Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[RobStark]

Volkswagen's 'Cheap' EV Not Coming Until 2023

 

[dc_h]

I hope they don't waste time on things like that. Yes, there are some people who race pickups, but that's a very different market than your core pickup market. Pickup owners generally want trucks that can perform great feats of strength and rough-terrain traversal, not great feats of track performance.

I hope they stay focused on pickup range, low-end torque, and ruggedness - and keep the suspension focus on rough terrain and towing rather than the track.

Exactly right. Build a truck that will not only pull an F150 or Ram, but tear it in half. A nice video of a Tesla truck winning a tug of war and shredding a Ford to pieces. Tesla needs to destroy an F150 more then Tesla needs to beat Porsche on the track.

 

[BrianZ]

Its these sort of discounts that annoy people who pay full price from a company that says it doesn't do discounts.

What exactly were you trying to buy (full config), for what price, and what are they giving you instead (full config), for what price?

I paid a lot more for my first P3D than this! I'm not complaining. Although this one being $11,000+ less than my first one certainly helps

I ordered the white P3D with white interior and FSD at the normal price $62,900, except they gave me white interior for free (basically $1000 off), so $61,900.

Then they offered me a white P3D- (no performance package), 19" wheels, black interior, with 7 miles on it for $51,490. I added FSD for $6000 more, so $57,490 in total.

I do have concerns though if the "Tesla give discounts at the end of the quarter" idea becomes more popular. That'll shift consumer behavior to buy at the end of the quarter, not good.

 

[KarenRei]

I paid a lot more for my first P3D than this! I'm not complaining. Although this one being $11,000+ less than my first one certainly helps

I ordered the white P3D with white interior and FSD at the normal price $62,900, except they gave me white interior for free (basically $1000 off), so $61,900.

Then they offered me a white P3D- (no performance package), 19" wheels, black interior for $51,490. I added FSD for $6000 more, so $57,490 in total.

I do have concerns though if the "Tesla give discounts at the end of the quarter" idea becomes more popular. That'll shift consumer behavior to buy at the end of the quarter, not good.

.... and make everyone who doesn't buy at the end of the quarter, or buys at the end of the quarter but doesn't get a discount, mad.

But could you clarify, what is a "P3D- (no performance package)" - is it just an AWD? Because if it still has M3P performance, and it's just a wheel downgrade (~$1,5k nominal price difference?), then you got $3k off, plus 2 years free Supercharging. Am I understanding this right?

I don't really mind when Tesla "updelivers" - e.g. buyer pays the same but gets a more expensive paint colour or wheels or whatnot that they didn't order, since the extra cost to Tesla is minimal and they get the same revenue, and the person wasn't planning to pay more anyway. But it does bother me when they "downsell", with the person paying far less than planned for a car worth thousands more than the sale price, with Tesla earning less money, just to clear out inventory at the end of the quarter... that wrong and it bothers me.

 

[BrianZ]

.... and make everyone who doesn't buy at the end of the quarter, or buys at the end of the quarter but doesn't get a discount, mad.

But could you clarify, what is a "P3D- (no performance package)" - is it just an AWD?

Agreed. Well technically they offered a demo car to me.

It still does 0-60 in 3.2 seconds, but it does not come with the 20" wheels, the bigger Brembo brakes, the carbon fiber spoiler, and performance pedals. Basically, a AWD that does 0-60 in 3.2. This used to be a $5000 option when it first came out, but it was quickly included into the performance trim. This version is only made for Tesla stores as demo cars since the cosmetics aren't a big factor.

 

[KarenRei]

Agreed. Well technically they offered a demo car to me.

It still does 0-60 in 3.2 seconds, but it does not come with the 20" wheels, the bigger Brembo brakes, the carbon fiber spoiler, and performance pedals. Basically, a AWD that does 0-60 in 3.2. This used to be a $5000 option when it first came out, but it was quickly included into the performance trim. This version is only made for Tesla stores as demo cars since the cosmetics aren't a big factor.

Oh, it's a demo car? Okay, that doesn't bother me much then. Demo cars are "used" and it's normal for them to be slightly discounted (although that's IMHO a pretty high discount). Also I'd still far rather see Tesla try to upsell AWD buyers to a P3D- demo car than to downsell a P3D buyer to a P3D- :Þ

 

[BrianZ]

Oh, it's a demo car? Okay, that doesn't bother me much then. Demo cars are "used" and it's normal for them to be slightly discounted (although that's IMHO a pretty high discount). Also I'd still far rather see Tesla try to upsell AWD buyers to a P3D- demo car than to downsell a P3D buyer to a P3D- :Þ

Agreed. Now you're making me consider letting someone else have this deal. Profits from me will eventually come back to me as a shareholder, right???

Meanwhile TSLAQ: Tesla is so bad at selling cars that they downsell cars!!! Bankwuptcy imminent!!!

 

[KarenRei]

Agreed. Now you're making me consider letting someone else have this deal. Profits from me will eventually come back to me as a shareholder, right???

Meanwhile TSLAQ: Tesla is so bad at selling cars that they downsell cars!!! Bankwuptcy imminent!!!

