Track Day with the Model 3

[race4life81]

Couldn't agree more. That's why I have a Model 3 and a BRZ.
Semi slicks like AR-1 and A048 have a very short shelf life though. If you don't track a lot, the rubber goes off just sitting in the garage.. and after a while, they are not any better than something like PS4S and A08R

I think I am done buying ICE cars or spending stupid money upgrading components (been there done that). The reason I bought the performance model was for having fun on track days.. if I really want to start lap times I will do that in Forza ( have a proper sim setup) and not worry about upgrades, tyres n such. I am not a hardcore track person, its probably something that I will do may be once every couple of months for a track day.

I will get into proper track days once I retire lol … with an electric mx-5 or similar..

Why regen to minimum? Surely that will just lean harder on your brakes? I would have thought using the motors to slow you would take work from the brakes. I'd run maximum regen in track mode. Unless there is a reason I shouldn't?

I think having regen at 100% increases the battery heat. I am not sure what the options will be .. I will try a session with regen at 100 and another with regen at mid point and regen off.. or the other way around.. I want the battery warm enough for a quick charge mid way through the day.. being the first time at a track with BEV for me there are a lot of unknowns at the moment.

 

[race4life81]

A part of me wants 19s for the road... only because these 20s are so damn easy to scrape. 2 wheels with kerb rash in a month of ownership (1 for me and 1 the other half) and neither from being really stupid. You only have to breath near a kerb and they are scraped. The rims stick out so much

Yep the missus has scratched both the front rims (doesn’t help that the car is lowered and with spacers) .. even after getting fixed a few weeks into owning the car.. i am done getting these repaired for the moment.. once they are super scratched I will probably get them repaired and powder coated in matte black or similar..

 

[drtimhill]

Why regen to minimum? Surely that will just lean harder on your brakes? I would have thought using the motors to slow you would take work from the brakes. I'd run maximum regen in track mode. Unless there is a reason I shouldn't?

I've tried it both ways and preferred w/o regen, just because of the feel and fun-factor (I use regen/one-pedal all the time though when normally driving). Disadvantages are, as you note, it puts more stress on the brakes, and uses more power, but you get better control when doing sharp braking into a turn (well, I do, though I'm no track-fiend).

 

[Maximillan]

Interesting video, in it he explains why he's turned down regen for the laps.

 

[jamesgo]

So did a day at Sandown (Melb).

First off being 33 degrees isn't the best today, so running the air-con pretty high all day. So I did a quick charge on the way via the 50kw DCFC at Monash Uni (bumped into the BYD guy there and he told me all about his blade battery and its 0-100 14sec speed and that it was under $50k and i'm thinking, well, under $50k you're not going to get much of a car).

Go to the track at 95% and at the end of the first run I was at 66%.

Now something I didn't know is there are a lot of 3 phase 32A 8kw power points in the carpark (there every 10m along the lower carpark wall), luckily in my boot I had a Gen2 Mobile Connector Adaptor (Model3, ModelS/X 'Raven') - EVchargers - EV cables and adaptors so I plugged in and worked great.
So charged up to 75%

Did the next session and back down to 50%.
Average Energy is 670 Wh/km for this session

Lunchtime, so I headed down to the Evie 350kw Ultra Fast at the Caltex Dandenong. Nice 142kw charging, by the time I finished lunch I was at 85% (cost $15.92), headed back to the track.

Started the next session at 83%, Finished it at 54%, Plugged back in to the 32A in the carpark, got to 62% before the next session. ended it at 38%

After seeing a car go off in front i'm like.. yeah, i'm good, time to go home. So 122km done (Wonder if I can claim it as offroad use with Vicroads for the EV tax...)

So, I created a Track driver profile before I left with everything set and Autopilot/Safety stuff all off. Weirdly twice, the Emergency Lane Departure Assistance and Automatic Emergency Braking some how switched on again so at the start of two sessions I nearly lost it on the first corner.

