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My point is that Tesla is still charging for rear seat heaters today. (Sure, not on current models, but they are still selling that activation.)

And it is just like the acceleration boost option, one-time and not subscription based.
On older models, yes, that's what I said, but this is a new code for .38 which Green assumes will be for used Teslas and new models. He didn't specify and didn't know what model or additional details. Then in multiple responses mentioned things like Premium connectivity being charged.

Again, this is just speculation, but he is the one who started the conversation on other Tesla forums, news articles, and X about a subscription.
 
He is a racist and a anti semite

And THIS despicable, juvenile, knuckle-dragging post is a terribly appropriate example as to why we have boundaries in this thread.

I created this thread to have a Roundtable DISCUSSION: a venue wherein intelligent, reasonable, thinking, experienced, investment-minded mature adults could present and share their insights and learn from each other.

I created this thread as an alternative to the speed-of-electrons platforms the internet provides where participants do not listen to each other but digitally blurt out verbal diarrhea; who play jejune one-upmanship; who jump on a prior such post and use it to advance their own half- or even wholly-unbaked mental synapses and consider that a "thought" - somehow something worthy of being presented to others.

And the prior sentence is exactly my since-its-creation description of what Twitter is made for: NOT a discussion center, but a posterboard for emplacing self-centered momentary thoughtlessnesses. Of all the cornucopia - may the gods of languages forgive me for the desecration of that superb word - of media present today, it is Twitter that encapsulates all that is horrific, all that is wrong, all that is destructive of the internet, and thus is the most conspicuous platform which I have excommunicated from here.

I sorely understand why there is frustration at some of the boundaries I have placed on this thread. I agonizingly long to discuss within this thread certain realities present in the all-encompassing universe that is the investment world. Of all the countless hours over the past decade+ I have spent massaging this very special investment community, a staggering amount of them have been over attempting to reconcile unbridled discussions against the more unattractive realities of the Human Condition. There is, so sadly, no happy answer. Chafe against the rules of this thread; discuss with me ways you think more accommodation could occur but if you cannot yourself abide by those rules? The alternative sites are many.
Thumbs up for the green bit, thumbs down for the white bit. Why would you contribute to the political noise by adding your hot take while condemning the board for the same?
In-post Mod-edit: The poorly-“shaped” original post now is correctly attributed. Thank you for your understanding.
 
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Meanwhile, I believe the term is gap filled. Max pain now in sight?

Not quite 'gap-filled'. Shortzes did this earlier last week too. They'll save it to come back to later. But we are within pennies of where we opened on Tuesday after the good CPI print:

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Blighters... ;)

Cheers!
 
Thumbs up for the green bit, thumbs down for the white bit. Why would you contribute to the political noise by adding your hot take while condemning the board for the same?

It was a quote from another poster, he just didn't get the brackets right or something.
Mod: Correct. Now fixed but thank you for your explanation.
 
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Further background on the software update info upthead:

green on X: "2023.38.8 brings us: 2024 base models MY RWD SR (soft-range limited to 260 mile sit seems) UI for electronic toll connector interface (needs bluetooth pairing to program) Front heated seats and heated wipers are turning into paid features (for new cars?) FCW gets R152 mode" / X​

"R152 mode" refers to the UN regulation on Automatic Emergency Braking:


And of course "FCW" refers to "Florida Championship Wrestling".

Thank-you, Google. ;)
 
Honest (after hours, heading into the weekend) question. Relative to the members in this thread, I've seen the full gambit of opinions about Elon. It ranges from love to hate. Credit to blame. Savior to devil. For the brand and stock price. So, my question is: if Elon stepped away from the CEO role and into Chief Executive Architect (or whatever), would the drama be meaningfully reduced? Does anyone genuinely think it would meaningfully affect stock price? Just curious.
 
Interesting take on how Cyber deliveries to actual customers (instead of employees) would affect Q4 earnings - can anyone who know more about accounting than I confirm?
That's not how it's been explained on this thread. COGS follows the vehicle. Going to production shifts the line costs from startup (R&D) to production (amortized across production).

Sales to employees should not be different than sales to non-employees.
 
