Will Tesla Semi be affected if Tesla becomes unionized?

[TSemi]

With the UAW strike making headlines it was inevitable that Tesla(and Elon Musk) would get dragged into it.

Some recent articles targeting Elon Musk and Tesla:

This from The Guardian
Tesla is the next biggest union target in the United States. Sorry, Elon Musk

This from WIRED
How Elon Musk and Tesla Helped Spark the Auto Strikes

It's probably inevitable that Tesla will become unionized, just guessing. But all other ICE truck manufacturers are unionized and seem to be doing just fine so why wouldn't Tesla and Tesla Semi be just fine if unionized?

 

[ThomasD]

Didn't some Tesla workers try to unionize before and it was voted down?

 

[TSemi]

Didn't some Tesla workers try to unionize before and it was voted down?

Yes and UAW knows this. But from what I've read the UAW believes the reason it was voted down was from intimidation tactics from company officials. The UAW believes that they best represent the rank and file workers better than Tesla or Elon Musk. The UAW has an inherent distrust of anything corporate and exploits this with the rank and file members fear and distrust as well.

If the UAW gets their 32 hour work week that might entice enough Tesla employees to vote union.

 

[jabloomf1230]

Yes and UAW knows this. But from what I've read the UAW believes the reason it was voted down was from intimidation tactics from company officials. The UAW believes that they best represent the rank and file workers better than Tesla or Elon Musk. The UAW has an inherent distrust of anything corporate and exploits this with the rank and file members fear and distrust as well.

If the UAW gets their 32 hour work week that might entice enough Tesla employees to vote union.

Tesla unionizing = FUD

Toyota, BMW, Hyundai, Nissan, Tesla, Volvo and Subaru have US manufacturing facilities and have resisted unionization. Never say never, but it will be a while before the UAW cracks that nut.

 

[TSemi]

From Teslarati today:
Tesla’s ghost hangs over UAW’s ongoing strike

"Mark Barrott, an automotive analyst at the Michigan-based consultancy Plante Moran, noted that the UAW strike today is not just about pay and benefits; it is also about the electric vehicle sector. “This strike is about electrification,” he said."

 

[Unclepaul]

Tesla is a huge success, compared to unionized auto manufacturers. It's compensation package and work expectations are different. Imagine that if the union strike results in increased worker wages, Tesla will compensate to remain competitive in it's hiring. They already pay more for their US workers than their plants in other countries. Plants in China are much more efficient and profitable than those in US.

My biggest worry is that if the unions get their demands of higher wages, lower work week, more expensive fringe benefits etc, our companies will be unable to compete with the coming hords of Chinese imports. This will ultimately result in a much lower unionized workforce.

Higher pricing, due to union labor expenses, will result in ever increasing prices for those vehicles. Already, pricing for new cars has gone out of sight.

Result is that it will be great for union management and those few that will still be making union scale, but for everyone else, it will be a loss.

 

[TSemi]

Toyota, BMW, Hyundai, Nissan, Tesla, Volvo and Subaru have US manufacturing facilities and have resisted unionization.

Also Honda.

I think Tesla worries the UAW more than any other auto manufacture mainly because of Tesla's meteoric rise in recent years which puts them in the spotlight. The UAW may also see Tesla as a threat in the Class 8 EV tractor manufacturing. I'm sure the UAW are monitoring the Tesla Semi performance and are aware of Elon Musks' future plans for the Tesla Semi.

The UAW has an iron grip on the Big 3 and the Class 8 tractor manufacturers and would absolutely love getting a grip on the EV leader Tesla.

A recent article from FORTUNE says :

"Union leader Shawn Fain has a message for Elon Musk: after the United Auto Workers (UAW) secure a historic pay hike for staff at Detroit’s Big 3, he’s coming for Tesla next." UAW boss says Big 3 can give their fair share after earning a quarter of a trillion in profits over past decade

Shawn Fain has also said:

"UAW boss says workers shouldn’t accept lower wages so ‘greedy people like Elon Musk can build more rocket ships’"​

 

[TSemi]

Tesla unionizing = FUD

Do you really think so?

UAW head Shawn Fain has made Tesla and Elon Musk his next target and guess what? He and the UAW has the full backing of the Biden Administration - the U.S. Government. Just off the top of my head I can think of some former and current U.S. government officials going toe-to-toe with Elon Musk(Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, Elizabeth Warren and Robert Reich) and Joe Biden has refused to visit a Tesla factory, which seems odd to a lot people. And Joe Biden snubbed Elon Musk and Tesla at his EV Summit in 2021.

“The UAW supports and is ready for the transition to a clean-auto industry,” Fain said in August. “The EV transition must include strong union partnerships with the high pay and safety standards that generations of UAW members have fought for and won.”

