Why did you cancel your Model 3 reservation?

[ModelNforNerd]

I feel fortunate enough that I'm coming from an Audi. It's not one of the "Virtual Cockpit" Audis, but I do have the 7" screen that comes out of the dash.

It's a nice in-between step between a "normal dash" and a Tesla.

 

[dsvick]

I haven't cancelled my order yet, but I'm getting really close to it.
Here are the reasons:
1. Tax credits -
...
6. No hatch back - planning for babies soon, and cant imagine getting strollers in and out of that trunk very easily.

So now I'm starting to lean toward a used hybrid SUV. It'll cost half the price and not have any of those issues. I really wanted this to be my next car, but it seems like Elon doesn't want me as a customer.

I have no problem with any of your points since they are all your opinion and what you like is what you like. If the car has so many things that you may not like then, by all means. don't get it. To say however, that Elon doesn't want you as a customer is complete stupidity. Honestly, Elon doesn't care about any specific person, he (and the entire Tesla team) designed a car that they thought would appeal to the widest range of people, if it doesn't happen to appeal to you then that's just the way it is. It wasn't some personal affront aimed specifically at you.

 

[ModelNforNerd]

No. No it isn't. Since you wont get the tax credit until you file your taxes for the year you buy the car, it could be well over a year until you actually get the credit. You will still need to pay for the full price of the car, plus, taxes, delivery, all of your options, and any documentation fees. The tax credit will not, in any way, offset the price of the car. Yes, once you receive the credit you might be able to pay down any amount you financed and then refinance it, but it's probably be at a higher rate at that point.

PREACH!!! LOL.


But in all seriousness, the ONLY way that you could make this work in your favor depends on too many outside factors.

You could take delivery in late late December. Get your W-2 fairly early in January (HA!), get all of your 1099's (not many people have to worry about these...some do), file your taxes IMMEDIATELY, get your refund (with EV Tax Credit) and then...if you have a good bank or Credit Union, immediately refinance within 90 days of the initial loan. USAA used to allow a "second chance loan", but you had to be financed somewhere else first, and then come to them.


All in all, you're depending on way too many people to do their jobs for this to happen. If you have to have that many pieces fall into place to get a Model 3 in a way you can afford it....you can't afford it.

 

[dsvick]

All in all, you're depending on way too many people to do their jobs for this to happen. If you have to have that many pieces fall into place to get a Model 3 in a way you can afford it....you can't afford it.

Yes, exactly! Better off doing what we plan and just paying off higher interest debt with it.

 

[ModelNforNerd]

Yes, exactly! Better off doing what we plan and just paying off higher interest debt with it.

It's funny, our financial situation has already changed twice since I put my money down.

I took a pay cut (but not too severe) to get a more stable job with an early pension back in June. Since we file jointly, my wife and I would still qualify for the full tax credit.

Last week, my wife's small startup was acquired by one of the larger Silicon Valley companies. Her raise to come on board with them was modest...but as part of the compensation package involved in the buyout, they loaded her heavily with bonuses that are taxed at 30% (25 Fed+5 state).....so now we NEED the tax credit, at least in the 1st year.

In year 2? Who knows.....Elon may have just gained a new Tesla Solar Roof+Powerwall customer, too.

 

[winfield100]

I haven't cancelled my order yet, but I'm getting really close to it.
Here are the reasons:


So now I'm starting to lean toward a used hybrid SUV. It'll cost half the price and not have any of those issues. I really wanted this to be my next car, but it seems like Elon doesn't want me as a customer.

I haven't cancelled my order yet, but I'm getting really close to it.
Here are the reasons:
1. Tax credits - If they're expired, I can't rationalize paying full price. Of course, tesla gives us no real info about where we are in line, so it's impossible to know what tax credits to plan for.

if tax credits are your first reason, you may need to save a bit more
If you look on Kelly Blue Book, there are over 400 different types of vehicles sold in the US, one there will probably fit your needs and budget, until a Tesla or other electric can

me, i'm saving and waiting and retired

 

[apacheguy]

I know you mean well, but this has been beaten to death. If you're in a position where getting a $35,000 (plus tax, title, registration and delivery) vehicle is a stretch, you also may not even be in an income bracket where you could take the full benefit of the tax credit.

