[Update: It happened] Track Mode not happening for P3d-

[Perry]

That's an excellent question. I wonder the same thing. I'm sure they have the upgraded brakes and calipers on hand. Nothing in PUP *should* be difficult logistically for a retrofit. It *should* be cheaper than the 5k refund check. And there is precedent for after delivery hardware upgrades already (AP HW3). Nothing about this car makes much sense honestly.

Personally I hope they don't offer the PUP upgrade as a buy-in prerequisite to obtaining Track Mode because I don't want those parts. I hope they just release TM the way it is because it will work fine for P-.

 

[Perry]

Track Mode is very aggressive with how it uses the brakes to act as a Limited Slip Differential. I've tracked my car about 5x times now and already need new rear pads, i literally cannot do another HPDE without metal on metal contact and regen is my best friend right now.

Don't want to sound smug but I think its because you are on the stock P+ brakes which aren't that good at heat dissipation and not really track ready. This is why on my P- I opted for the MPP big brake kit with larger rotors which are vented, slotted, and lighter and race brake pads. No heat soaked brakes with this setup even under extreme driving.

But I do agree that we need a higher regen setting.

why isn't Tesla releasing Track Mode for the P3D-? it's not about cannibalizing sales since that car model isn't offered anymore, therefore it really must be something related to the hardware on the car, no?

Its got nothing to do with hardware. The more likely reason has been explained in previous posts.

 

[kbecks13]

Don't want to sound smug but I think its because you are on the stock P+ brakes which aren't that good at heat dissipation and not really track ready. This is why on my P- I opted for the MPP big brake kit with larger rotors which are vented, slotted, and lighter and race brake pads. No heat soaked brakes with this setup even under extreme driving

I'm trying to express how the stock Model 3 needs the higher end pads that the PUP comes with. You can watch Cameron Rogers videos at Laguna Seca with the RWD and see how he destroyed them, yet now his P3D+ can do great with stock pads.

And that is a bit smug - what kinda times ya got?

 

[Perry]

I'm trying to express how the stock Model 3 needs the higher end pads that the PUP comes with. You can watch Cameron Rogers videos at Laguna Seca with the RWD and see how he destroyed them, yet now his P3D+ can do great with stock pads.

And that is a bit smug - what kinda times ya got?

I had to do it . To many hits here on the poor P- when in fact it can be more capable than the stock P+ with the proper mods. And guess who is more likely to properly outfit their car for the track? Not the P+, they already think they are track ready. No, its the P- that was bought with the sole purpose of being moded.

But yes we agree. We all need better pads and better rotors for both P+/- on the track. That's why I believe Track Mode is deserved by both.

 

[kbecks13]

And guess who is more likely to properly outfit their car for the track? Not the P+, they already think they are track ready.

No one who actually races and has a P+ thinks that, but yea definitely don't wanna spend the money and you have a $5K advantage I've delayed getting new rotors and have done basically everything short of that, but yea it needs it. They overheated after about 2.5 very hard laps at Buttonwillow (2:04-2:05 lap times) with upgraded pads and fluid.

 

[Lucky13]

It would be sweet if they just gave us the cooling benefits of track mode. Honestly at this point it's all I want. I was not even able to get in two full laps before power gets reduced tremendously.(button willow)

Seat of the pants tells me at least 40% power reduction.

 

[MXWing]

In reality the Stealth trim should have never existed, or it should have never existed without the upgraded brakes being included, even if it meant them needing to come up with a cheaper wheel for the non PUP version. They made a horrible mistake with this car. They rushed it out too soon, they made terrible decisions after it was released and until they can make everyone completely whole I am certain they will continue to pay for it in the future.

The crazy thing is there was a point where where there was no 3P-. 3P only.

Don’t know the full story but assumed people complained and said I don’t want track mode I just went fast but cheaper. 3P- was born. 3P- was fine if Tesla would have just added one bullet point that said “and unannounced software features exclusive to 3P+”.

I had to do it . To many hits here on the poor P- when in fact it can be more capable than the stock P+ with the proper mods. And guess who is more likely to properly outfit their car for the track? Not the P+, they already think they are track ready. No, its the P- that was bought with the sole purpose of being moded.

We both know that no factory option in the history of anything is fast enough, good enough, or cheap enough.

I don’t like my setup with + but I understand that’s what Tesla built their TM off of.

