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VW ID4
- Thread starter Valore
- Start date
I am considering the ID.4 to replace my RAV4 EV. It will be an upgrade in every way except cargo volume. However, I do not think that I would be "getting more" than a Model Y. It would be justified as a cheaper but less capable EV.
Cheburashka
Active Member
It depends on your use case. 250 miles of range is more than enough for me and I don't go on enough road trips to justify the extra cost. Even if I did go on a lot of trips, here in CA there are plenty of CCS chargers. Moreso, when you add FSD to the Model Y it's even more expensive.
The ID.4 will probably have far better build quality, it has a nicer interior, and a better service network. Since this is a VW it will probably have a quieter cabin too.
You get what you pay for. Clearly the Model Y will have more range and a better charging network. If you don't value those things, you can choose a different car like the ID.4. Everyone has a different opinion about what features are important to them. That's why it's good that there are ever more choices of viable EVs. I'm really glad that we're seeing more than just Tesla producing compelling EVs.
Cheburashka
Active Member
Not likely based on what? VW build quality is worlds better than Tesla and so is the service network.
I have a Model S, 2016.5 with AP3 and MCU2 upgrade.
Many people dont understand that 80% of drivers are using their cars only for city driving and work commute.
Every time i read Tesla has 60 more miles then ID.4 i laugh.
I will trade that 60 miles which many DON`T NEED for LOWER PRICE,better quality,better service support,carplay,HUD,front lcd,better interior and many other things.
And many of us don`t need charging network (which btw is improving), we charge at home!
ID4 is currently the best deal with TAX credit if you are shopping for that kind of EV
Every time i read Tesla has 60 more miles then ID.4 i laugh.
I will trade that 60 miles which many DON`T NEED for LOWER PRICE,better quality,better service support,carplay,HUD,front lcd,better interior and many other things.
And many of us don`t need charging network (which btw is improving), we charge at home!
ID4 is currently the best deal with TAX credit if you are shopping for that kind of EV
We leased an e-Golf from 2015-2018. So, I know something about VW EV service. Let's just say that the only reason the issues the car had when new were resolved were because I got a VW e-Golf specialist from HQ involved. Customer facing dealership personnel were completely useless. This was at the largest volume e-Golf dealer in the USA. I also don't think that highly of VW's ability to build power electronics systems. There have been many instances of e-Golf cars that throw the error "Electrical System STOP" on the dash and require towing to a dealership and replacing the main power electronics box. There was also a steadily increasing proportion of Chinese made parts in the German assembled e-Golf.
I don't think our e-Golf left the Bay Area core, or even the triangle between South San Jose (~101 & 85), Berkeley, and San Francisco. Even with 84 miles of EPA range, it was perfectly usable as a second car. The problem is that people are not rational about their actual needs. They justify needing a more capable car with extremely rare circumstances that could be easily worked around, especially in a two car household.
I actually wish that M-B would get off their collective butts and figure out how to start building the EQ-C in significant volume in the USA. That would present a clearer differentiator (than VW) in interior and exterior materials and build quality compared to Tesla.
I don't think our e-Golf left the Bay Area core, or even the triangle between South San Jose (~101 & 85), Berkeley, and San Francisco. Even with 84 miles of EPA range, it was perfectly usable as a second car. The problem is that people are not rational about their actual needs. They justify needing a more capable car with extremely rare circumstances that could be easily worked around, especially in a two car household.
I actually wish that M-B would get off their collective butts and figure out how to start building the EQ-C in significant volume in the USA. That would present a clearer differentiator (than VW) in interior and exterior materials and build quality compared to Tesla.
JohnSnowNW
Active Member
Some people buy vehicles that can handle all of their needs, not 90% of them. I need a vehicle I can travel with, the ID4 isn't that vehicle...so I'm buying a Model Y.
As posted above, if range doesn't matter there are a lot more choices than just the ID4, however the Model 3 is the best selling BEV in the US, and I don't believe it's coincidental that it also has the most range in its segment.
Some people's needs don't involve traveling.
I have (adult) family that have never driven outside the state, and I doubt outside their *county* in a decade or more. A Tesla would be hilariously extravagant overkill for them.
