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My thoughts on the biggest takeaway from the earnings call:

Elon suddenly sees path to 4T “for the first time”, this is unusual, we saw path to 10T long ago, why he only sees it now?
Something big is brewing.

Could be FSD really close, or Energy scaling to insanely big, we know it’s not Optimus or even Dojo, so it’s likely something they already have. Something he used to give none-zero probability had suddenly become probable outcome.

So, in 2015 Elon said Tesla would be 700B in 10 years, nobody believes, in 2018 he bets the board to award him if he actually makes it happen, and he did it in 2 years.

Now, he’s predicting 4T but no timeline, new compensation plan coming? That I would very much welcome! Make it 10T please!
 
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My thoughts on the biggest takeaway from the earnings call:

Elon suddenly sees path to 4T “for the first time”, this is unusual, we saw path to 10T long ago, why he only sees it now?
Something big is brewing.

Could be FSD really close, or Energy scaling to insanely big, something he used to give none-zero probability had suddenly become probable outcome.

So, in 2015 Elon said Tesla would be 700B in 10 years, nobody believes, in 2018 he bets the board to award him if he actually makes it happen, and he did it in 2 years.

Now, he’s predicting 4T but no timeline, new compensation plan coming? That I would very much welcome! Make it 10T please!
Yer something big is brewing, he needs to sell stock.
 
A simple tweet exchange between a Ford manager and Value Analyst (TMC member), is sufficient enough to write a complete article on it 😁

It's in Dutch, so use Google Translate
 
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A simple tweet exchange between a Ford manager and Value Analyst (TMC member), is sufficient enough to write a complete article on it 😁

It's in Dutch, so use Google Translate
The dutch proverb ‘wiens brood men eet, diens woord men spreekt’ comes to mind.
 
Tesla last night gave us positive news of the 4680 ramp. And Joe Tegtmeyer filmed inside the battery production part of Giga Texas. And they are stockpiling a lot of structural battery packs there. You can see for yourself in the first part of this video:


I don't know why they are stockpiling but they are definitely producing batteries. Could they be producing batteries faster than they can make cars with these for now?
 
Just listened to the mainstream investing podcast in Denmark. They were laughing at the PT of 1.300 from Musk at the conference call.

C9A8F58E-2F50-4546-BFAE-7D0FF91FFFC1.gif
 
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I've been saying this for a long time now. We need the Model Q

The main argument against this is that Tesla are already selling all the higher-priced cars they can produce and that a smaller car would cannibalise these sales

However, the TAM for MS/3/X/Y is limited, not only is it cost-based, but also demographic. These cars are way too big for many, especially outside the USA. Plus, the drop-off in these sales will come abruptly and Tesla should be ready to fill that gap when it comes, not wait until it happens then have a 2-3 year ramp-time

Maybe it could be developed behind the scenes and revealed when ready for production, like Apple "available as of next week", that would be fun

M3 is still way too big for most people in many parts of the world, and even with some cost-savings/margin squeeze, we're looking at, what, back to the $35k range? That's too much, needs to be sub $20k - 4680 battery price-reductions and manufacturing efficiency will make such a car feasible while maintaining high margins
The TAM for S3XY is indeed not infinite, but the current factories (Fremont, Shanghai, Berlin, Austin) at max output can IMO sell every S3XY-model they can produce indefinitely. Perhaps at slightly lowered prices but still with decent margins. Don't forget many business fleets replace their vehicles every 5 years tops, and Tesla has high brand loyalty, so I see a path to keep selling these luxury vehicles (i.e. >$50k).

If I just look around at all the BMW's, Mercedes, Audi, Porsche and Volvo cars on the roads - most of which fall into the same price range as the S3XY models and are just as big as 3's and Y's - it's just a matter of time before these OEMs lose sales to Tesla. (Yes, some buyers will never want a Tesla and stick with the Taycan or another fancy overpriced BEV from the OEM they are loyal to, but the more Tesla's there are on the roads, the more demand there will be).

The next generation Tesla vehicle platform consisting of smaller cars, will indeed be have orders of magnitude more demand, especially in Europe where roads are generally more narrow than in the land of the free, and there are actually historical cities with medieval layouts not adapted to American pickup trucks. (try driving through alleys in Rome, you'll be much happier in a small car like a Fiat 500 or so).

Elon has now hinted that the next vehicle platform could see production costs dropping by 50% compared to 3/Y.
Currently ASP is roughly $54k, with 27.9% gross margin = 15k profit per vehicle and 39k production cost. Let's make it $40k production cost to be conservative. (this is conservative either way since this consists of a mix of S/X and 3/Y, so the build cost of 3/Y is lower than $40k normally).