Can you win a war against the full force of the U.S. Government? Elon Musk and Tesla has their work cut out for them.

 

[jabloomf1230]

Do you really think so?

UAW head Shawn Fain has made Tesla and Elon Musk his next target and guess what? He and the UAW has the full backing of the Biden Administration - the U.S. Government. Just off the top of my head I can think of some former and current U.S. government officials going toe-to-toe with Elon Musk(Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, Elizabeth Warren and Robert Reich) and Joe Biden has refused to visit a Tesla factory, which seems odd to a lot people. And Joe Biden snubbed Elon Musk and Tesla at his EV Summit in 2021.

“The UAW supports and is ready for the transition to a clean-auto industry,” Fain said in August. “The EV transition must include strong union partnerships with the high pay and safety standards that generations of UAW members have fought for and won.”

Can you win a war against the full force of the U.S. Government? Elon Musk and Tesla has their work cut out for them.

You didn't really address my point. There are a number of non-union automotive manufacturing facilities in the US. The UAW hasn't done much to change that.

 

[TSemi]

You didn't really address my point. There are a number of non-union automotive manufacturing facilities in the US.

Did you read Post #7, the one prior to the one you quoted? Will Tesla Semi be affected if Tesla becomes unionized?

"Also Honda.

I think Tesla worries the UAW more than any other auto manufacture mainly because of Tesla's meteoric rise in recent years which puts them in the spotlight. The UAW may also see Tesla as a threat in the Class 8 EV tractor manufacturing. I'm sure the UAW are monitoring the Tesla Semi performance and are aware of Elon Musks' future plans for the Tesla Semi.

The UAW has an iron grip on the Big 3 and the Class 8 tractor manufacturers and would absolutely love getting a grip on the EV leader Tesla."

The UAW hasn't done much to change that.

They have it just was not all that public but were not successful. And you need to consider the new leadership of UAW under Shawn Fain who seems to be more radical. No other UAW leader has come out and said publicly "he's coming for Tesla".

A recent article from FORTUNE says :

"Union leader Shawn Fain has a message for Elon Musk: after the United Auto Workers (UAW) secure a historic pay hike for staff at Detroit’s Big 3, he’s coming for Tesla next."

Biden to walk the picket line in Michigan to support UAW strikers Didn't Joe Biden say he will join the picket line this week with UAW strikers?

Also consider Elon Musk has become somewhat of a pariah and a target(by *certain groups and groupthink-types*) ever since he took over Twitter and the fact he is a multi-billionaire. The billionaire part is something Shawn Fain can really sink his hooks into for attacking purposes.

Tesla(under Elon Musk) has become very successful and the envy of every major legacy auto manufacturer, but that comes with a price, which is Tesla and Elon Musk are THE TARGET.

 

[jabloomf1230]

Did you read Post #7, the one prior to the one you quoted? Will Tesla Semi be affected if Tesla becomes unionized?

"Also Honda.

I think Tesla worries the UAW more than any other auto manufacture mainly because of Tesla's meteoric rise in recent years which puts them in the spotlight. The UAW may also see Tesla as a threat in the Class 8 EV tractor manufacturing. I'm sure the UAW are monitoring the Tesla Semi performance and are aware of Elon Musks' future plans for the Tesla Semi.

The UAW has an iron grip on the Big 3 and the Class 8 tractor manufacturers and would absolutely love getting a grip on the EV leader Tesla."



They have it just was not all that public but were not successful. And you need to consider the new leadership of UAW under Shawn Fain who seems to be more radical. No other UAW leader has come out and said publicly "he's coming for Tesla".

Biden to walk the picket line in Michigan to support UAW strikers Didn't Joe Biden say he will join the picket line this week with UAW strikers?

Also consider Elon Musk has become somewhat of a pariah and a target(by *certain groups and groupthink-types*) ever since he took over Twitter and the fact he is a multi-billionaire. The billionaire part is something Shawn Fain can really sink his hooks into for attacking purposes.

Tesla(under Elon Musk) has become very successful and the envy of every major legacy auto manufacturer, but that comes with a price, which is Tesla and Elon Musk are THE TARGET.

Soooo, which US Tesla assembly plant will the UAW target? Texas certainly isn't union friendly and Fremont is an older facility that Tesla would probably close if it had a replacement, such as Mexico. This unionization effirt isn't going to happen. Just like it hasn't happened at the other non-union US shops. By the time that the UAW has finished wrecking Ford, GM and Stellantis, Tesla will have automated its assembly facilities to the point where human workers have only a tiny role to play. That's why there are jokes in other threads here about the UAW organizing Tesla's robots.