A good question to ask is why Tesla didn’t optimize every single component to do even better on the track? They have Probst FFS. They wouldn’t be able to sell that same package due to scale, expense, or any number of factors. They can't run a 3P customized exactly the way @Perry would because that model would be a "concept car" and not for sale.

So where are we at?
3P- / Good for straight line. Economy brakes, economy wheels. $5K Cheaper
3P+/ Beefier non straight line, track infrastructure. Track mode developed with said infrastructure in mind. $5K more

Tesla thought themselves as clever and failed. Those who thought they were more clever than Tesla also failed.

There's precedence for this.

So contrary to very popular belief, Tesla existed before the Model 3.

Once upon a time there was a Model X. The Model X came with premium interior and non premium interior options. The residents of the land wished "I don't want to spend $5K on PUP! I just want the biodefense filter!" Tesla, being "clever" as they were, said here you go: "Enhanced Air Quality Package. $750". $50 worth of parts and a software toggle for $750! The fools!
The residents rejoiced and eagerly snapped up the EAQP. They were dancing in the streets and said "Look how clever we are!. Stupid Tesla fools! Why pay $5000 for a bunch of bull *sugar* when we can pay only $750 and get what we really want!".

Tesla being distressed AF, desperately needing cash realized they made a monumental mistake.
Why make $50 off $750 when we can make $5,000 off of $150!

Tesla then wisely decided to be "out of stock" and then delisted on the EAQP. How is this possible since EAQP is installed on every Model S or Model X with PUP being standard..? Who knows?! Perhaps the answer was as simple as pay to play.

--

It wasn't blind luck that I believed TM would have required 3P+.

 

[Perry]

It would be sweet if they just gave us the cooling benefits of track mode. Honestly at this point it's all I want. I was not even able to get in two full laps before power gets reduced tremendously.(button willow)

Seat of the pants tells me at least 40% power reduction.

Yea I know its terrible. For me after about one lap performance starts getting reduced. After two laps the pedal becomes as limp as an ICE car. It kind of forces you to drive differently by having to maintain more speed on the corners but lower your overall speed. Not ideal.

 

[Perry]

The crazy thing is there was a point where where there was no 3P-. 3P only.

Don’t know the full story but assumed people complained and said I don’t want track mode I just went fast but cheaper. 3P- was born. 3P- was fine if Tesla would have just added one bullet point that said “and unannounced software features exclusive to 3P+”.



We both know that no factory option in the history of anything is fast enough, good enough, or cheap enough.

I don’t like my setup with + but I understand that’s what Tesla built their TM off of.

A good question to ask is why Tesla didn’t optimize every single component to do even better on the track? They have Probst FFS. They wouldn’t be able to sell that same package due to scale, expense, or any number of factors. They can't run a 3P customized exactly the way @Perry would because that model would be a "concept car" and not for sale.

So where are we at?
3P- / Good for straight line. Economy brakes, economy wheels. $5K Cheaper
3P+/ Beefier non straight line, track infrastructure. Track mode developed with said infrastructure in mind. $5K more

Tesla thought themselves as clever and failed. Those who thought they were more clever than Tesla also failed.

There's precedence for this.

So contrary to very popular belief, Tesla existed before the Model 3.

Once upon a time there was a Model X. The Model X came with premium interior and non premium interior options. The residents of the land wished "I don't want to spend $5K on PUP! I just want the biodefense filter!" Tesla, being "clever" as they were, said here you go: "Enhanced Air Quality Package. $750". $50 worth of parts and a software toggle for $750! The fools!
The residents rejoiced and eagerly snapped up the EAQP. They were dancing in the streets and said "Look how clever we are!. Stupid Tesla fools! Why pay $5000 for a bunch of bull *sugar* when we can pay only $750 and get what we really want!".

Tesla being distressed AF, desperately needing cash realized they made a monumental mistake.
Why make $50 off $750 when we can make $5,000 off of $150!

Tesla then wisely decided to be "out of stock" and then delisted on the EAQP. How is this possible since EAQP is installed on every Model S or Model X with PUP being standard..? Who knows?! Perhaps the answer was as simple as pay to play.

--

It wasn't blind luck that I believed TM would have required 3P+.

Yea, I guess you've been around longer to see this. I just arrived on the scene in Q3 2018.
But like I said earlier, I still would not have bought the P+ just for Track Mode. Had I bought a few days later it would have been included in the same price I paid.

 

[MXWing]

Yea, I guess you've been around longer to see this. I just arrived on the scene in Q3 2018.
But like I said earlier, I still would not have bought the P+ just for Track Mode. Had I bought a few days later it would have been included in the same price I paid.

