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Wall Charger Installation Quote - Review

Discussion in 'Model 3' started by svusa, Sep 22, 2017.

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  1. svusa

    svusa Member

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    Guys,

    I have no idea what's typical cost of installing Tesla wall charger in NJ/NYC, so hope one of you could recommended if quote below look reasonable. It does not include cost of Tesla wall charger ($500).

    1) 150AMP TO 200AMP SERVICE UPGRADE (SIEMENS 200AMP Panel BOX Installed) = $1850
    2) Wiring from Panel (basement) to HPWC (garage) - 75 ft = $1650
    3) Permit/PSEG Utility Upgrade/Processing = $400
    4) Installation of Disconnect as HPWC is not within light of sight of Panel = $380

    Total = $4280
    + $500 (wall charger)

    * I have 150 amp panel and recommendation is to bump it to 200 amp.

    I think it is little bit high but have no idea what would typical cost be for this type of work. any suggestion, how much I should be paying of this type of work? Thank you.
     
  2. skitown

    skitown Supporting Member

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    Welcome @svusa! I just had a quote today to install and run a new 100A circuit about 25ft to hook up a HPWC - and it was ~$1K. So, to my eye, your #2 & #4 don't seem out of line w/my experience; and given our locale differences. I can't speak to #3 (permitting), or #1 - which is obviously a huge part of your estimate.

    I presume your garage has nothing in it like a 30 or 50A service already, or ability to do that more cheaply? I've been running a NEMA 14-50 for over a year and it's been totally adequate. Frankly a 30A would have been fine for my needs too. I really just want an HPWC. :)
     
  3. Mishakim

    Mishakim Member

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    I’m in MA, guessing labor rates are similar? #1 seems reasonable, but only if it is really necessary. How many amps are you providing for the hpwc? You could maybe dial it down and not need to upgrade the panel. Or, go with a smaller breaker now, with heavier wiring that can use a larger breaker if you have reason to upgrade the panel in the future.
    #2 is what I paid 3 years ago for about that distance, but that included digging 20’ of trench, burying conduit, and penetrating both the wood house and block garage walls
    #3. No idea what permits cost, but assume that’s fixed or a function of job cost
    #4 seems high, but I don’t know for sure. My install included a 2-slot box with breaker as disconnect, which is nowhere near $380. IIRC, If you lower the amps, you don’t need the disconnect either —I think the limit is 50 or 60 amps?
     
  4. RayW

    RayW Member

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    The HPWC is overkill as you'll probably do all your charging at night when rates are low, and 150A panel is more than sufficient

    All you need is a 50/60A breaker, new line, and socket... no more complicated than adding an electric drier.

    Btw, the Tesla referred electricians over charge because they think we're rich.
     
  5. Quick2Judge

    Quick2Judge Member

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    The 6gauge wire runs about $4 a foot uninstalled so that should be $300 US without the installation cost.

    I don't have a HPWC and my S gets 30 miles per hour charge on NEMA 14-50, more than enough for me.

    Some other threads talked about users installing 30 amp lines....maybe you could avoid the $1,850 panel upgrade...and save money on a lower gauge wire.

    If you really want the HPWC and are getting the panel upgrade..why not quote out a 80-100 amp and take advantage of the HPWC?
     
  6. Xminus6

    Xminus6 Member

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    Yeah. I've never found the need for a HPWC. I'm about to get another 40a line run for another EVSE with a regular j1772 plug on it for our other car and for any visiting EVs/PHEVs. Unless you're driving over 200 miles per day I think a regular 40a EVSE is fine or a 40a 14-50 or 6-50 plug combined with the UMC work fine. We use this combo and even when one of us drives our 90kWh car to less than 50 miles of range, it's always topped off in the morning.

    The difference is a lot of money to pay for your car to be charged an hour or two earlier while you're sleeping.
     
