Toyota Bz4X

[Vostok]

I just saw the TV ad for the BZ4x. I was almost starting to think it was an OK ad (I didn’t recognise the car), until the tagline and Toyota logo came up.

I really have trouble with Toyota speaking with a forked tongue on EVs. Trash talking them (and by implication, their own product) in one breath, then making a glossy ad to portray the Bz4X as the best thing ever .

Why didn’t they include Sean Hanley’s comment in this ad (VP of sales at Toyota Australia)? “We think EVs are impractical for the vast majority of Australian motorists”. I mean, if they truly believe that, why aren’t they warning prospective buyers in their ad?

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

I just saw the TV ad for the BZ4x. I was almost starting to think it was an OK ad (I didn’t recognise the car), until the tagline and Toyota logo came up.

I really have trouble with Toyota speaking with a forked tongue on EVs. Trash talking them (and by implication, their own product) in one breath, then making a glossy ad to portray the Bz4X as the best thing ever .

Why didn’t they include Sean Hanley’s comment in this ad (VP of sales at Toyota Australia)? “We think EVs are impractical for the vast majority of Australian motorists”. I mean, if they truly believe that, why aren’t they warning prospective buyers in their ad?

He forgot to include "our".

"The new Toyota bZ4X. Stop driving your EV so much, damn it!"

 

[dronus]

I just saw the TV ad for the BZ4x. I was almost starting to think it was an OK ad (I didn’t recognise the car), until the tagline and Toyota logo came up.

I really have trouble with Toyota speaking with a forked tongue on EVs. Trash talking them (and by implication, their own product) in one breath, then making a glossy ad to portray the Bz4X as the best thing ever .

Why didn’t they include Sean Hanley’s comment in this ad (VP of sales at Toyota Australia)? “We think EVs are impractical for the vast majority of Australian motorists”. I mean, if they truly believe that, why aren’t they warning prospective buyers in their ad?

Is it true that it is the same car (rebranded) as the new Subaru Solterra?

Toyota

Subaru

 

[dronus]

And why would you put the charge point in front of the A pillar?
That just goes to show they have not been listening too, or are trying to make the vehicle unpopular with people who might be depending on Teslas very generous sharing of supercharger infrastructure.
How would that go with the short leads on a v2/3 supercharger?

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Is it true that it is the same car (rebranded) as the new Subaru Solterra?

Toyota



Subaru

Yes. Same powertrain. Some design and software differences.

 

[kmsyd777]

May be multiple factors at play - part of it is to still push their hydrogen tech (which has failed miserably everywhere), part because they have nothing to sell besides these 3 cars - BZ4X, Solterra and the 2 Lexus cars, they have nothing to show for themselves. They are also currently talking about having a slew of electric vehicles by 2030! That's 6 years from now, the game would already be won by then... by the new breed of manufacturers. They still need a narrative until then I guess to keep selling their ICE cars and so that's the trash EV talk.... If they continue with this track, it will be even harder for them in 2030 to make a u-turn.

 

[dronus]

May be multiple factors at play - part of it is to still push their hydrogen tech (which has failed miserably everywhere), part because they have nothing to sell besides these 3 cars - BZ4X, Solterra and the 2 Lexus cars, they have nothing to show for themselves. They are also currently talking about having a slew of electric vehicles by 2030! That's 6 years from now, the game would already be won by then... by the new breed of manufacturers. They still need a narrative until then I guess to keep selling their ICE cars and so that's the trash EV talk.... If they continue with this track, it will be even harder for them in 2030 to make a u-turn.

In my experience Toyota Fanbois and brand loyalty is strong with Toyota owners. They kinda have to be to justify paying such a premium for quite often older tech cars under the guise of “Toyota Tough”.

One of the issues they will struggle with, as you guys have all pointed out is how to fall on ones sword when the empire crumbles because the world changes and EV mandates start coming out.

Its going to be an even harder sell when changing the narrative and convincing current customers that EVs are the best, especially every morning when they look out onto their driveway and see the ICE car they are still paying off.

Short term memory and amnesia seem to work well in politics where there is less immediate physical reminders.

I suspect they will focus on new owners, ones that are not aware of the history thats being held on to with one hand and being pushed away with the other.

Would you buy the first generation of a new EV from a manufacturer who traditionally has a dislike for EVs? I guess if they dont sell it strengthens their underlaying narrative (which is also pushed by the ice funded media stories) that evs are not popular so dont buy them… keep buying ICE, report lack of EV sales out of context to reporting bodies… etc…

Words are cheap.

 

[Vostok]

In my experience Toyota Fanbois and brand loyalty is strong with Toyota owners.

One of the most satisfying days of my life was getting rid of my Toyota Camry in order to buy my Model 3.

 

[kmsyd777]

In my experience Toyota Fanbois and brand loyalty is strong with Toyota owners. They kinda have to be to justify paying such a premium for quite often older tech cars under the guise of “Toyota Tough”.

One of the issues they will struggle with, as you guys have all pointed out is how to fall on ones sword when the empire crumbles because the world changes and EV mandates start coming out.

Its going to be an even harder sell when changing the narrative and convincing current customers that EVs are the best, especially every morning when they look out onto their driveway and see the ICE car they are still paying off.