Nah, enjoy it. Use the saved money to help pay for the next big upgrade that comes out

 

[Vostok]

I just wanted to be post #85166 here,

 

[VValleyEV]

Traditional auto dealerships take out loans to buy the new cars from the manufacturers. This helps buffer factory outputs and gets revenue from the newly manufactured cars more immediately into the manufacturer's accounts but this comes at a stiff price of interest, dealer profit after paying for all that land the cars sit on, etc.

Currently, Tesla showrooms and delivery centers are in dense urban areas on leased properties. With current growth rates, It might make sense to open 7 or 8 large regional delivery centers on cheap land outside of major metropolitan areas (while keeping the current showrooms/delivery centers). These large regional delivery centers could function as "local stock" which could feed cars to urban delivery centers as needed. Buyers could also be offered a discount when taking delivery at the regional centers.

This doesn't totally solve the problem of unsold inventory but it does add flexibility to batching during production and shortening wait times for specific configurations.

I have been told twice by Tesla employees that they are building a new delivery center at the north end of the Phoenix area, in North Scottsdale, and that this will replace the multiple delivery locations they have now.

Other background info of possible interest: I just picked up my wife’s M3 at the Tempe Service Center on Friday. When I picked up my MS last year, it was at this same Tempe location and it was crazy busy, “mobbed” would be a good description, and my delivery was later than scheduled. On Friday they were doing a steady but leisurely pace of deliveries, I got there early and was able to take delivery 30 minutes early. When I remarked that this was a pleasant surprise, they told me well there are multiple delivery locations now (I think they said the other one is at the North Scottsdale Service Center), AND that there is a new delivery center north of that one that will soon take over for all Phoenix area deliveries. I had heard about this also from the Tesla sales advisor at the North Scottsdale location where my wife did a test drive 2+ weeks ago. Strange that they didn’t offer to deliver my car from that location, 20min closer to my home in northern AZ.

Anyway, all this is great news, now that we have all the Teslas that we can drive at the same time.

 

[1101011]

Nah, enjoy it. Use the saved money to help pay for the next big upgrade that comes out

Or buy more shares...

 

[Steve m]

Another China delivery story..

China shows an insatiable demand for Tesla Model 3 and Model X post-tax break

 

[Fact Checking]

Volkswagen's 'Cheap' EV Not Coming Until 2023

[VW CEO Diess] added: "There’s a long way to go. It’s really tough to get a decent range for a car under €20,000."​

Who would've thunk??

 

[TSLA Pilot]

Not nearly enough. And those who can least afford $5 gas can least afford BEVs.

Ah, not the case at all if one thinks about it, which, sadly, not too many do . . . and let's not even bring up externalities paid by future generations:

Shocker: Tesla Model 3 vs. Honda Civic — 15 Cost Comparisons Over 5 Years | CleanTechnica

 

[Prunesquallor]

Mostly I agree. The rough terrain bit is a bit off in my mind. Even the most brutish f 150 never sees more dirt than when it edges off the driveway. Rock crawling is another animal. The meat of the market is something that looks 4x4 and is hard to put in the garage.

I’m from Houston, and you have nailed the market precisely.

 

[Prunesquallor]

Update: I may have to eat some crow for customer service nightmare. Tesla just offered me a P3D with no performance package for $51.5k + 2 year free supercharging. A Model 3 Performance for $51.5k? Hell yes! I may potentially get another $1500 off for the 19" wheels due to the earlier incentive, bringing the car below $50k. That would be too much if also tacked on.

Jeez. Remind me to order near the end of the quarter!

 

[Prunesquallor]

[VW CEO Diess] added: "There’s a long way to go. It’s really tough to get a decent range for a car under €20,000."​

Who would've thunk??

Just when you think you can take them seriously....

 

[Prunesquallor]

Agreed. Well technically they offered a demo car to me.

It still does 0-60 in 3.2 seconds, but it does not come with the 20" wheels, the bigger Brembo brakes, the carbon fiber spoiler, and performance pedals. Basically, a AWD that does 0-60 in 3.2. This used to be a $5000 option when it first came out, but it was quickly included into the performance trim. This version is only made for Tesla stores as demo cars since the cosmetics aren't a big factor.

LOL.

 

[MC3OZ]

If you haven't read the paper on the Million mile battery it is well worth a read.

A Wide Range of Testing Results on an Excellent Lithium-Ion Cell Chemistry to be used as Benchmarks for New Battery Technologies

The executive summary is:-
"We conclude that cells of this type should be able to power an electric vehicle for over 1.6 million kilometers (1 million miles) and last at least two decades in grid energy storage."

The energy storage implications are almost as significant as the Automotive implications.

 

[willow_hiller]

Market technical question: Does the max pain ever fall above the underlying?

I was just looking at the maximum pain points in our run up to the end of Q3, and some interesting patterns started to emerge. First, bullish weeks seem to have a mass of open interest above the underlying, and bearish weeks the opposite (makes sense). Second, regardless of whether there's more interest on the left or right, the maximum pain point is always underneath the underlying. Is this typical? Or just a TSLA thing? All my charts attached for reference. For expiry on Sept 13th with data from the 8th, the interest in calls seemed massive. Now, leading up to the end of Q3 there's more interest in puts.