  7. jareade

    jareade Supporting Member

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    I just installed a HPWC last week, but my brother-in-law is an electrician and he had one of his guys install it for me. Total cost was $400 for materials and labor, but I paid cost for everything - and had room on my panel for a 100 Amp line. 30' run from my panel to in between my garage doors. The real benefit of the HPWC for me was:

    1. Cost: I bought the 24' version for cheaper than a second UMC.
    2. Convenience: My UMC now stays in my car and I don't have to take it out every night to charge.
    3. Accessibility: With a 24' cable, I can hit both cars in the garage as well as multiple cars in the driveway - Model 3 in early 2018, Next Gen Roadster as soon as they build a one, Model X one of these days, etc. (Yep, I have a problem, I acknowledge it). ;).
    4. Coolness factor: HPWC definitely looks really cool installed. :D

    That being said, for me, it was a great deal and I love it. If I had to pay around $5,000 to set it up, there's no chance I would do so.
     
  8. svusa

    svusa Member

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    Thanks guys for such a valuable feedback.

    Electrician told me, my current appliance use is about 100amp+ so 50 amp wouldn't cover 60 amp circuit recommended by Tesla.

    Though, based on Telsa Model 3 specification, Long range would use max 40 amp. So I don't think I need 60amp circuit unless I'm getting model S or X.

    In that case, do you guys see any issue with installing HPWC on 40amp circuit breaker but use wire capable of handling 60amp incase I need to upgrade in the future? That way I could avoid upgrading panel and save some money.

    I have heard about NEMA 14-50 option but for my individual case that would require buying 2nd set of cable where for little bit more I could just have clean HPWC.

    Though, cost of #2, running 75ft cable and installing HPWC looks bit higher so I'm planning to get couple of additional quotes.

    Thanks again for taking time and providing your feedback.
     
  9. skitown

    skitown Supporting Member

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    It's painful to do rework, so I get your plight. This is one of those tricky situations where 'needs' and 'wants' may be pretty different. As an aside, the 60amp recommendation you mentioned jumps out at me as being curious. My NEMA 14-50 is a 50A breaker and the car charges at 40A max. My understanding is that this is "normal", but I'm not an expert. As I mentioned up-thread, this charge rate is more than adequate for us. My garage already had a 30A outlet in it. If I knew then what I know now, I would have not paid money to install the NEMA 14-50 as I don't need it. 30amps would be fine.

    If this helps: I want a HPWC because I live in the boonies and I do take my UMC with me whenever I go to the 'big' city because it's >100 miles one way w/zero charge options in between. Overly conservative, but I do it anyway. So I would like to just leave my UMC in the car. Now if I get a HPWC, I'm also considering spending the cash and upgrading to a larger circuit than my existing 50amp one so that my house can serve as a more efficient charging location for others with Teslas as there is zero charging around here. This amperage upgrade doesn't buy me anything personally as my 2015 car doesn't have dual chargers, so it won't even be able to take advantage of it; and even if it could, I don't see it as being particularly useful for my use case.

    TL;DR - If you can save a bunch of money testing the waters with a lower-rent solution, you might be surprised by what you really need. I was.
     
  10. boaterva

    boaterva Supporting Member

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    I hope he did a real load calculation. Saying you are ‘using’ X Amps and have room for Y Amps more doesn’t sound like a proper load calc to me.

    The real thing takes into account the fact that many loads are not concurrent as to time of day, etc.

    See the link in my sig for some more info, but you could definitely install it with wire for 80 or 100 amp and use a 50 Amp breaker and set the HPWC to 40 (normal 80% calculation for continuous load) so you have the installation all done if you upgrade the panel later. The HPWC can be set all the way down to 12 Amps (on a 15 Amp circuit).
     
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  11. svusa

    svusa Member

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    I think you hit the nail, for new EV buyers like me it is hard to figure it out Needs vs. Wants :)

    In my case, only reason I think I want HPWC is, I'm not kind of guy who would remember to put cord back in the car and just incase I need it, I'm out of that option. (fear of unknown!) also, HPWC appearance is slightly better and if I understand correctly it would get me fastest charging possible at home.

    @boaterva I kind of felt same way guy is trying to up sell panel upgrade. Total number of appliances in modern home may cross 100amp but that doesnt mean we turn everything on at the same time.

    so based on everyone's feedback, here is my plan -

    1) Run 6 gage wire from existing 150 amp panel to garage
    2) Install 40 or 50 amp circuit breaker
    3) Install Telsa HPWC

    I'll get couple of additional quotes to see how much it comes down to and post it here for a reference.

