My Model X was delivered to me in March 2017. I understand the production change to Hardware 2.5 was made for all X and S models delivered on or after August 2017. I prepaid for Full Self-Driving and Enhanced Auto Pilot. With the latest Auto Pilot v 9.0 there is dashcam functionality using one of the forward facing cameras but this only is active on X and S's with Hardware 2.5. Does anyone know if Tesla is willing to upgrade 2.0 hardware to 2.5 hardware if full self-driving and enhanced Auto Pilot were purchased as options or does one have to wait until full-self driving is released?
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Upgrade from Hardware 2.0 to Hardware 2.5
- Thread starter azbob
- Start date
bayx
Member
Not sure, but Elon did tweet something about hardware upgrade. However, for all we know he could have been smoking it while tweeting, so take it with a pinch of salt!
With news of hardware 3.0 in development, maybe put in cars before years end, you may want to hold out until then. That's the new in-house chipset. The current 2.5 hardware will be unable to handle FSD implementations. 2.5 is suppose to handle AP capability fine. But 3.0 will be needed for FSD.
Derek Kessler
Active Member
An upgrade of the computer was only "promised" (take that with as much salt as you like) if it would be necessary to the performance of a purchased FSD option. Dashcam is nice, but not an FSD feature. If it turns out (as is likely) that the 2.0 hardware isn't up to the task and you've purchased FSD, then Tesla should perform the computer upgrade as promised. Though by that time the 3.0 computer will be out, if not an even later version.
Yinn
Active Member
Even then. I'm willing to pay them to turn on my interior lights, active headlights, and all the PUP things that are now standard that wasn't before. But for some strange reason they don't want my $1000 and want me to buy a new P100DL for $150,000 instead.
Just read this artilcle that explains Hardware 3.0 available in about 6 months will be at no cost for anyone who originally purchased FSD.
Tesla’s new Autopilot hardware upgrade will be free for owners with the $3,000 to $5,000 ‘Full Self-Driving’ package
Tesla’s new Autopilot hardware upgrade will be free for owners with the $3,000 to $5,000 ‘Full Self-Driving’ package
If the AP 2.0 processor isn't fast enough to support FSD, Tesla appears to be promising to provide an AP processor upgrade for free, for those owners who purchased FSD.
There will likely be other changes to the AP hardware over time. Tesla will likely change the sensor suite, just like they make small changes to the designs of other elements of their vehicles. If the 3.0 version includes a faster processor and changes to sensors - AP 2.0 and 2.5 owners probably won't see those sensor changes UNLESS they are needed to achieve FSD.
So it may not be correct to state that Tesla will be updating all vehicles to AP/HW 3.0 - it's only the AP processor that is currently being discussed for free upgrades.
There will likely be other changes to the AP hardware over time. Tesla will likely change the sensor suite, just like they make small changes to the designs of other elements of their vehicles. If the 3.0 version includes a faster processor and changes to sensors - AP 2.0 and 2.5 owners probably won't see those sensor changes UNLESS they are needed to achieve FSD.
So it may not be correct to state that Tesla will be updating all vehicles to AP/HW 3.0 - it's only the AP processor that is currently being discussed for free upgrades.
bayx
Member
Tesla is not required to upgrade hardware for free, but for those to whom they sold FSD already, there might be legal implications if they need 3.0 for FSD and didn't do hardware upgrades for free...unless there is something in the fine print absolving Tesla from this (when people bought FSD/car). Any attorneys want to chime in on this topic?
wallstguy
Member
Tesla already said in I believe the last earnings call, that an upgrade would be needed, and they would upgrade all who purchased FSD to the new computer they are developing in house, which is supposedly 100x faster and has more redundancy.
Should be early next year.
Should be early next year.
Legal implications or not, there's already a differentiation between AP2 and AP2.5, the dash cam being the most prominent example. Yes Tesla will deliver FSD to 2.0 and 2.5, "eventually." If I were a betting man, I'd wager AP3 will get FSD first, then 1 year later AP2.5 then 2 years more AP2. They want to sell more cars going forward. The only money-maker by upgrading the current fleet is to capture those who haven't paid for EAP/FSD. There's no promised timeline so it's hard to go after Tesla if they state that they're working on it.