So how did the Model 3 LR Acceleration Boost go... (caveat previous car was a slightly modified Euro)

So whilst it has nice power (I was hitting 210km/h on the straights quite easily) it feels like it doesn't have much punch at the high speeds compared to the modern euro ICE which showed on the track. Also while i'm sure its great in America at the dragstrips the first corner you hit, you remember just how bad the front seats are (made for comfort not for sport driving). The suspension seemed well sorted but damn the traction control... So it lets the rear slip a bit then it grabs and gives you this crap sideways head snap (remember your're wearing a helmet).

Anyway, I got the brake light warning a few times so I didn't push too hard and tried both with Regen low and Standard, to be honest, no real difference, cause you end up modulating with the accelerator/brake anyway.

If I was to keep the car long term, i'd probably go get those Unplugged Performance upgrades.

 

[Kevsaccount]

Interesting video, in it he explains why he's turned down regen for the laps.

This is a great vid, thanks Max!

 

[race4life81]

So did a day at Sandown (Melb).

First off being 33 degrees isn't the best today, so running the air-con pretty high all day. So I did a quick charge on the way via the 50kw DCFC at Monash Uni (bumped into the BYD guy there and he told me all about his blade battery and its 0-100 14sec speed and that it was under $50k and i'm thinking, well, under $50k you're not going to get much of a car).

Go to the track at 95% and at the end of the first run I was at 66%.

Now something I didn't know is there are a lot of 3 phase 32A 8kw power points in the carpark (there every 10m along the lower carpark wall), luckily in my boot I had a Gen2 Mobile Connector Adaptor (Model3, ModelS/X 'Raven') - EVchargers - EV cables and adaptors so I plugged in and worked great.
So charged up to 75%

Did the next session and back down to 50%.
Average Energy is 670 Wh/km for this session

Lunchtime, so I headed down to the Evie 350kw Ultra Fast at the Caltex Dandenong. Nice 142kw charging, by the time I finished lunch I was at 85% (cost $15.92), headed back to the track.

Started the next session at 83%, Finished it at 54%, Plugged back in to the 32A in the carpark, got to 62% before the next session. ended it at 38%

View attachment 758739

After seeing a car go off in front i'm like.. yeah, i'm good, time to go home. So 122km done (Wonder if I can claim it as offroad use with Vicroads for the EV tax...)

So, I created a Track driver profile before I left with everything set and Autopilot/Safety stuff all off. Weirdly twice, the Emergency Lane Departure Assistance and Automatic Emergency Braking some how switched on again so at the start of two sessions I nearly lost it on the first corner.

So how did the Model 3 LR Acceleration Boost go... (caveat previous car was a slightly modified Euro)

So whilst it has nice power (I was hitting 210km/h on the straights quite easily) it feels like it doesn't have much punch at the high speeds compared to the modern euro ICE which showed on the track. Also while i'm sure its great in America at the dragstrips the first corner you hit, you remember just how bad the front seats are (made for comfort not for sport driving). The suspension seemed well sorted but damn the traction control... So it lets the rear slip a bit then it grabs and gives you this crap sideways head snap (remember your're wearing a helmet).

Anyway, I got the brake light warning a few times so I didn't push too hard and tried both with Regen low and Standard, to be honest, no real difference, cause you end up modulating with the accelerator/brake anyway.

If I was to keep the car long term, i'd probably go get those Unplugged Performance upgrades.

Great rundown. Thanks for that. Yeah its gonna be 35 on Wednesday so might not be a great day either. I think a lot of the 'restrictions' in the car go away with track mode in the perf model.

The seats well yeah that's something Tesla needs to fix. one of my mates has a M3 Comp pack and his seat is so much better for a lateral grip.
How did your tyres / brakes go ?

 

[jamesgo]

Well the tyres I didn't care for because they were being changed (just got done this morning). It's more the alignment is the issue. Not sure if you've done many Sandown track days but the quickest way through T11 & T12 is basically to straightline it like the V8's do, but yeah it's not the best for the alignment.

I think the Model3 would do better at Philip Island given the track layout but yeah given how quickly the charge went at Sandown, charging will be a big issue down there as there is no Ultrafast DCFC close to the circuit.