Short term memory and amnesia seem to work well in politics where there is less immediate physical reminders.

I suspect they will focus on new owners, ones that are not aware of the history thats being held on to with one hand and being pushed away with the other.

Would you buy the first generation of a new EV from a manufacturer who traditionally has a dislike for EVs? I guess if they dont sell it strengthens their underlaying narrative (which is also pushed by the ice funded media stories) that evs are not popular so dont buy them… keep buying ICE, report lack of EV sales out of context to reporting bodies… etc…

Words are cheap.

There is also something to be said about the fact that these are not cars anymore. Rather they are sophisticated computers on road which require advanced algorithms / ML / AI and some of the best software engineers to code these. Now, who has the ability to attract the best of the best - is it the Toyotas, Hondas, Suzukis, VWs, GMs, Fords or the Teslas, Rivians, Arrivals of the world?

 

[dronus]

There is also something to be said about the fact that these are not cars anymore. Rather they are sophisticated computers on road which require advanced algorithms / ML / AI and some of the best software engineers to code these. Now, who has the ability to attract the best of the best - is it the Toyotas, Hondas, Suzukis, VWs, GMs, Fords or the Teslas, Rivians, Arrivals of the world?

Absolutely!

 

[dronus]

One of the most satisfying days of my life was getting rid of my Toyota Camry in order to buy my Model 3.

But while in the Toyota ecosystem is a pretty strong confirmation bias until you step out of the circle. Was similar when i had Nissans and there is a perceived rivalry between Nissan and Toyota 4wds which inevitably ended up with more people buying more accessories or newer cars, so fuels someone profits

I really loved my calais, but i dont miss it at all now that i have a model 3. So its the same thing, just another brand. If im still alive in 10 years it might be something else haha

 

[Jules22]

One of the most satisfying days of my life was getting rid of my Toyota Camry in order to buy my Model 3.

Still have a Camry, but it's days are numbered. As soon as the new Model Y comes out, it'll be replaced.

Would love a refreshed RHD S or X, but I think that's a ways off.

 

[paulp]

But while in the Toyota ecosystem is a pretty strong confirmation bias until you step out of the circle. Was similar when i had Nissans and there is a perceived rivalry between Nissan and Toyota 4wds which inevitably ended up with more people buying more accessories or newer cars, so fuels someone profits

I really loved my calais, but i dont miss it at all now that i have a model 3. So its the same thing, just another brand. If im still alive in 10 years it might be something else haha

All of the above also applies to tesla

 

[paulp]

And why would you put the charge point in front of the A pillar?
That just goes to show they have not been listening too, or are trying to make the vehicle unpopular with people who might be depending on Teslas very generous sharing of supercharger infrastructure.
How would that go with the short leads on a v2/3 supercharger?

Looks like they left the black transport wrapping on the entire front fender to protect it from the stretched cable

 

[paulp]

There is also something to be said about the fact that these are not cars anymore. Rather they are sophisticated computers on road which require advanced algorithms / ML / AI and some of the best software engineers to code these. Now, who has the ability to attract the best of the best - is it the Toyotas, Hondas, Suzukis, VWs, GMs, Fords or the Teslas, Rivians, Arrivals of the world?

That would explain why the tesla tacc, lane keeping, wipers, and voice system are so ordinary/flakey

 

[Max Spaghetti]

There is also something to be said about the fact that these are not cars anymore. Rather they are sophisticated computers on road which require advanced algorithms / ML / AI and some of the best software engineers to code these. Now, who has the ability to attract the best of the best - is it the Toyotas, Hondas, Suzukis, VWs, GMs, Fords or the Teslas, Rivians, Arrivals of the world?

The software in a vehicle has nothing to do with the type of motor that powers it or the source of energy for that motor.

 

[Max Spaghetti]

And why would you put the charge point in front of the A pillar?

So people with bikes or trailers on the back can charge?

 

[dan_brooks]

The AWD specs look a little lack luster for $80k

 

[dronus]

So people with bikes or trailers on the back can charge?

Im not sure that the cable from the charger will reach the A pillar though. On tesla SC anyway. The drive in evie chargers woukd be fine

 

[kmsyd777]

The software in a vehicle has nothing to do with the type of motor that powers it or the source of energy for that motor.

That is true but I think consumer expectations are shifting as well - the dash screens are becoming larger and larger in every car / ute / truck. Very soon people will expect every car incl a $20K small one to be able to do sophisticated trip planning, autonomous or semi autonomous driving, every aspect of the car be app controlled etc, which requires a platform architecture designed akin to a computer rather than a traditional car. Yes, the fuel / energy source can be anything - but that computer will need to alert the driver on their app "hey it's too hot for me out here, park me under a shade", "your left rear wheel seems to be losing air pressure more than normal, get it checked", "I will give a better mileage if you avoid driving on this terrain on your way to Canberra e.g.", "you have 40% tank left, the Shell on your way to work tomorrow is likely to be the cheapest to fill up"... If the car is supposed to do all this 6-8 years from today, they have to start hiring those software engineers now.

And the car should do all this without being prompted or asked.