Everyone's situation is different, but telling people the cost of the car is "basically $27,500" is fundamentally flawed.

The tax credit comes at the end of the year, IF you qualify.

And you're not going to be financing or paying sales tax, property tax, or insurance on a $27,500 car.

For some people, the tax credit is a given, and moving the money around is just a matter of getting on your phone and making a few clicks.

For others, it's life-altering to get to that point, and those people shouldn't be overreaching.

Ok, fair. So why not lease?

No. No it isn't. Since you wont get the tax credit until you file your taxes for the year you buy the car, it could be well over a year until you actually get the credit. You will still need to pay for the full price of the car, plus, taxes, delivery, all of your options, and any documentation fees. The tax credit will not, in any way, offset the price of the car. Yes, once you receive the credit you might be able to pay down any amount you financed and then refinance it, but it's probably be at a higher rate at that point.

Not if you lease. Leasing the Model 3 will ensure that you get the benefit of the credit up front. It goes straight to Tesla and they lower your lease payments.

 

[ModelNforNerd]

Ok, fair. So why not lease?

Not everyone likes to invest money into an asset they get minimal equity in at the end of their contract (lease). Me, personally...if I'm dropping $300-ish per month, I'd want to own it when I make my final payment, not have to either make a balloon payment, or find another car.

But everyone is different. For some people, that may be an option. And while we don't know the production rollout yet, one has to wonder if leasing vs. buying would change your spot in line......

 

[Chopr147]

1. Tax credits -

No-one really knows how much of the credit wiill be available. I was around 250k on the list before getting an S and just figured I would either lose out on it,or get but maybe half.

Build quality - I keep hearing horror stories of squeaks and rattles in teslas-

Only have it 3 1/2 months but quiet as a mouse

3. No buttons -

I may have agreed 6 months ago. Wasn't sure if I liked the screen taking over controls. Now? I LOVE it!
Put what controls you want on the steering wheel scrolls (Tesla actually gives the owner choice here.......genius

Center console - still hate it.

I could use more storage in center console, agree here

 

[Chopr147]

Scaling up problems - I have a hard time imagining tesla will be able to fix all the bugs in these cars as fast as they're discovered,

Check the history. Tesla has been very good at fixing bugs. Maybe because they had to be as a newer company , but they do it.
2 month appointments but it gets done.

No hatch back

The S was the first time I have had a hatchback and yea, I wish the 3 was as well. But, not a deal breaker for me.

Scaling up problems

The model 3 will really test Tesla and show what they are made of, or not made of. It is a HUGE undertaking and I really hope the can handle it.

I really wanted this to be my next car, but it seems like Elon doesn't want me as a customer.

I don't know how to respond to this. Elon wants my money and in return I expect a quality vehicle. That's it

 

[ModelNforNerd]

I don't know how to respond to this. Elon wants my money and in return I expect a quality vehicle. That's it

Agreed. the "Elon doesn't want me as a customer" thinking had me baffled.

Elon doesn't seek out any of us. He puts out products, and if we're interested, we gravitate towards them. It's kinda how that whole Free Market Economy thing works.

 

[slipnslider]

A lot of the things you're complaining about you knew when you made the reservation. If these things you didn't like before you made the reservation, then why did you reserve in the first place?

Because tesla didn't provide enough information about the car for me to make a fully informed decision. They still haven't.
And I only started to do more research about the build quality after I made the reservation.
I had a lot of hopes that the interior was only a prototype first draft, and it would in fact get physical buttons and instrument cluster, but that doesn't appear likely to happen.

 

[slipnslider]

And for every person like you, there's someone like me, who doesn't need cd-roms, and have bluetooth audio, and would rather swipe than find buttons. If you don't like Tesla's design decisions, then don't get it. There isn't a gun to your head, and advocating for features that you like means taking away from features that others like me prefer. Just recognize that you're opinion might not represent the majority or even a significant minority.