Half that production cost in next generation = $20k production cost. At ASP of $25k this would net 25% automotive gross margins, excluding software.
So I disagree that this will turn out like the promise of the $35k car.
Of course what used to be a $25k car five years ago is now a $35k car, so I wouldn't mind Tesla just selling the next generation car at a hefty premium/gross margin around $35k, but they'll have enough demand to compete with the smaller vehicle segments from other OEMs.


My biggest question in all this is, is if Tesla will double down on FSD and actually create the robotaxi first and only add a (more expensive) steering wheel version of the next generation vehicle if they see the need for it. If FSD is indeed going to happen and regulators allow it, then the most lucrative business decision would be to only sell robotaxi's, at a base price of $25-35k and FSD subscription available. Remember this from Autonomy Day:

"Can you share with us how much Tesla is spending on Autopilot or Autonomous technology by order of magnitude on annual basis?" - analyst
"It's basically our entire expense structure." - Elon

Of course FSD could take longer for regulatory approval (i.e. level 4-5 Tesla Network allowed IMO), in which case Tesla would have to either delay robotaxi production or add a steering wheel and call it a smaller car. I don't see the comments from Elon on the call yesterday as proof that the next generation will have steering wheels, but he didn't deny it also. If he truly believes in FSD soonish (and he apparently does), it would be logical to skip the hot-hatchback-Tesla-with-a-steering-wheel step:
- more profit from robotaxi
- more safety from robotaxi (and Tesla puts safety as their top priority).

I may have drifted a bit during this write up, and I don't want to be the dreamy hyper-bull per se, but if FSD regulatory approval would come by end of 2023 then robotaxi can start producing in 2024 and the world (and the stock) will be a different place.

Either way, autonomy or not, great things lie ahead for Tesla.
 
I wish Tesla would cancel the Roadster. It's an unproductive use of resources, and it reinforces the image of Teslas as vehicles for the elite. (I was glad to learn yesterday that Tesla is again working on a smaller, cheaper vehicle.)

I have similar concern about the Celestiq, but it's not quite as bad in this respect because GM also talks about moderately priced Chevrolet EV's, and Cadillacs aren't supposed to be meant for the proles.

The Roadster is how Tesla advertises and builds brand equity.
 
Eh not sure that matters. Ford and GM advertise their crap as entirely hands free and those systems randomly shut off when they feel like it.
Maybe, but Ford and GM are rarely held to account for their lies, misinformation and BS, whereas Tesla and Musk are scrutinised on everything and often wilfully misunderstood to amplify the FUD
 
I've been saying this for a long time now. We need the Model Q

The main argument against this is that Tesla are already selling all the higher-priced cars they can produce and that a smaller car would cannibalise these sales

However, the TAM for MS/3/X/Y is limited, not only is it cost-based, but also demographic. These cars are way too big for many, especially outside the USA. Plus, the drop-off in these sales will come abruptly and Tesla should be ready to fill that gap when it comes, not wait until it happens then have a 2-3 year ramp-time

Maybe it could be developed behind the scenes and revealed when ready for production, like Apple "available as of next week", that would be fun

The next step down Tesla should be the Model 2/Z.

The letter Q has had so much stupid attached to it in the last few years it’s kinda ruined the whole letter for me…
 
The TAM for S3XY is indeed not infinite, but the current factories (Fremont, Shanghai, Berlin, Austin) at max output can IMO sell every S3XY-model they can produce indefinitely. Perhaps at slightly lowered prices but still with decent margins. Don't forget many business fleets replace their vehicles every 5 years tops, and Tesla has high brand loyalty, so I see a path to keep selling these luxury vehicles (i.e. >$50k).

If I just look around at all the BMW's, Mercedes, Audi, Porsche and Volvo cars on the roads - most of which fall into the same price range as the S3XY models and are just as big as 3's and Y's - it's just a matter of time before these OEMs lose sales to Tesla. (Yes, some buyers will never want a Tesla and stick with the Taycan or another fancy overpriced BEV from the OEM they are loyal to, but the more Tesla's there are on the roads, the more demand there will be).

The next generation Tesla vehicle platform consisting of smaller cars, will indeed be have orders of magnitude more demand, especially in Europe where roads are generally more narrow than in the land of the free, and there are actually historical cities with medieval layouts not adapted to American pickup trucks. (try driving through alleys in Rome, you'll be much happier in a small car like a Fiat 500 or so).

Elon has now hinted that the next vehicle platform could see production costs dropping by 50% compared to 3/Y.
Currently ASP is roughly $54k, with 27.9% gross margin = 15k profit per vehicle and 39k production cost. Let's make it $40k production cost to be conservative. (this is conservative either way since this consists of a mix of S/X and 3/Y, so the build cost of 3/Y is lower than $40k normally).