Could be the AP2 camera hardware is somehow unsuitable for the dashcam. I think AP2.5 updated some of the cameras.
Could be the AP2 computer is inadequate for handling the dashcam and normal AP processing. AP2.5 does have a different computer.
Could be AP2 doesn't have the I/O connections to the console MCU/USB ports to record on the USB stick.
Since Tesla specifies AP2.5 and not MCU2 I assume it's not an MCU restriction. there were some AP2.5 cars with MCU1's weren't there?
If the problem is only AP2 processing power, that should be fixed next year with the Tesla-chipped computer upgrade. I would hope that the dashcam would then function with AP2 hardware.
Any of the other problems might mean no dashcam ever for AP2 cars.
Could be the AP2 computer is inadequate for handling the dashcam and normal AP processing. AP2.5 does have a different computer.
Could be AP2 doesn't have the I/O connections to the console MCU/USB ports to record on the USB stick.
Since Tesla specifies AP2.5 and not MCU2 I assume it's not an MCU restriction. there were some AP2.5 cars with MCU1's weren't there?
If the problem is only AP2 processing power, that should be fixed next year with the Tesla-chipped computer upgrade. I would hope that the dashcam would then function with AP2 hardware.
Any of the other problems might mean no dashcam ever for AP2 cars.
End users have (atleast where I live) very many rights. When buying a product or a car from a company (the professional part) the end-user (the amateur part) are not expected to understand the exceptions written in fine print. It's how the product was advertised that matters, and the feature advertised as FSD is hard to misunderstand.
Writing that Tesla is not responsible anyway for providing the features they sold simply won't hold in a court. That would come out as the professional part (Tesla) doing misleading advertisement, or attempting to lead the buyer into a obvious bad contract (you bought the feature, but we told you with small letters that you won't get it if we were wrong about the hardware you bought).
There is no “original” in there. Anyone who purchases the FSD option, including those who already purchased, will get it for free.
Please let some off the new hardware processing power go towards making the touch screen reaction time closer to computers made in this century. I have a 2017 S100D and it can take 50 or more seconds to compute a gps route. My 7 year old ,$170 Garmin can do the same route in maybe 2 seconds. I don’t even use the browser because it’s so slow it’s worthless. It may sound like I don’t like the car but I live it in spite of this terrible shortfall. I am bewildered as to how a company with such a large number of obliviously very smart people cannot get this right.
The NAV 2.0 software in Tesla vehicles now doesn't do the route calculation locally. The destination and current location are sent to Tesla's cloud navigation server, which will calculate the route based on up-to-date maps and current road conditions, and then send the route back to the onboard NAV software.
If the routing is taking a long time, either Tesla's server is busy or the vehicle is in an area with poor internet connectivity.
There is a setting to disable cloud-based navigation. Disabling use of the cloud server will put the route calculations back on the onboard processor, which may produce the route faster. But because the onboard software is using obsolete map data (typically 1-2 years out of date) and doesn't have access to the most up-to-date road status, the route may not be as good as what will come from the cloud server.
The faster AP 2.5 and AP 3.0 processors are used for EAP/FSD operations - and are not general purpose processors that will be used for the NAV or other apps currently running on the console processor.
MCU1 vehicles may be upgradable to a faster console processor by purchasing an upgrade to MCU2, which should not only provide more processing power for the console apps (including the NAV software), but also provides access to a growing set of features that only run with MCU2 (camera video storage, Pole Position).
Derek Kessler
Active Member
Before anybody gets too excited, while an MCU1-to-MCU2 upgrade is technically possible (and was stated by Musk to be a thing Tesla would offer), it is not currently a service you can buy, nor can you presently buy an MCU2 and DIY it.
Also, Autopilot Dashcam is a function of AP2.5+ offering greater internal bandwidth, independent of the MCU.
Pole position works just fine on MCU1:
I thought the feature was "camera internal storage"? (MCU1 has barely any free space, where was MCU2 actually have ~30G of free space so it's possible to offer internal storage for dashcam. Though actually with the ~10G free on ape units it should be possible to do either way, but Tesla is probably worried about emmc wear down?)