The brakes... hmm... well they aren't cross drilled slotted like the Euro like i'm used to so they heat up pretty quick (the Perf is the same in that regard), but that might be me being used to better braking performance. I was reading in the USA supposedly a cheap effective upgrade that is popular is to put on Camaro/Cadillac CTS-V brakes onto the Model 3.

It did occur to me I don't think I reset the Trip correct as the km and kwh seem lower than it should have been.

On Wednesday I think it's meant to rain in the late afternoon, I assume you'll be gone by then but if you are there, just remember that Sandown has a pretty average surface and different quality in different sections, so differing grip level. (They're not investing as it's meant to be closed down to make way for for apartments cause.. Sandown exit talks confirmed | Dandenong Star Journal

 

[jamesgo]

Actually one thing, as the charge level goes down the difference in power was noticeable, in particular once you got under around 60%, that out of corner acceleration punch wasn't the same.

 

[m3rwd]

Actually one thing, as the charge level goes down the difference in power was noticeable, in particular once you got under around 60%, that out of corner acceleration punch wasn't the same.

Thanks for sharing your experience at Sandown! It was very insightful seeing how EVs work on the track.

I wonder when we will start seeing EV track focused cars (something simple and lightweight like a MX5 or Lotus) rather than just EV high performance cars. I can imagine they will be just as fun as ICE track cars, handle better and be cheaper to run. The next EV only Boxster/Cayman will be interesting.

 

[Culfy]

L

Thanks for sharing your experience at Sandown! It was very insightful seeing how EVs work on the track.

I wonder when we will start seeing EV track focused cars (something simple and lightweight like a MX5 or Lotus) rather than just EV high performance cars. I can imagine they will be just as fun as ICE track cars, handle better and be cheaper to run. The next EV only Boxster/Cayman will be interesting.

Lotus are going EV only from after their "new" car that has just launched. Evora/Exige are no more. I cannot imagine them not doing a skateboard, though theoretically that's what the Tesla Roadster is anyway!

 

[Culfy]

So did a day at Sandown (Melb).

First off being 33 degrees isn't the best today, so running the air-con pretty high all day. So I did a quick charge on the way via the 50kw DCFC at Monash Uni (bumped into the BYD guy there and he told me all about his blade battery and its 0-100 14sec speed and that it was under $50k and i'm thinking, well, under $50k you're not going to get much of a car).

Go to the track at 95% and at the end of the first run I was at 66%.

Now something I didn't know is there are a lot of 3 phase 32A 8kw power points in the carpark (there every 10m along the lower carpark wall), luckily in my boot I had a Gen2 Mobile Connector Adaptor (Model3, ModelS/X 'Raven') - EVchargers - EV cables and adaptors so I plugged in and worked great.
So charged up to 75%

Did the next session and back down to 50%.
Average Energy is 670 Wh/km for this session

Lunchtime, so I headed down to the Evie 350kw Ultra Fast at the Caltex Dandenong. Nice 142kw charging, by the time I finished lunch I was at 85% (cost $15.92), headed back to the track.

Started the next session at 83%, Finished it at 54%, Plugged back in to the 32A in the carpark, got to 62% before the next session. ended it at 38%

View attachment 758739

After seeing a car go off in front i'm like.. yeah, i'm good, time to go home. So 122km done (Wonder if I can claim it as offroad use with Vicroads for the EV tax...)

So, I created a Track driver profile before I left with everything set and Autopilot/Safety stuff all off. Weirdly twice, the Emergency Lane Departure Assistance and Automatic Emergency Braking some how switched on again so at the start of two sessions I nearly lost it on the first corner.

So how did the Model 3 LR Acceleration Boost go... (caveat previous car was a slightly modified Euro)

So whilst it has nice power (I was hitting 210km/h on the straights quite easily) it feels like it doesn't have much punch at the high speeds compared to the modern euro ICE which showed on the track. Also while i'm sure its great in America at the dragstrips the first corner you hit, you remember just how bad the front seats are (made for comfort not for sport driving). The suspension seemed well sorted but damn the traction control... So it lets the rear slip a bit then it grabs and gives you this crap sideways head snap (remember your're wearing a helmet).

