StealthP3D
Well-Known Member
Tesla can announce a split, subject to shareholder approval of more shares, at any time.
Generally, I'm ambivalent about splits if not for their ability to cause problems for the naked shorts.
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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable
- Thread starter AudubonB
- Start date
Tesla can announce a split, subject to shareholder approval of more shares, at any time.
Generally, I'm ambivalent about splits if not for their ability to cause problems for the naked shorts.
A key to Tesla, as an investor, is that the length of the value chain is unmatched. People say "other EVs are coming!"
We have talked about Og Mandino and Tesla as a 21 day good driving (safe following distance) habits trainer.
It is time to talk about the dog training part of the Tesla value chain that I have not yet heard NPR downplay.
I have a Border Collie, Bella, who is extremely skittish when it comes to sounds. The chime sound of an incoming message causes her to scurry down the stairs to her safe place. So here is how we solved that.
If every time you get into the car to go down to the lake and throw the dog football to Bella, the dog, you tell the Tesla to, "Play Downtown by Petula Clark," you (and Bella) will discover that identical chime sound early. Do this enough times and the chime is associated with good times. Bella is trained. You also get to hear Herman's Hermits, the Turtles and Neil Diamond singing Cherry, Cherry. Which she likes almost as much as Going up the Country by Canned Heat.
So to answer someone who is ultra focused on the tiniest part of the value chain, one can answer, "But can it help you train your dog like a Tesla can?"
Owning a Tesla can make both you, and your dog, better.
We have talked about Og Mandino and Tesla as a 21 day good driving (safe following distance) habits trainer.
It is time to talk about the dog training part of the Tesla value chain that I have not yet heard NPR downplay.
I have a Border Collie, Bella, who is extremely skittish when it comes to sounds. The chime sound of an incoming message causes her to scurry down the stairs to her safe place. So here is how we solved that.
If every time you get into the car to go down to the lake and throw the dog football to Bella, the dog, you tell the Tesla to, "Play Downtown by Petula Clark," you (and Bella) will discover that identical chime sound early. Do this enough times and the chime is associated with good times. Bella is trained. You also get to hear Herman's Hermits, the Turtles and Neil Diamond singing Cherry, Cherry. Which she likes almost as much as Going up the Country by Canned Heat.
So to answer someone who is ultra focused on the tiniest part of the value chain, one can answer, "But can it help you train your dog like a Tesla can?"
Owning a Tesla can make both you, and your dog, better.
Off the top of my head …
1- Possible Dow inclusion
2-Unwinding naked shorts
3-Options pricing
The reason, as has been explained 4711 times over 14 months now, is that it neutralises the Market Makers' exception to magic false shares out of thin air, which they can sell to push down the price at will. '
Did you not see this discussed at all here?
Gigapress
Trying to be less wrong
I'm no options expert, but wasn't the point that a stock split unwinds illegal naked shorts, not shorts in general?
I watched the whole sickening interview with this moron on Yahoo Finance (big waste of time).“Says Irwin, "General Motors should not be underestimated. It's an American icon."
You could put Ford at the top of that list, too — much to the dismay of current category leader Tesla and its legion of fans.”
(Dismayed emojis).
1. He puts way too much faith in the Apple car coming in 2024, something he admits he has no direct actual knowledge of. It will have "amazing, bleeding edge technology in the $10k to $20k range", and "it will crush numbers, the way Porsche does".
2. He claims to have seen a survey of fund managers, 70% of which say they would much rather invest in GM and Ford for EV's than Tesla, so he thinks that is where all the money is going to go.
3. He thinks the Cybertruk is going to get pushed off again, and it is too "polarizing".
"Better options are coming."4. Tesla will have "market share erosion from abundant brands are launching into this market", aka "the competition is coming".
5. He thinks Tesla is still paying way too much for batteries, so they have no advantage.
Blah, blah, blah. It appears to me that he spends way to much time talking to $teslaq.
I totally agree that Tesla isn't driven by left or right. In fact it's one of the rare controversial things that has substantial proponents and detractors on both sides of the political aisle.
I'm very liberal too, but I am very cognizant that most (but certainly not all!) journalists are as liberal as I am. At least in the U.S.,they come mostly from my demographic, graduates of the best liberal arts schools. We mostly communicate in our echo chamber. I don't know much about the way the world works, but I know my peeps, and they are to a very great extent liberal and very critical of Tesla and Musk. Have been since day one. Again, I'm not saying all liberals are Tesla detractors. It's a big country! There are lots of types of liberals. What I am saying is that the journalistic community (which happens to be mostly liberal), are overwhelmingly Tesla detractors.