Half that production cost in next generation = $20k production cost. At ASP of $25k this would net 25% automotive gross margins, excluding software.
So I disagree that this will turn out like the promise of the $35k car.
Of course what used to be a $25k car five years ago is now a $35k car, so I wouldn't mind Tesla just selling the next generation car at a hefty premium/gross margin around $35k, but they'll have enough demand to compete with the smaller vehicle segments from other OEMs.


My biggest question in all this is, is if Tesla will double down on FSD and actually create the robotaxi first and only add a (more expensive) steering wheel version of the next generation vehicle if they see the need for it. If FSD is indeed going to happen and regulators allow it, then the most lucrative business decision would be to only sell robotaxi's, at a base price of $25-35k and FSD subscription available. Remember this from Autonomy Day:

"Can you share with us how much Tesla is spending on Autopilot or Autonomous technology by order of magnitude on annual basis?" - analyst
"It's basically our entire expense structure." - Elon

Of course FSD could take longer for regulatory approval (i.e. level 4-5 Tesla Network allowed IMO), in which case Tesla would have to either delay robotaxi production or add a steering wheel and call it a smaller car. I don't see the comments from Elon on the call yesterday as proof that the next generation will have steering wheels, but he didn't deny it also. If he truly believes in FSD soonish (and he apparently does), it would be logical to skip the hot-hatchback-Tesla-with-a-steering-wheel step:
- more profit from robotaxi
- more safety from robotaxi (and Tesla puts safety as their top priority).

I may have drifted a bit during this write up, and I don't want to be the dreamy hyper-bull per se, but if FSD regulatory approval would come by end of 2023 then robotaxi can start producing in 2024 and the world (and the stock) will be a different place.

Either way, autonomy or not, great things lie ahead for Tesla.
I think after CT ramp, regardless of FSD will be when we’ll see MQ/2 … so likely 2024?
 
I don't know why they are stockpiling but they are definitely producing batteries. Could they be producing batteries faster than they can make cars with these for now?
IIRC they re-tooled the Texas Y line from 4680 to 2170. I doubt they'll convert back to 4680 until the battery production rate exceeds the anticipated production line throughput. In the meantime they stockpile.
 
I think after CT ramp, regardless of FSD will be when we’ll see MQ/2 … so likely 2024?
Indeed, as Elon said during the earnings call of Q1 2022:

So, we’re also working on a new vehicle that I alluded to at the Giga Texas opening, which is a dedicated robotaxi. That’s highly optimized for autonomy, meaning it would not have steering wheel or pedals. And there are a number of other innovations around it that I think are quite exciting. That is fundamentally optimized for -- trying to achieve the lowest fully considered cost per mile or cost per kilometer, accounting everything. And so, it’s, I think, going to be a very powerful product where we aspire to reach volume production of that in 2024. So, I think that really will be a massive driver of Tesla’s growth. And we remain on track to reach volume production of the Cybertruck next year.

And also:

Martin Viecha

Yes Next question is at Cyber Rodeo, Elon mentioned that a futuristic driverless robotaxi vehicle is on the roadmap. When can we expect more details on the product offering to be unveiled? Is this something that people can own, or will this be only offered by Tesla as a service?

Elon Musk

So, I think we want to hold up on -- we don’t want to jump the gun on an exciting product announcement too much. So, I think, we’ll aim to -- we do a product event for robotaxi next year and get into more detail, but we are aiming for volume production in 2024.


Conclusion: robotaxi unveil in 2023. Would only make sense in combination with announcing regulatory approval.
 
IIRC they re-tooled the Texas Y line from 4680 to 2170. I doubt they'll convert back to 4680 until the battery production rate exceeds the anticipated production line throughput. In the meantime they stockpile.
On the conference call Drew said:
"On the 2170 versus 4680, in our factories, we really attempt to minimize factory complexity and product changeover while still making sure we get enough new product into the field to learn how it is performing.
And that sort of mix is going to shift as 4680 scales here and the overall factory ramp proceeds in Texas
."

My understanding is they added 2170 capability to the Austin lines but still have the ability to do a mix of 4680 and 2170 production. My reading of Drew's quote above supports this, implying they do runs of both (to get 4680's in the field to learn how its performing) but that over time production will move more towards 4680 with less 2170.
 
The TAM for S3XY is indeed not infinite, but the current factories (Fremont, Shanghai, Berlin, Austin) at max output can IMO sell every S3XY-model they can produce indefinitely. Perhaps at slightly lowered prices but still with decent margins. Don't forget many business fleets replace their vehicles every 5 years tops, and Tesla has high brand loyalty, so I see a path to keep selling these luxury vehicles (i.e. >$50k).