Anyway, I got the brake light warning a few times so I didn't push too hard and tried both with Regen low and Standard, to be honest, no real difference, cause you end up modulating with the accelerator/brake anyway.

If I was to keep the car long term, i'd probably go get those Unplugged Performance upgrades.

This is a fantastic write up, thanks for sharing.
My wait list at The Bend has come up for this Saturday so I'll be able to experience the same issues with the seats then no doubt! I have read this article that talks about using the regen (and why you should). Did you?
Four Pro Tips for Taking Your Tesla Model 3 on the Nurburgring and Enjoying It there is a fantastic video rundown embedded.
I'll be configuring the M3P very similar to this but the jury's out on the torque on the wheel nuts, that sounds very high. Might take a torque wrench and check it after each session while it's charging though.
What pressure did you start at and did the tyres get hot? How much did the pressure change?

 

[Culfy]

The brakes... hmm... well they aren't cross drilled slotted like the Euro like i'm used to so they heat up pretty quick (the Perf is the same in that regard), but that might be me being used to better braking performance. I was reading in the USA supposedly a cheap effective upgrade that is popular is to put on Camaro/Cadillac CTS-V brakes onto the Model 3.

I've only ever had 1 set of cross drilled rotors. They started cracking at the holes and since then I've only ever had slotted.

 

[Culfy]

Actually one thing, as the charge level goes down the difference in power was noticeable, in particular once you got under around 60%, that out of corner acceleration punch wasn't the same.

One last reply! This video shows the drop off.

there is a chart set from around the 4:30 mark if you want to skip the actual tests.

 

[Culfy]

Interesting video, in it he explains why he's turned down regen for the laps.

He's not well informed. In track mode, it uses torque vectoring. When it's going straight he's correct, it's supposed to be AWD, the FWD/RWD setting is only when not going straight. That's by design and he noticed but probably should have known.
On the regen braking, that would be very different in the snow, basically what he's saying is that using regen braking destabilises the car, because he's completely releasing the throttle, what he's actually doing is applying the brakes (releasing the throttle applies the brakes). I wonder if he's driven a Model 3 on the road, where you need to keep 5% throttle on to let it coast? I don't see this as a reason to turn down regen, I see this as a reason to slowly learn the car before throwing it at a corner at full tilt.
He's spot on that car manufacturers should stop making FWD cars though! Haha

 

[jamesgo]

Porsche will have some nice track ready EV's coming it seems, they didn't go skateboard style, to allow the car to be lower height:

 

[jamesgo]

One last reply! This video shows the drop off.

there is a chart set from around the 4:30 mark if you want to skip the actual tests.

Hmm.. so evidently my gut feel around the 60% mark for the big drop off was right.

The car started to feel like a Diesel, great launch but then no top-end, so as the other ICE cars got quicker as they day went with their lower fuel weight to carry around I was getting slower (until I Ultra Fast charged).

 

[jamesgo]

This is a fantastic write up, thanks for sharing.
My wait list at The Bend has come up for this Saturday so I'll be able to experience the same issues with the seats then no doubt! I have read this article that talks about using the regen (and why you should). Did you?
Four Pro Tips for Taking Your Tesla Model 3 on the Nurburgring and Enjoying It there is a fantastic video rundown embedded.
I'll be configuring the M3P very similar to this but the jury's out on the torque on the wheel nuts, that sounds very high. Might take a torque wrench and check it after each session while it's charging though.
What pressure did you start at and did the tyres get hot? How much did the pressure change?

I have to say, I think The Bend will be one of the best circuits for EV's in Australia. New track condition and there is two Ultra Fast Chargers less than 10mins down the road.

About the Regen, I ended up leaving it on most of the day and if needing to coast you just do that touch of the pedal where it doesn't activate... I did the first session with it off and my Energy loss was so massive from 95% to 66% I was like.. damn at that rate i'm not going to last long. So yeah the regen at least helped capture some of that power for the later sessions.

 

[Culfy]

I have to say, I think The Bend will be one of the best circuits for EV's in Australia. New track condition and there is two Ultra Fast Chargers less than 10mins down the road.