I would have encouraged you to get the 3P+ and then part it out if I knew you better and what your stronger preferences were.

I hope since the 3P- was such a limited release and for good will Tesla just pushes it out. You’ve argued it was easy software.

The paradox is if it was easy, why isn’t it out?

Dealing with asymmetric information is a bitch!

I could be wrong but one area of consolation is I think your car will hold it’s value well given you have a 5000 guard against depreciation no matter what happens.

 

[ElectricGhost]

Track mode would have been fun to play with, but nothing more than that. Most P3D- will ever see the track. Those buyers were more practical thinkers.

I still think I got bargain with the credit. They will probably hold there value more than other trims.

I’m surprised how many were purchased. I suspect a lot were sold in the snow belt that thought a lot about snow tires, but still wanted the most performance they could get. And you got the range of the AWD to boot. Win, win, win.

If track mode comes, great. If not, no biggy.

They dont hold their value. I had to fight with carmax to convince then it was a P3D- since its VIN is just awd. It has wreak history ($7,000 in repairs thanks to someone rear ending me) but they offered me $47,000 for it.

 

[MXWing]

They dont hold their value. I had to fight with carmax to convince then it was a P3D- since its VIN is just awd. It has wreak history ($7,000 in repairs thanks to someone rear ending me) but they offered me $47,000 for it.

What was your Maroney sticker price? EAP/FSD?

KBB and CarMax cannot properly value Tesla cars.

Nov 2016 Model S > Feb 2017 Model S > Sep 2016 Model S.

How can carmax or kbb value the above scenario correctly? They cannot.

 

[Glamisduner]

VIN should be the same for AWD/P3D-/P3D+. They all show up as AWD in the VIN. At least they did last summer, unless it's different now?

The P3d+ vins are different because they have different suspension and brake parts associated with them.

 

[MP3Mike]

The P3d+ vins are different because they have different suspension and brake parts associated with them.

I don't recall Tesla having a digit/code assigned for that. Do you have a reference to back that up?

 

[MXWing]

The P3d+ vins are different because they have different suspension and brake parts associated with them.

I don't recall Tesla having a digit/code assigned for that. Do you have a reference to back that up?

Pretty sure our friend @Glamisduner is incorrect here.

No reason to believe the following decoder has changed.

The only one of any significance thus far is 8th digit. Single or dual motor.

 

[happyzod]

They dont hold their value. I had to fight with carmax to convince then it was a P3D- since its VIN is just awd. It has wreak history ($7,000 in repairs thanks to someone rear ending me) but they offered me $47,000 for it.

Did it have EAP? If not, then $47,000 does not sound unreasonable and hear me out here as I do the math.

P3D- was $64,000 base last year.
Add paint for $1,500.
Subtract the $5000 rebate.
Subtract $7,500 tax credit.

The new base value of the car is $53,000 after factoring in credits and discounts.
Now we need to factor in diminished value for being in an accident (5-10%) and 1st year depreciation (10-20%). That's a range of $37,000 to $45,000. If you had bought EAP, then the number becomes $42,000 to 50,000 which is pretty much right smack in the middle of the carmax offer.

 

[NathanielHrnblwr]

Facts don’t matter in a civil jury trial.

Sadly, you are correct. Sitting on a jury as an alternate and watching the evidence folder never get opened while the jury deliberated about how they felt and who they believed while not being able to say anything was one of the most frustrating and eye opening experiences I've had.

The P3d+ vins are different because they have different suspension and brake parts associated with them.

Incorrect.

 

[Glamisduner]

I don't recall Tesla having a digit/code assigned for that. Do you have a reference to back that up?

I could swear I read it on the forum but I can't find it now (could have been speculation). I might be mistaken. But the drive train parts are different so it should have a different vin? And here all this time I thought I was getting a better deal on my insurance.

edit, damn ok I must be wrong yesh

 

[MP3Mike]

But the drive train parts are different so it should have a different vin?

But the drive train parts aren't different. (At least we can't find any evidence that they are.) And Tesla does use the digit on the VIN in the S&X for the performance models that have different drive train parts.

 

[focher]

The Performance configuration of a Model 3 has exactly the same VIN decoding as an AWD configuration. I went through this with CarMax, who had no way to identify the car as a Performance until they looked at the Maroney sticker and the console showing Track Mode available.

Sorry to say for all the non PUP buyers of the Performance, but it's highly unlikely you're getting Track Mode.