Interesting take on how Cyber deliveries to actual customers (instead of employees) would affect Q4 earnings - can anyone who know more about accounting than I confirm?
Regardless of any accounting or earnings impact, it seems like the delivery event will be on a smaller scale than what many were hoping for.

 
if Elon stepped away from the CEO role and into Chief Executive Architect (or whatever), would the drama be meaningfully reduced? Does anyone genuinely think it would meaningfully affect stock price?

Let History be your guide: read how Henry Ford maneuvered to take his company back from shareholders in 1919. Reminder, Ford Motor (F) never became a publicly traded company until 1956. Here's an article from 2018 that drew some parallels to Henry Ford's gambit:


Now today's situation isn't exactly comparible, ie: Elon no longer intends to take Tesla private ('we've crossed that bridge'), but what we do have in the next 5 years is Elon's looming 2018 CEO comp. plan payout. Elon has over 300M shares of TSLA vested now via stock options. When and how he chooses to execute them will have a major affect on shareholders.

If he simply executes them, sells enough to cover the cost of the options and pay all the relevant payroll taxes, that's something like $100B that will be extracted from TSLA. Shortzes will pile in (again, like they did when Elon executed his much smaller 2012 CEO Comp. plan back in Nov 2021).

There is another option: Elon could pay cash for his taxes from Starlink IPO proceeds, including executing the shares at about $23/share (h/t @mongo). In this scenario, shortzes get Bupkis. :D

Do I think this is the likely scenario? Honestly, Elon could go either way, and I don't think he's decided yet. Pro and Cons, if he sells, that could lead to the SP dumping, and Elon would be able to execute most of his shares over a relatively short period with minimal taxes. I think he sees this as a 'pro' given his history.

Or, he could execute enough to initiate a stampede to the exits (shortzes assisted), then pay cash for all his remaining stock options at a very attractive price. This assumes he wants to spend Starlink derived funds on Tesla. I think they are both his babies, so he's likely to balance their needs. Pro: this approach likely keeps more shares in his hands vs. needing to sell half to cover payroll taxes.

But there's also an emotional element which should not be overlooked that will affect Elon's decision regarding his 2018 Stock Options: People (especially in the Media) love to treat him like dirt, especially when he tries to help (OUTRAGE!). It would only be human for him to be less empathetic towards those who attack him, when it comes to enriching those people via his future choices.

But thats just me talking. Elon has time-and-again shown that he is a person of great empathy and love for humanity. He may yet choose to spare those who attack him unfairly, although I would understand completely if he did not. I think at the end of the day, the Mission will come first, and other things will be made to work around what's best for accelerating the switch to sustainable energy, making humanity multiplantary, and extending the light of conciousness to the stars.

We should get a good idea how that's going on Saturday at 07:00 CST. ;)

Regards,
Lodger
 
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That's not how it's been explained on this thread. COGS follows the vehicle. Going to production shifts the line costs from startup (R&D) to production (amortized across production).

Sales to employees should not be different than sales to non-employees.
You are right about COGS.

I think Troy may have mis-wrote and meant factory line depreciation rather than COGS. Factory depreciation starts when sales of the product being produced in the factory start. So he could be right. What I don't know that is specific to Tesla is whether they treat sales to employees differently, and also whether they use a 0%/100% depreciation for the entire quarter.

If they do treat sales to employees differently AND they take 100% of the quarter's worth of depreciation (using some sort of time-based depreciation rather than through-put) even if they start deliveries midway through, then Troy's take makes sense to me. It could be a pretty big hit to operating margins if they have to take $400M worth of depreciation even if they only deliver a few hundred CTs in Q4.

On the other hand, if they depreciate based on allocated expected number of units (which I think is what you mean with your second paragraph, then it wouldn't matter. Do you know that's the depreciation method Tesla uses?
 
Interesting take on how Cyber deliveries to actual customers (instead of employees) would affect Q4 earnings - can anyone who know more about accounting than I confirm?

$400m per quarter in cybertruck specific depreciation sounds excessively high. Even adding in the depreciation of the 4680 line, it still sounds high.
It sounds more like an annual figure.

Any sale should trigger the start of depreciation even if it is to employees.