, Vanderbilt money, very stable area with lots of higher education and state capitol 30 minutes away. They responded that they were allowed only 5 galleries and they were already at that limit. Not sure how the SC figure in to this legislation though.
Then at the drive EV event a few years back I brought it up with our Assemblyman Paul Tonko and his right hand man. A few back and forth's via e-mails and a bill introduced by George Amedore and Joe Morrelle last year has been stymied.

The State Legislature began “exploring” it nearly four years ago when it allowed Tesla to operate a handful of sales locations, all are downstate. The company now wants to build 15 new stores, including 5 upstate and one in Rochester, but it’s getting push back.

“They’re trying to operate on a different set of rules and this came up a couple of years ago, and so legislation was negotiated so that they could do four stores but part of those negotiations were,” said Assembly Minority Leader Brian Kolb. “That's it, and here they are back trying for more stores.”

NYS Exposed: State law prevents Tesla from upstate expansion

Decided to check my bias... Yep this Assembly Minority Leader Brian Kolb is a Republican. And the lawmaker who introduced the Legislation to allow Tesla to open more stores.... You guessed it. State Assembly Majority Leader Joe Morelle, a Democrat.

 

[JRP3]

Since none of us knows what’s going on behind closed doors, we’ve no idea. It seems all too easy to take it personal, or assume they’re being stupid.

Tesla has actually been known to make mistakes on occasion.

 

[MP3Mike]

I'd vote for it with my shares (which are more than the total voted for that question already), but there's simply no way I'm linking any of my brokerage account details; I simply don't trust say.com, who I only heard of this week, with the most financially important information I have.

Yep. I've seen one broker that had an API setup that allowed read-only access for financial aggregation sites that you could easily invalidate, I might considering granting read-only access, but full access? No-way.

 

[S3XY]

This definitely does imply that demand for Model S and X is lower right now.

Which should be expected since the $7500 tax credit just expired. This happens every single time any tax credit for EVs expires anywhere in the world: higher demand just before it expires, lower demand just after, then it resumes its normal level.

Perfect time to get some more downtime on the production lines in order to tweak and improve them.

I agree that expiring tax credits affect demand but in this case, as you say "the $7500 tax credit just expired", a $3,750 credit has just started and Tesla reduced prices by another $2,000. Do you think a net $1,750 increase in the cost of about a $100k car is that significant?

 

[Opus BC fan]

OT

Tesla has actually been known to make mistakes on occasion.

 

[humbaba]

Tesla is constrained in many states in terms of how many store and service centers the franchise auto dealership cartel, er, I mean, the state law, allows in that state, that is, if the cartel, oops I mean the law, even allows Tesla to open even one store/service location in the entire state. I’m almost positive Tesla’s limited in NY state.

I'm not sure how many centers Tesla has in New York, but there is a limit of five.

Tesla Hopes To Remove Five Store Limit In New York State

[and I've been corrected. sorry!]

 

[abasile]

I've seen nothing to suggest service centers are limited.

Indeed, @neroden has repeatedly pointed out over the years that there's nothing stopping Tesla from opening more service centers in New York State. The limitation is only on "galleries".

It would be sort of silly, though, to open service centers that have to completely avoid acting as galleries. Closer to us, the Palm Springs Service Center also serves as a delivery location. Adjacent to the waiting area is a "showroom" (it's a converted dealership) containing beautiful, brand new Tesla vehicles that are about to be handed off to new owners. Information on Tesla products is scattered about. Traditionally, car dealership service visits have been opportunities for customers to view the latest offerings. Tesla's Palm Springs Service Center doesn't actively try to get customers to order new vehicles, as it's not a "sales" location, but their overall presentation doesn't hurt.

A boring service center with nothing interesting to look at would be far preferable to no service center. My point, though, is that it wouldn't be in Tesla's normal mold. I mean, even the lounge at the big Kettleman City, CA Supercharger site is a gallery of sorts! I sort of can't blame Tesla for wanting to fight for more locations rather than capitulate again. They really could use a sales/service center in Rochester in particular, given the relatively educated population, not to mention at Gigafactory-2 in Buffalo!

 

[Krugerrand]

Aaaaand that's what all the Tesla customers are gonna do if Tesla doesn't fix their service center geographical deficiencies. There's a reason I'm pointing this out in the INVESTOR THREAD. You just PROVED MY POINT, dude.

So be it, dude. It’s your state’s fault not Tesla’s. Dgodfrey just posted (#7208) the info for you. Go take it up with the proper authority. Then sue Tesla for the services you paid for and aren’t getting.

 

[RobStark]

I have no doubt it's a regulatory mine field, but Tesla's been building cars in California for 11 years, so that seems like plenty of time to get a handle on things. Heck, NUMMI managed to paint 300K+ vehicles a year in that same factory.

