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Multiple people from this forum and the TM forum have confirmed with the TM people in Fremont that the SigXs being produced now will only have a 48amp onboard charger. You can contact North American sales and confirm...and voice your desire for the 72amp charger...
Just another reference point: I was told that ONLY the 48 amp charger is available.
[email protected]
In my case, from Tesla directly. I have been working on a project to upgrade the capacity to my garage to support Model X, and when it became public knowledge I received a call to help guide me on what I should be installing.
I’m baaack…….. This time, I will be a lot more careful with my wording.
The quote that I originally made did begin with the words, “I think”. The intention on my quote was to stimulate discussion on the subject. Based on the responses I received, it failed miserably, and I do apologize. The following opinions are from one Canadian with a sigX reservation who has been waiting & waiting & waiting[B1] .
So here we go…. I wish to clarify my now, infamous quote. The most efficient way of charging DC batteries is with Direct current. The superchargers for example, can charge our Teslas very quickly using DC, but this method of charging is currently impractical for home use. Understandably, Tesla wants us to be able to charge our vehicles at home since AC is “currently” available to us. Tesla has installed a DC charger in the vehicles to convert AC from our home to DC for battery storage and then convert back to AC to drive the motors. One may ask, where am I going with this? Well, HEAT is generated whenever large numbers of electron move in a conductor. This is why our Tesla battery pack needs to be liquid cooled. Ludicrous mode or pulling a 5,000lb Airstream up the Smokey Mountains generates a considerable amount of heat as electrons move for the pack to the motors. Unlike superchargers, most homes are limited to a maximum of 240 AC available. Heat is a by-product of electron movement & since heat is not what we want when transmitting energy, the conductor size must be proportional to amperage draw to restrict the heat generated to reasonable levels.
The HPWC cable is sized to, safely, move a maximum of 80 amps of current to the vehicle. I THINK, and it is definitely MY opinion, that Tesla has decided that the present 25’ cable which comes with the HPWC, is at the maximum size & weight that is practical for use by the homeowner. Therefore, what are their “current” options? “Very hot” cables have been reported by some owners charging @ 80 amps. To reduce the chances of litigation, I THINK that Tesla has decided to phase out the option of charging @ 80 amps. Tesla’s actions coupled with current reports, lead me to this conclusion.
Tesla MAY be “phasing out” the ability of charging @ 80 amps AC, by
1. Removing the second 40amp charger as an option which may be ordered with the Model S but, for now, leaving in, the option of adding it later.
2. Delivering the first Model X vehicles with 72 amp chargers to Founders since the HPWC will not get as warm as dual 40s when charging.
3. Lower, even further, the temperatures generated by charging @ 80 amps with the present equipment, by delivering ALL future vehicles with 48 amps charger only. Problem solved.
P.S. Information may be conveyed to present owners suggesting that they use caution when unplugging their Teslas from 80 amp charging since the connector may be uncomfortably “warm”.
[B1]
The quote that I originally made did begin with the words, “I think”. The intention on my quote was to stimulate discussion on the subject. Based on the responses I received, it failed miserably, and I do apologize. The following opinions are from one Canadian with a sigX reservation who has been waiting & waiting & waiting[B1] .
So here we go…. I wish to clarify my now, infamous quote. The most efficient way of charging DC batteries is with Direct current. The superchargers for example, can charge our Teslas very quickly using DC, but this method of charging is currently impractical for home use. Understandably, Tesla wants us to be able to charge our vehicles at home since AC is “currently” available to us. Tesla has installed a DC charger in the vehicles to convert AC from our home to DC for battery storage and then convert back to AC to drive the motors. One may ask, where am I going with this? Well, HEAT is generated whenever large numbers of electron move in a conductor. This is why our Tesla battery pack needs to be liquid cooled. Ludicrous mode or pulling a 5,000lb Airstream up the Smokey Mountains generates a considerable amount of heat as electrons move for the pack to the motors. Unlike superchargers, most homes are limited to a maximum of 240 AC available. Heat is a by-product of electron movement & since heat is not what we want when transmitting energy, the conductor size must be proportional to amperage draw to restrict the heat generated to reasonable levels.
The HPWC cable is sized to, safely, move a maximum of 80 amps of current to the vehicle. I THINK, and it is definitely MY opinion, that Tesla has decided that the present 25’ cable which comes with the HPWC, is at the maximum size & weight that is practical for use by the homeowner. Therefore, what are their “current” options? “Very hot” cables have been reported by some owners charging @ 80 amps. To reduce the chances of litigation, I THINK that Tesla has decided to phase out the option of charging @ 80 amps. Tesla’s actions coupled with current reports, lead me to this conclusion.
Tesla MAY be “phasing out” the ability of charging @ 80 amps AC, by
1. Removing the second 40amp charger as an option which may be ordered with the Model S but, for now, leaving in, the option of adding it later.
2. Delivering the first Model X vehicles with 72 amp chargers to Founders since the HPWC will not get as warm as dual 40s when charging.
