It is the shading that is a killer. We just had our solar roof washed and from a preliminary check, the effect is close to 0. Still down from 60 kWH/day in June to 5 kWH/day due to shading because of time of year and trees
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What would you do with this tree?
- Thread starter BrettS
- Start date
Yeah, this is a concern too. It drops it’s fronds periodically and it’s fruits frequently. The fruits often land on the roof and roll down and when I first moved into this house I was convinced that I had a rodent or something living in the attic until I finally realized it was just the palm fruits rolling down the roof.
pluck the leaves?(A good trim may reduce the shading)
Yeah, I can remove some of the lower branches that are on their way to falling off, but it’s not an easy task. Even the lower branches are attached a good 20ish feet above the ground, so it takes a not so safe combination of a ladder and a pole saw to remove them. Additionally I suspect that most of the shading is coming from the upper branches, which are the healthy ones that I wouldn’t really want to remove anyway.
That’s good to know, thanks.
I believe it is a queen. It came with the house, so I don’t know for sure, but it’s my best guess, at least.
I didn’t even know that self cleaning was a term that would describe palms, but these do appear to be self cleaning. If I leave the fronds and such (as I tend to do) they will eventually drop off. As I said above, occasionally I have tried to trim off some of the fronds that are on their way out, but it’s not an easy job and honestly it doesn’t seem to last very long. Within a month or two it’s just got more.
Yes, yes they are. I have that one and another one on the other side of the house (which is a bit further from the house and not near any panels) but they both drop a lot of fruits several times a year.
My solar system is pretty big, but given that all my appliances are electric and that I have a car to charge I still only expect it to meet 70 or 80% of my annual power demand, so any extra power I can get would be used.
Or, move it far enough that shadow misses house?
Unfortunately I think moving a tree of that size would be cost prohibitive. Additionally I have a septic system with the drain field in the front yard and I was given no map or anything to show exactly where the drain field is, so I would be a bit concerned about the large trucks driving over the yard to move the tree (not to mention trying to find a place to put it)
You can have it. All you need to do is come down here and pick it up
Well, I decided to go with the trimming option for now. I found a better way to place my ladder that made it much less precarious and I was able to trim it back quite a bit this morning. These pictures were taken at almost exactly the same time as yesterday, so the shadows should be in about the same place. I think it has definitely helped with the shading.
Course now I have half a tree in my driveway for them to take on yard waste day.
Course now I have half a tree in my driveway for them to take on yard waste day.
mspohr
Well-Known Member
California has a "Solar Rights Act" which lets you remove trees interfering with solar panels (even your neighbors trees).
I live at Lake Tahoe and we have the most strict regulations on tree removal but if there is a tree interfering with solar, you can take it down. (Yes, I have done this with a large tree on the lake side of my house. Normally verboten but no problem since it was shading my solar.)
Thanks for the pointer. Neat that CA has such an ordinance.
When I looked up the act I found this exemption from the ability to remove trees for solar. My tree causing reduced solar is designated a "Heritage Tree" by the city ordinance.
"Section 25984(d) exempts from the provisions of the Act any “tree or shrub that is subject to a city or country ordinance.”
Note, this does not matter in my case since I would not take down the tree.
charlesj
Active Member
Was that tree so designated? How did you know?. Who pays? I guess the solar owner?
If it were up to me, I'd make a law that says you could remove any tree you want, but you have to cut it down with...
...A HERRING!!!
Bruce.
...A HERRING!!!
Bruce.
The City says this:
"Heritage Trees are any tree 55 inches or more in circumference (measured at 4-1/2 feet off the ground)"
charlesj
Active Member
Oh, wow, 17.5" dia. So it is by size then, not some special tree. Most likely we have something similar here as well.
Yep. People hate this rule. There is also a height max of 35 feet.
You can get a variance. But they will actually come and look, and I gather most are denied. Our request to take out a tree was denied.
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Don’t know if you have taken the time to look up what palms do well in high Florida winds as mentioned but I know the State or AG dept. came out with lists after surveying palms after several hurricanes. While not one of those generated lists I’m thinking about, this website by a Florida landscape designer indicates that Queens in particular did very poorly in Florida high winds. The roots won’t cause sidewalks to crack like other trees but guessing either the canopy or rapid height of the tree (40-50 feet range when mature) does make it susceptible to being blown over, and more so than many other palms. Given that info, I would opt to have someone chain saw yours out. Also unlike much of California with deep soil layers, I know Florida soil has a sand component to it as well. I’d suggest planting a smaller palm if you want something near the house to maintain a tropical look. Your solar panels will serve to shade your roof in those areas now.
Wind Tolerance for Trees in the Palm Beach Landscape by Pamela Crawford
From her website:
“Palm, Queen (Syagrus romanzoffiana): Zones 9b to 11. While most palms do fairly well in high winds, queen palms are the exception. They blew down all over Florida. If you still have one within falling distance of your house, consider removing it. Queen palms blow down more than most other commonly-planted Florida trees. They typically uproot rather than snapping at the trunk. According to Dr. Mary Duryea’s survey after hurricane Andrew (145 mph), queen palms were one of the five species that did the most property damage (15). This palm has a low wind tolerance in the Palm Beach landscape.”