That's all well and good. New features are fine. But forcing people to abandon perfected old features in exchange for new features is different. Touchscreens are not better than buttons. Center console is not better than an instrument cluster. Not everyone wants a video screen in their face at all times. $100k mass production cars should not squeak and rattle and require frequent dealer repairs.

This thread is about cancelling reservations. If you don't want to hear why people are cancelling their reservations, maybe you should skip to another thread.

 

[slipnslider]

Agreed. the "Elon doesn't want me as a customer" thinking had me baffled.

Elon doesn't seek out any of us. He puts out products, and if we're interested, we gravitate towards them. It's kinda how that whole Free Market Economy thing works.

Absolutely. My feedback is simply stating what tesla needs to do in order to have more free market success. The more you TELL people what they should want, instead of providing what they already want, the smaller your customer base will be. It's the same arrogant approach pioneered by apple recently, and it will probably lead down the same path.

 

[ilg]

It's the same arrogant approach pioneered by apple recently, and it will probably lead down the same path.

To outrageously wild success? Cool. I can cope.

 

[dsvick]

New features are fine. But forcing people to abandon perfected old features in exchange for new features is different. Touchscreens are not better than buttons. Center console is not better than an instrument cluster. Not everyone wants a video screen in their face at all times. $100k mass production cars should not squeak and rattle and require frequent dealer repairs.

This thread is about cancelling reservations. If you don't want to hear why people are cancelling their reservations, maybe you should skip to another thread.

No one is being "forced" to do anything. Those are the design choices they made; either people will like them or not - you apparently don't, it doesn't mean they were wrong, it just means they were wrong for you. As you pointed out, this is the thread about cancelling your reservation and why, it's your opinion and you're entitled to it.

 

[dsvick]

Absolutely. My feedback is simply stating what tesla needs to do in order to have more free market success. The more you TELL people what they should want, instead of providing what they already want, the smaller your customer base will be. It's the same arrogant approach pioneered by apple recently, and it will probably lead down the same path.

In what way is Tesla telling you what you want? Because they designed the car the way they did? They can only design it one way and apparently that way is fine with close to 400,000 people, so I don't think you can say that they won't have free market success - they seem poised to do just fine. If you want buttons and knobs and an instrument cluster, there are several hundred other car models out there for you to chose from. The Bolt comes to mind if you want an EV.

Not doing something the same way it has always been done is not usually considered arrogant, most people look at it as brave or pioneering. Without people trying things in new and different way we would never have an progress from where we were. We'd still all be driving around in Model Ts.

 

[ModelNforNerd]

Absolutely. My feedback is simply stating what tesla needs to do in order to have more free market success. The more you TELL people what they should want, instead of providing what they already want, the smaller your customer base will be. It's the same arrogant approach pioneered by apple recently, and it will probably lead down the same path.

Considering Apple's market value, I'm gonna have to go ahead and disagree with you here.

I detest them, and I won't use any of their products if it can be helped...

but Tesla should hope to achieve 1/2 of their success.

As a TSLA shareholder, I'd be enthralled with those numbers.

 

[BluestarE3]

The more you TELL people what they should want, instead of providing what they already want, the smaller your customer base will be. It's the same arrogant approach pioneered by apple recently, and it will probably lead down the same path.

Sometimes, that's what it takes to create a new market. Catering solely to existing wants doesn't make for innovation. The challenge is knowing what to give people before they even realize why they may want it.

 

[slipnslider]

Sometimes, that's what it takes to create a new market. Catering solely to existing wants doesn't make for innovation. The challenge is knowing what to give people before they even realize why they may want it.

Again, all well and good. But that doesn't mean you should take away something they currently want, in order to convince them that something else is better. At least not if you want their money.
Innovation simply means - new idea, device, or method - it doesn't mean BETTER. If it's really better, you don't have to convince people to use it. If touchscreens were better control surfaces for cars, I would be wishing for one every time I used my old fashioned volume knob, but I'm not - I'm grateful for it, as I'm grateful for the temperature knob on my climate control. INNOVATING to make these controlled by touch screens might be a new idea, but it's not a better idea.
I find that the tesla crowd is very accepting of new technology in general, and the fact that something new isn't always better is really hard for some of them to wrap their heads around.