3. Lower, even further, the temperatures generated by charging @ 80 amps with the present equipment, by delivering ALL future vehicles with 48 amps charger only. Problem solved.
P.S. Information may be conveyed to present owners suggesting that they use caution when unplugging their Teslas from 80 amp charging since the connector may be uncomfortably “warm”.
[B1]
If that were the case, you would see Tesla push out a software update that would disable Model S charging above a certain threshold - they're not going to bury any safety concerns they have internally. That just leads to ignition switch lawsuits and bankruptcy and stuff.
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
I didn't see your original point, but I can see why there is push back because there is a lot of evidence that your speculation is wrong.
1) J1772-AC is specified at 80A. If SAE did not think a practical user connected cable can deliver 80A, they would not specify that.
2) There have been zero public instances of HPWC catching on fire or melting AFAIK. There have been some instances of the UMC doing so (and many cases were the fault of the wall socket, not the UMC) and Tesla addressed that with updated adapters and a software update. If there was a safety concern about the HPWC, there is no reason why Tesla won't do that same.
3) There are other high amperage J1772 EVSEs available for purchase. If the issue was with the HPWC, why would Tesla not limit the HPWC (there are jumpers inside to limit them, Tesla can just change those in the newer units as they have done before). The onboard charger is independent of the HPWC. In case you make the point, the J1772 adapter is rated for 80A usage.
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I'm somewhat doubtful that Eds was talking about the charger specifically. Eds' post was many months ago and Tesla specifically confirmed the 72A charger to many of us as recently as October. This worries me even more because that means Eds was talking about something else... or more than one something. Ugh.
Seats... Falcon doors (seal issues, changing the mechanism as early as this year)... Could be a number of things. I think we can all agree he was right about it not being ready though.
He specifically stated the door mechanism changing. I think we can have high confidence that he worked for Futuris, so seats are probably the biggie. Both of those are confirmed items that are causing issues. The seals issue is potentially related to the mechanism, but I can see the challenge in that. I'm hopeful all of these things are worked out properly, and that indeed the early cars are delivered without being "compromised" (Eds word).
Delays are better than having to call cars back in for multiple service upgrades.
aesculus
Still Trying to Figure This All Out
Welcome to California. TOU is one thing, but we also have usage Tiers (up to 5 right now). Each tier comes with a higher price. The more you use the, the higher the cost. So you combine both TOU and Tiers and its really important on what you use and how you use it.
So we have to watch two factors that are interrelated. If I am at a higher Tier because of usage (charging a car can drive your Tier up) the TOU rate difference can be very large (lowest Tier off peak might be 8 cents KWH while top Tier on peak could be 50 cents kwh).
In some cases we can also force the car to be its own meter (dedicated panel) so it does not interfere with your other usage. For me using a friend to install another panel to my house, it will only be approximately $300 in parts and $100 for a permit so it won't take too long to get that payback from what would happen if I left my car on my household meter. The dedicated car TOU rates (requiring a separate panel/meter) are way less than what I would pay if I added it to my regular TOU household usage.
In the future we hope that the sub meters will come about that will meter your car usage separately even though they are connected to your household. These are only in trial mode right now.
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The review view cameras shown on the prototype.
MrBoylan
Member
goneskiian
Active Member
Easy there Mr. little!
I hope you kept reading and found my apology when the poster I was tongue lashing clarified their point. ;-)
I do understand (as well as just about anyone who doesn't actually yet own an EV, I hope) and I see the point about wanting to charge as quickly as possible at home when needed. I may have been a bit hot headed in response though as I am quite disapointed in this (yet another) move by Tesla to try and get me (and others apparently) to cancel our X reservations. It's pretty ridiculous actually.
Mark Z
Active Member
When visiting the nearby Tesla Store tonight, I noticed a new wall graphic with large text that announces that the EV is fully charged by morning, at home. IMHO, this is to emphasis to new customers to enjoy the luxury of a full range every morning by plugging in each night, at home.
Since Tesla Motors needs to free up the Superchargers for the long distant traveller, they also included a smaller graphic to explain how the Supercharger is for long distance travel.
IMHO, it is excellent to see Tesla Motors attempting to educate new and existing customers on what they consider to be the acceptable, appropriate and proper use of the Tesla Model S and X vehicles in regard to where and how they should be charged.
Since Tesla Motors needs to free up the Superchargers for the long distant traveller, they also included a smaller graphic to explain how the Supercharger is for long distance travel.
IMHO, it is excellent to see Tesla Motors attempting to educate new and existing customers on what they consider to be the acceptable, appropriate and proper use of the Tesla Model S and X vehicles in regard to where and how they should be charged.
Isn't it obvious, that early cars are being compromised, because they get only 48A charging and 72A is most likely coming later, when they have ironed out the kinks?
I can allready see 100+ pages thread about this.
We could start a poll, what will be the cost to uppdate 48A to 72A in Sigs. My guess is around 2k USD. I use second charger installation to Model S as reference
http://shop.teslamotors.com/collections/model-s/products/2nd-onboard-charger
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