If you think that the bad press Tesla and Musk have consistently been subjected to over the years is because of advertising dollars, you really don't know my peeps. The writers and editors of the best papers and other news media in America are very honest, very dedicated, very hard working. But they have almost uniformly been critical of Tesla, despite everything all of us on this forum know about the positive attributes of Tesla for the future of mankind. It's groupthink, plain and simple.
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Besides the pain they bring to naked shorters, there are many places (countries and brokerages) where you can't purchase fractional shares. Also there is a psychological component that shouldn't be overlooked.
it’s worth noting that the split in and of itself is an equity neutral event, for example a 2 for 1, shares double, price halves…it’s the underlying reason to perform a split in the first place, the company’s position of strength and future growth, that usually leads to buying and an increase in market cap. what happened to tesla over the last 18 months was clearly a paradigm shift, which isn’t ‘normally’ the case when a company goes through a split. there’s still naysayers and their games, and the notional value of short interest hung around a bit…but many of the old tricks don’t quite work anymore, or not as well, on a company positioned the was tesla now is, both in real life, and in market valuation. we still witness them trying every day though!
Many - including myself - cannot buy fractional shares. It's not offered by our brokers.
Splits are also useful since it forces everyone with fake shares aka shorters to buy shares to cover themselves. This in turn create a buying pressure and pushes the share price up.
If Tesla wants to join the Dow index they have a weird requirement where the share price must be in a particular range - a little over $100 if I understand this correctly. The Dow have currently no auto makers so adding TSLA would make ther index more complete. This would make various funds and ETFs following the Dow index buy TSLA shares. Again creating buying pressure.
i was told not only US, but many foreign customers of IBKR as well, are now allowed to trade fracs on US companies.
many here at the time i first mentioned it said no. maybe they made it work for foreign investors by now. could be worth checking out. there may be some other firms that allow it too. just saying.
@Christine69420 ? maybe can verify
larmor
Active Member
Can someone ask about the Buffalo factory, solar roof tiles and if there will be an OEM option with new home builders?
2021 Shareholder Meeting | Tesla
The 2021 Annual Meeting will be presented from Gigafactory Austin on Thursday, October 7, 2021, at 4:30 p.m. Central Time in a virtual-only format.www.tesla.com
I'm not sure if it was posted earlier but this URL takes you to a landing page with the youtube video in it.
The video URL is
woodisgood
Optimustic Pessimist
Dow inclusion will happen at some point in the next two years, and a split will be needed to facilitate that. Beyond that, I’m not sure of the advantage of a split right now. Quite frankly it is beneficial for Tesla to be trading in a relatively undervalued range while on-boarding exceptional engineering and manufacturing talent for hypergrowth. And with respect to the naked shorting we suspect was unwound last time, I fully expect the entities that were trounced to have created the appropriate loopholes/strategies in preparation for the next split. It will need to be something different to catch them off-guard (if Tesla finds their activities particularly annoying), and while I have some ideas on what that could be, I don’t think it will be appropriate for some time. I believe the stock price would have to stay unreasonably range bound for many more quarters (read: the team not seeing their achievements rewarded by the market) for Tesla to be particularly concerned. JMO.
We assume these posts simply reflect your lack of understanding about the mechanics of splits and thus confuse the posters before you by assuming they suggest intrinsic value from splits. I will try to explain the two major points:
1. Short sellers which do so 'naked' are limited to direct market makers. The can carry short portions for long periods without buying any underlying securities. Thus: naked. That is illegal for beneficial owners. When there is split these entities must buy shares to cover their positions, because they own phantom shares they do not benefit from the split but must suddenly deliver the post-split share numbers. Hence the desire for a split.
2. Some issuers, including TSLA have found share prices rise post split and do so enduringly. That, admitedly, is slightly illogical because the intrinsic value does not change, but it still happens.
You are arguing, it seems, about fundamentals. Perhaps sadly, fundamentals are really not what most securities trading is about. Market makers make money on volatility, not value.
Almost none in this forum imagines they might actually see intrinsic value increase by splits. Many of us think history will repeat itself and price will rise following a split, not least because some of those shorts will need to cover.
It is not "basic mathematics". It is far more complex than that, and less precise.
@Radish11
it’s very heartwarming to see your post. i have a mental “sentiment” indicator still somewhat nebulous, that is roughly based on similar posts.
it gives me confirmation that my “rage buy/DCA” of 83 shares yesterday was a very good idea.
i also hope for a small stock split that will bollix shorts and vanish even a few “virtual shares”
I'm biased but I'll go with lafrisbee and the Space Coast, I've hired more then a few capable Engineers from UCF and FIT. We also have a large SpaceX presence. I'm thinking Titusville or Melbourne.
I just tried to buy 0.1 shares from my broker Nordnet. It's not allowed.
Ummm...
Ninety percent of global population ignorant? (being optimistic)
As for lazy.... do not want to give my estimate, really not fair. But I can safely say it applies to the majority most of the time.
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