It's all about knowing your actual needs.
When I used to take my Ford Focus Electric into the dealer it was like I took in one of those Fords built on Mars. We'll see whether VW has a ramp-up period on their service quality. I see you're in CA. Maybe the ID.4 will become a mainstream product faster there and service will ramp up accordingly.
Cheburashka
Active Member
Interesting. I had a Chevy Spark EV for 3 years and had no problem with dealer service.
That said, unlike my Model S, my Spark was only in service once over those 3 years.
That said, unlike my Model S, my Spark was only in service once over those 3 years.
InsideEV's has posted a full walkaround and first drive video. This vehicle is starting to look more and more like a really solid alternative to the Model Y + you get CarPlay, heated steering wheel and at a significantly lower price:
Volkswagen ID.4 Walkaround And First Drive: InsideEVs Exclusive
Volkswagen ID.4 Walkaround And First Drive: InsideEVs Exclusive
Phooey. The article compares to the ID.4 to the Model Y and says the range is competitive. It isn't. The Y is 326 miles and the ID.4 is 250 miles. It says it comes with 3 years of free charging at Electrify America, but EA compares poorly with Superchargers in number of locations and reliability. Per Fully Charged, the ID.3's software is poor. The ID.4's probably isn't any better at this point. I can get FSD on a Y but not an ID.4. That by itself is a dealbreaker for me. It's true the ID.4 has a lower price, but you can't buy one now. The Y is available now. VW now says the Tennessee plant that will build the ID.4 will be ready in 2022, and in the meantime in 2021 they will import some ID.4's from Germany, RWD only. The Y's higher price includes AWD. In 2022 Tesla will be making Y's in Austin with the new structure and new batteries, which both will have lower costs, and they said they will introduce a more affordable RWD model. I'm confident you will be able to buy a Y in 2022 for $39,900.
Looking at the Taycan the EPA range is probably understated while the Teslas somehow never seem to achieve their sky-high ranges. That's OK as it is foreign companies like BP and VW that get fined billions in the US, while US companies like Boeing can cheat during the certification process with hundreds of dead passengers as a result and they don't suffer more than a slap on the wrist.
As to software, it is explicitly pre.production and early-production software with updates getting rolled out now while the king of bananaware, Tesla, charges thousands for "beta"-software that will get updated at unspecified intervals.
As to software, it is explicitly pre.production and early-production software with updates getting rolled out now while the king of bananaware, Tesla, charges thousands for "beta"-software that will get updated at unspecified intervals.
This will be a great option for those who don’t care about all of the technology of a Tesla, or speed, or FSD. Tesla’s are very overwhelming to some people and this is more like a normal car.
In places with large state tax credits, plus the federal tax credit, the price is around or below $30k which is excellent. There is a large market for this and I hope it sells well. I’m addicted to speed and technology so I bought a Tesla but there is a definite need for a decent looking, fast charging EV from someone other than Tesla.
In places with large state tax credits, plus the federal tax credit, the price is around or below $30k which is excellent. There is a large market for this and I hope it sells well. I’m addicted to speed and technology so I bought a Tesla but there is a definite need for a decent looking, fast charging EV from someone other than Tesla.
VW has lost all credibility with me as a company. I felt that they should have been shut down after the scandal. It took getting caught and fined for deceiving & cheating to make a move to EVs, but it's good to see them move in the right direction. It looks like their EVs are very well designed & executed.
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VW is brilliant. In my opinion, there is a good chance in 10 years we will have Tesla, VW, and a few Chinese car companies left; all others will be gone. VW is occupying niches not occupied by Tesla, low-end with ID.X and high end with Tycan. VolksWagen is for historically for "ordinary" people who are not reading forums about cars and not into new tech features of Tesla. ID.4 is a simple basic SUV like (highly-rated) Tiguan. Utility and reasonable range at accessible price are the target parameters for ID.4. It will sell and VW is the only company other than Tesla (Lucid, and Chinese companies) making a real real push into EVs. If (or when) I have no money for Tesla, I will go for VW.
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