I know Tesla is doing many amazing, never-been-done-before things, with lots of associated execution risk, but I find it odd the painting cars is still a topic of conversation.

NUMMI painted 300k+ cars back when California had Republican governors.

Things have changed dramatically since then.

Emission regulations were so stringent body shops were saying they would no longer be able to paint cars solid black, only dark brownish black. Then the State relented a bit. There are reasons why all other car factories left a State that buys 2M+ cars per year.

Tesla has to paint under the most stringent emission regulations while having to meet cost, durability and aesthetic targets.

 

[PhaseWhite]

I agree that expiring tax credits affect demand but in this case, as you say "the $7500 tax credit just expired", a $3,750 credit has just started and Tesla reduced prices by another $2,000. Do you think a net $1,750 increase in the cost of about a $100k car is that significant?

It's not just about the price increase. Q1 is generally the weakest quarter, combined with the fact that anyone who was on the fence of buying between Q4 and Q1 probably pulled the trigger in Q4 (pulling demand forward) to get the tax credit. Throw in the fact that for many people the P3D is a better option than S75D. So it's likely a combination of things that has reduced demand.

I think there's one more factor now. A lot of people who follow Tesla closely are speculating that changes are coming to the Model S/X configs so they are likely holding off on any orders that are not time critical. As other's have stated, the fact that Tesla has not made any clear statements on the matter means changes are probably coming to the configurations. If not, it would be in Tesla interest to state as such to atleast get some prospective buyers off the fence.

 

[RobStark]

Note that at 5k Model 3’s/week(recently it looks like they’re closer to 6-7k/week) and 100k Model S/X per year, that’s 360k cars a year. They’re reaching and exceeding the most NUMMI ever did.

NUMMI record was 424k cars in one year.

 

[JRP3]

So be it, dude. It’s your state’s fault not Tesla’s. Dgodfrey just posted (#7208) the info for you.

No he didn't.

They responded that they were allowed only 5 galleries and they were already at that limit. Not sure how the SC figure in to this legislation though.

 

[Zaxxon]

I'd vote for it with my shares (which are more than the total voted for that question already), but there's simply no way I'm linking any of my brokerage account details; I simply don't trust say.com, who I only heard of this week, with the most financially important information I have.

I would appreciate it if people whose brokerage accounts only have "loseable" amounts of money would step in and vote since I can't.

FWIW, you're not giving your creds to Say.com. The linking is handled by Quovo, the same company that Betterment, Wealthfront, and YNAB use.

Note that this is not an advice to use say.com--just a clarification that you don't actually share your brokerage credentials with them.

 

[Krugerrand]

Tesla has actually been known to make mistakes on occasion.

Absolutely. And then they fix them when they can. As long as he’s been screaming about the topic, I’d take a wild guess that Tesla has been well aware they are service under represented in that part of the state. And if they could do something about it, they would. The state is not helpful.

This isn’t willful ‘let’s screw our upper NY state customers’.

 

[JRP3]

It would be sort of silly, though, to open service centers that have to completely avoid acting as galleries.

A boring service center with nothing interesting to look at would be far preferable to no service center.

Exactly. It also wouldn't hurt Tesla sales to have a few service loaner cars sitting out front all the time. Just knowing there is a nearby service center would boost sales.

 

[RobStark]

Decided to check my bias... Yep this Assembly Minority Leader Brian Kolb is a Republican. And the lawmaker who introduced the Legislation to allow Tesla to open more stores.... You guessed it. State Assembly Majority Leader Joe Morelle, a Democrat.

Democrats control New York State Governor's House, State Senate, and State Assembly.

Democrats can spare a few votes while completely ignoring Republicans and still pass legislation.

 

[Krugerrand]

No he didn't.

He posted a link with an actual quote that stated Tesla was receiving pushback from expanding into the northern part of the state. Just because it doesn’t appear there’s nothing preventing a SC, doesn’t mean there isn’t. We’re dealing with crooks. There is no logical reason for Tesla to not expand there, unless they are being prevented in some way.

 

[alst]

Elon's Twitter use has been very nuanced lately. In the past, this was a sign of good things to come as far as I observed. We'll hopefully see so soon.

 

[Bet TSLA]

For Tesla I really am only worried about whether they can solve "customer service hell".

I don't see this as an issue. Of course they will solve this problem. It's easy compared to the other problems they've been solving. I believe the only reason it has been left for so long is because it's perceived as easy to fix when necessary. And Tesla only works on things that are necessary, since they have so many things on their plate.

But I think it's getting to the point where everybody at Tesla, even Elon, knows it's necessary. So it will be done.