About the Regen, I ended up leaving it on most of the day and if needing to coast you just do that touch of the pedal where it doesn't activate... I did the first session with it off and my Energy loss was so massive from 95% to 66% I was like.. damn at that rate i'm not going to last long. So yeah the regen at least helped capture some of that power for the later sessions.

Yeah, it just seems like it introduces a little tail wiggle under brakes if rear biased so it'll probably feel a little like the Astra Turbo used to. I'll get used to it. How did the brake discs hold up? Also, did you monitor the tyre pressures?

 

[race4life81]

Write up after Sandown yesterday, videos still yet to be sorted and uploaded.

Session 1- 9:30 AM : Battery 90%+; tyre pressure - 36psi cold (way too high). 50/50 split. ESP- 0. Best Lap : 1:33:8

TM3P is a great track car. It was very hot yesterday with temperature already at 32 by 9:30 AM. As I hadn't done track day in a long long time, I was put in group A. The first session was really good as the car around the track. Plenty of poke and overtook most of the cars in Lap 1(except a pesky Mustang GT which was modded). What I didn't do was let down the tires and was still doing laps at 38 cold (which is way too high). Regen was on at 100% for the first couple of laps and the battery got very hot very fast. Took the regen down to 50% for the next 2 laps and on the second lap, the brakes were almost cooked. Ended the 6 lap session at 65% battery. tyre pressure was 42 when I checked at the end of session 1.

Session 2: 10:45 AM: Battery 66%; tyre pressure - 38 hot (still too high). 40/60 split ESP at -3. Best Lap : 1:35.1

Started the session with regen at 0. Great first lap, that pesky Mustang was behind me now and making up places real quick. Second Lap, the brakes completely faded and I went off the track at Turn 1 and the already way too high curb banged on the battery.. came back to paddock to check for any damage (couldn't see any) so went back out. Regen on and 40/60 front back split with stability control at -2. Ended this session with 30% battery left and all drivetrain components warm/hot.

Took a break and went down to EVIE charger. Maxed out the charging at 190kw/h went up to 90 in about 26 mins (battery was already pretty warm so that might have helped).

Session 3: 12:45 PM. Battery 88%; tyre pressure - 34 hot. 40/60 split ESP at -10. Best Lap 1:31.4

This was the best session by far mainly due to battery being high enough and got some tyre pressure tips from one of the other crews running a different Mustang. Regen was on for the first 2 laps and then off for the remainder of the laps. Brakes were pretty much useless after lap 4. The rear motor was already orange while on the out lap, second lap got the best time of the day. third lap spun and damn nearly crashed into the wall at the last corner. Took it easy the rest of the lap and put one more lap before the brakes were gone. Lap 5 was a leisure lap. Battery at the end of the session was down to 62%.

Session 4: 2:15 PM Battery 55% tyre pressure - 32 hot. 40/60 split ESP at -10 Bet Lap : 1:34.8

Battery was slightly orange on the out lap. Got one good lap with regen at 100% and then it was done. Tried to do better in the next couple of laps, there was no punch above 80k, even though the acc pedal was flat to the floor. Brakes held up ok for 2 laps and then the same. Battery was 30% at the end of the session. So thought it was hot enough and I'd get no more out of the car / brakes.

Positives:

• Unplugged performance springs + upgrades sway bars are awesome for throwing it around the track.
• Almost kept up with modded Mustang on semi slicks for 2 laps & beat a couple of stripped out 86s / mx5s and pulsar sss.
• Tyres held up relatively well (if I had good tyre pressure management would've been better)
• Surprisingly quick even with ESP turned off.
• Got a lot of people looking asking questions on how it did.
• Topped out at 210 on the back straight in Session 1.

Negatives:

• It was too hot to run regen at 100% but the brakes would fade away in 2 laps so had no choice.
• Brakes were utterly uninspiring in fact I couldn't push the car as much as I could due to lack of confidence in brakes (especially after going off track in session 2).
• Performance when battery is below 60% is just *sugar* & it gets worse as the battery gets warm and low in charge.
• While Pirelli P Zero was good enough, stickier tyres would get better lap times.
• Brakes
• Brakes
• Brakes