Queens grow much faster and taller than Butias or their cross (mules) and when planting I strived for palms that were around the 20-30 ft max. for maintenance purposes. Queens aren’t considered self-cleaning BTW, requiring fronds to be cut off although the boots will eventually fall off. The spathes that hold the flowers/seeds aside from being copious and frequently produced in warm areas droop down unlike our mule spathes that tend to hold them within the canopy. Both however are very heavy as well. The fact you said you are already finding it difficult to prune is probably another reason to remove the queen.
Wind Tolerance for Trees in the Palm Beach Landscape by Pamela Crawford
From her website:
“Palm, Queen (Syagrus romanzoffiana): Zones 9b to 11. While most palms do fairly well in high winds, queen palms are the exception. They blew down all over Florida. If you still have one within falling distance of your house, consider removing it. Queen palms blow down more than most other commonly-planted Florida trees. They typically uproot rather than snapping at the trunk. According to Dr. Mary Duryea’s survey after hurricane Andrew (145 mph), queen palms were one of the five species that did the most property damage (15). This palm has a low wind tolerance in the Palm Beach landscape.”
Queens grow much faster and taller than Butias or their cross (mules) and when planting I strived for palms that were around the 20-30 ft max. for maintenance purposes. Queens aren’t considered self-cleaning BTW, requiring fronds to be cut off although the boots will eventually fall off. The spathes that hold the flowers/seeds aside from being copious and frequently produced in warm areas droop down unlike our mule spathes that tend to hold them within the canopy. Both however are very heavy as well. The fact you said you are already finding it difficult to prune is probably another reason to remove the queen.
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It’s dark out now, but I was able to zoom in on the photos from earlier and upload them in a higher resolution. The trunk definitely has some scars and some dark spots, but I don’t really know what they are.
As far as wind damage goes, I’m fairly far inland (at least as far as florida goes) so I don’t often get the really strong hurricanes that the coast gets, so hopefully this one as well as my other queen palm are less likely to suffer wind damage.
As far as wind damage goes, I’m fairly far inland (at least as far as florida goes) so I don’t often get the really strong hurricanes that the coast gets, so hopefully this one as well as my other queen palm are less likely to suffer wind damage.
charlesj
Active Member
Boy, that is very close to the gutter and house in that enlarged photo, right in that flower bed next to the house.
Depending on wind direction it might damage the gutter?
The gutters have been there for more than 2 years now and the tree hasn’t damaged them yet. Although if the fronds aren’t trimmed they will brush against the gutters as the wind blows. It was a pain last Christmas because I had lights clipped to the gutters, but the fronds kept brushing against the lights and unclipping them.
I doubt you're losing much production. It's only a few of the panels, and only for a few months in winter. You can probably do the math pretty quickly. Maybe $40 per year, tops? So the question is less about maximizing production and more about cleanup of debris and maybe hurricane damage from hitting the gutters. I imagine Florida solar panels have some hurricane-related requirements, so I don't think falling fronds and seeds would be enough to damage them. Sticky gunk falling on panels is a different question, though. I would not want any tree that close to my house (Louisiana), but I'm not sure I'd remove it until I had another tree grown to replace it with less shade. A house can look bleak without trees in front. It does look a lot better trimmed!
@BrettS does your downspout empty into an underground drainage line that carries water away from the house out to a street drain? If not I’d be concerned about too much water affecting the palm trunk and the ground around the trunk. Hard to tell from your photo where water gets routed. Definitely don’t want the trunk to rot or get diseased. Watch out for what looks like mushrooms growing on the trunk. That’s a sign of a very deadly palm disease.
Also I’ll also mention don’t permit any sprinkler irrigation to hit the trunk. Use appropriately gauged volume bubblers or drips in the bed. In general as palms mature the emitters can be moved further out to reach the extending root system perimeter.
Also I’ll also mention don’t permit any sprinkler irrigation to hit the trunk. Use appropriately gauged volume bubblers or drips in the bed. In general as palms mature the emitters can be moved further out to reach the extending root system perimeter.
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Neighbor is having to add panels as a result of his neighbor’s palm now getting over the roof so the shading is having an impact. I’d get rid of it if I were you - to spend that much on the panels to not get the full benefits. I guess the fact that you will only use up to 80% capacity will buy you time.
You have more info about this. My neighbor has some oak and pine trees this time of the year that shade my solar. Are you saying they could be forced to be removed?
But finding this, seems I am stuck
Generally speaking, the Act prohibits a property owner from allowing trees or shrubs to shade an existing solar energy system installed on a neighboring property, provided the shading trees or shrubs were planted after the solar collecting device was installed.