    Cheers
     
    • Like x 2
  12. 03DSG

    03DSG Member

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    My upgrades going in next Thursday. Quote:

    Panel upgrade, 100amp to 200amp Cutler Hammer panel $1130

    75' run basement to garage Tech 6/3awg armour cable $740

    Install a Nema 14-50 on 40amp breaker (Canada) for now. Return when I
    get the car and install Tesla HPWC on 60amp breaker, inspection certificate $450

    Includes local utility disconnect, permits and inspections. I already have 200amps
    underground to the meter so a short 5' run/conduit from meter inside to the panel.
     
  13. galbrecht7

    galbrecht7 Member

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    I got my first quote the other day from an electrician. My house is 100 amp service, and even though I have space to add a 50 amp breaker, he said it would be close to exceeding my service level. He said it's possible I wouldn't since the only other big draw I have is from my air conditioner, but it would be close. I did not want to pay to upgrade to 200 amp service. So he recommended simply adding a sub panel that would tap off my meter, then running the 240V line directly from the sub panel to my detached garage. No need to upgrade my service to 200 amp and no need to add a 50 amp breaker. Unfortunately for me, there is no existing conduit to my detached garage (the 110V line currently to my garage was simply buried), so I need about 35 feet of trenching and conduit done in my yard. But for the new sub panel, trenching, conduit, 240V run, and NEMA 14-50 outlet, I was quoted $1600. I think the permit cost was not included, but he said that's $150 (city of Chicago). I'm not doing the Tesla Wall Connector, but he said that would be an additional $650 if I changed my mind. Also said if I supply the Wall Connector they would install it for free. Anyway, hope that info helps compare. I'm still going to get another quote next week, but felt pretty confident with the first one. Seemed like a fair price & reliable company.
     
  14. OBX John

    OBX John Autonomous Driving Enthusiast

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    The convenience of the HPWC with a 24' cable cannot be overstated, but I think it can easily be run at a lower amperage that will stay within your existing capacity, and lower the cost of the line to the garage. As long as it finishes charging the car over night, you'll never need more. We run two Teslas off our one charger easily.
     
  15. boaterva

    boaterva Supporting Member

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    The current model can be run at anything down to and including a 15 Amp circuit where you set the HPWC at 12 Amps. (Talk about flashy exterior with not much on the inside! :D )
     
    • Informative x 1
  16. david_42

    david_42 Member

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    Check with your electricity company, mine can provide total and peak usage by the hour. Even though I have about 300 amps worth of breakers in my 200 amp panel, my peak usage has never gone over 8000 watts. Due to some remodeling (the house used to be a daycare center), I have a 50/220 breaker that is not in use. Since the two largest loads are the water heater and the clothes dryer, setting the Tesla to charge between 10 pm and 6 am should keep the peak down. I'm also lucky that the breaker panel is in the garage.
     
  17. svusa

    svusa Member

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    Thanks... @03DSG @galbrecht7 . I plan to get at least couple of additional quotes to get good feel of different options and typical cost.
     
    • Like x 1
  18. 03DSG

    03DSG Member

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    Great idea. My quotes were quite far apart. My lowest and best which I'm using is a quite large electrical company that does residential, commercial/industrial and a lot of work for the county I live in. I was surprised. Thought that small local individual contractors would be cheaper. The next lowest quote I got was $1,000 higher.
     
  19. PoitNarf

    PoitNarf Member

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    150 amp service should be sufficient. I imagine you, like most, would be charging overnight so your amp draw overall should be less overnight anyway. I've got 100 amp service at my house so I'm going to see how long I can make due with charging off of a standard 15 amp outlet. I've only drive 25-30 miles a day usually, so I should be able to get away with it for now. But an upgrade to 200 amp service and a 50 amp outlet in the garage are definitely in my future. As others have mentioned, the HPWC for the Model 3 is probably overkill since it won't really be able to charge any faster than with a 50 amp circuit.
     
  20. gregd

    gregd Active Member

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    If you can get a 240v outlet, even a lower amperage one (20 or 30 amps), you will be much happier. The higher voltage, besides charging faster, is also a lot more efficient, especially when it's really cold outside. In fact, if the car has to heat the battery first, you may not even get any net charging on a 120v / 15a circuit.

    I charged for several years on the dryer outlet in my garage (30 amp breaker, so 24 amp charging rate), and it was plenty. This was on our 125 amp overall service.
     
    • Helpful x 1
    • Informative x 1

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