If I just look around at all the BMW's, Mercedes, Audi, Porsche and Volvo cars on the roads - most of which fall into the same price range as the S3XY models and are just as big as 3's and Y's - it's just a matter of time before these OEMs lose sales to Tesla. (Yes, some buyers will never want a Tesla and stick with the Taycan or another fancy overpriced BEV from the OEM they are loyal to, but the more Tesla's there are on the roads, the more demand there will be).

The next generation Tesla vehicle platform consisting of smaller cars, will indeed be have orders of magnitude more demand, especially in Europe where roads are generally more narrow than in the land of the free, and there are actually historical cities with medieval layouts not adapted to American pickup trucks. (try driving through alleys in Rome, you'll be much happier in a small car like a Fiat 500 or so).

Elon has now hinted that the next vehicle platform could see production costs dropping by 50% compared to 3/Y.
Currently ASP is roughly $54k, with 27.9% gross margin = 15k profit per vehicle and 39k production cost. Let's make it $40k production cost to be conservative. (this is conservative either way since this consists of a mix of S/X and 3/Y, so the build cost of 3/Y is lower than $40k normally).

Half that production cost in next generation = $20k production cost. At ASP of $25k this would net 25% automotive gross margins, excluding software.
So I disagree that this will turn out like the promise of the $35k car.
Of course what used to be a $25k car five years ago is now a $35k car, so I wouldn't mind Tesla just selling the next generation car at a hefty premium/gross margin around $35k, but they'll have enough demand to compete with the smaller vehicle segments from other OEMs.


My biggest question in all this is, is if Tesla will double down on FSD and actually create the robotaxi first and only add a (more expensive) steering wheel version of the next generation vehicle if they see the need for it. If FSD is indeed going to happen and regulators allow it, then the most lucrative business decision would be to only sell robotaxi's, at a base price of $25-35k and FSD subscription available. Remember this from Autonomy Day:

"Can you share with us how much Tesla is spending on Autopilot or Autonomous technology by order of magnitude on annual basis?" - analyst
"It's basically our entire expense structure." - Elon

Of course FSD could take longer for regulatory approval (i.e. level 4-5 Tesla Network allowed IMO), in which case Tesla would have to either delay robotaxi production or add a steering wheel and call it a smaller car. I don't see the comments from Elon on the call yesterday as proof that the next generation will have steering wheels, but he didn't deny it also. If he truly believes in FSD soonish (and he apparently does), it would be logical to skip the hot-hatchback-Tesla-with-a-steering-wheel step:
- more profit from robotaxi
- more safety from robotaxi (and Tesla puts safety as their top priority).

I may have drifted a bit during this write up, and I don't want to be the dreamy hyper-bull per se, but if FSD regulatory approval would come by end of 2023 then robotaxi can start producing in 2024 and the world (and the stock) will be a different place.

Either way, autonomy or not, great things lie ahead for Tesla.
My guess is that the RoboTaxi is simply a compact Model without steering wheel and pedals, perhaps with upgraded FSD hardware, and a different battery pack.

Or at least the RoboTaxi and the other compact Models are the same platform with s lot of common parts.

At a minimum I expect a factory which makes RoboTaxis to easily be able to make the other Models.
 
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On TSLA:

We often get stock price movement predictions wrong after an ER (because Wall St is often not rational). We’ve seen a 10% drop on a massive beat because Tesla decided to focus on manufacturing so they can actually sell more product instead of introduce new models. Wall St didn’t see this as glamorous and the stock got punished. But you can’t make more money without focusing on that kind of stuff, so it will pay off with higher production rates and margins.

Not sure where we close today. Doesn’t really matter longer term as Tesla looks super healthy and set to grow. But the big concern lately has been demand, and Elon and Zach both aggressively squished those concerns yesterday.

So while many expect red today, and I will too just to not be disappointed, I wouldn’t be surprised to see green at close either. Lots of good news last night.

I thought the call was great and there were no cringy moments.

This quarter I think Tesla will recognize 75% of their FSD revenue. And since every car that orders it will get FSD right away, that will likely increase the take rate for North American cars starting later this quarter.

Software margins are huge. Huge. And FSD ain’t cheap software, so that means $$. Coupled with Austin and Berlin ramping further, we will be on the very starting end of what I think will be a decent margin expansion.

If you get FSD right away when you buy it, and interventions drop a bit more, I think a good chunk of additional people will buy it simply for the convenience, and won’t care about the “still needs a driver” part.

Looking forward to the future and TSLA getting out of the funk it’s currently in.

With a decade of HODLing TSLA under my belt, best thing I can recommend is to ignore the TSLAQ crowd. They’re always wrong, and there’s no need to defend Tesla, as over the coming quarters, the numbers will speak for themselves.

Last thing: we saw this quarter that in a way, we don’t WANT China sales if the cars can go elsewhere…they have lower ASP and lower Tesla’s overall ASP…so I’m fine with Tesla sending Shanghai cars elsewhere!