I continue to believe that this union stuff is FUD, designed solely to manipulate the Tesla stock price.

 

[TSemi]

Soooo, which US Tesla assembly plant will the UAW target?

Only UAW knows. Maybe Fremont, Giga Nevada and Giga Texas.

Texas certainly isn't union friendly

The Texas AFL-CIO is a state federation of labor unions representing 240,000 members in Texas. We advocate for working people in the political and legislative arenas.

240,000+​	460+​	20,000+​
Affiliated Members	Affiliates & Locals	Activists

This unionization effirt isn't going to happen.

I wouldn't be so sure. Maybe, maybe not. We'll have to see how determined UAW's Shawn Fain is his ability to muster support from powerful, influential people.

By the time that the UAW has finished wrecking Ford, GM and Stellantis, Tesla will have automated its assembly facilities to the point where human workers have only a tiny role to play.

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Tesla Giga Texas Workforce Soars To Over 20K, Poised For Threefold Growth​

Giga Texas is on track to become a manufacturing juggernaut with estimated 60,000 employees.​

Tesla Giga Texas Workforce Soars To Over 20K, Poised For Threefold Growth

You think UAW and Shawn Fain isn't reading this???? They're licking their chops!!

That's why there are jokes in other threads here about the UAW organizing Tesla's robots.

They are only jokes and not reality. When Tesla robots will be able to take over current human jobs is like predicting when FSD(and robotaxis) will take over driving cars/trucks, the predictions so far has gone very badly.

 

[MP3Mike]

Only UAW knows. Maybe Fremont, Giga Nevada and Giga Texas.

There was some move to unionize at the Buffalo plant earlier this year:

Tesla Workers in Buffalo Begin Union Drive

If successful, the workers who help develop Tesla’s Autopilot driver-assistance system will be the first group at the company to organize.

www.nytimes.com

But I don't think we have seen anything happen since February, so maybe they gave up after they couldn't get enough people to sign union cards. (It is very difficult to get people to sign; there were two attempts at a company I worked for, a few years apart, and both failed to get anywhere near enough signatures even though a good portion of the people were unhappy with the pay/benefits.)

edit: A few years after I left that company they were acquired by a union shop. I have since heard from a few people that they wished they had signed the union cards and gone union years ago. (I am generally anti-union, but there are cases where the workers need a union to support them.)

 

[TSemi]

But I don't think we have seen anything happen since February, so maybe they gave up after they couldn't get enough people to sign union cards.

Given UAW's leader Shawn Fain's statement earlier this month that he is going after Tesla it would be fair to say that they haven't given up yet.

"Union leader Shawn Fain has a message for Elon Musk: after the United Auto Workers (UAW) secure a historic pay hike for staff at Detroit’s Big 3, he’s coming for Tesla next." Link to article: UAW boss says Big 3 can give their fair share after earning a quarter of a trillion in profits over past decade

 

[MP3Mike]

Given UAW's leader Shawn Fain's statement earlier this month that he is going after Tesla it would be fair to say that they haven't given up yet.

It doesn't matter what he wants, it only matters what the Tesla employees want.

 

[TSemi]

It doesn't matter what he wants, it only matters what the Tesla employees want.

UAW leader Shawn Fain knows this and knows it well. So why would he say he's coming after Tesla? What is behind Shawn Fain's statement "after the United Auto Workers (UAW) secure a historic pay hike for staff at Detroit’s Big 3, he’s coming for Tesla next." ?

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

It just means that they'll try to organize and get Tesla unionized.
Only be concerned if they win a vote, which they have so fair failed to do.

 

[dakhlkt22]

Soooo, which US Tesla assembly plant will the UAW target? Texas certainly isn't union friendly and Fremont is an older facility that Tesla would probably close if it had a replacement, such as Mexico. This unionization effirt isn't going to happen. Just like it hasn't happened at the other non-union US shops. By the time that the UAW has finished wrecking Ford, GM and Stellantis, Tesla will have automated its assembly facilities to the point where human workers have only a tiny role to play. That's why there are jokes in other threads here about the UAW organizing Tesla's robots.

I continue to believe that this union stuff is FUD, designed solely to manipulate the Tesla stock price.

In the 80s, there was a substantial backlash to Japanese auto imports. Part of the reason that backlash faded was that Japanese manufacturers set up shop in the US. I suspect we would seem a similar backlash if US auto manufacturers started importing substantial numbers of cars from their factories in Mexico. No manufacturer today wants to give up the perception that their cars are now "Made in America." So I don't really see Tesla shifting it all down to Mexico or something. It'd be horrible for their branding.

The OEM bankruptcies circa 2009 put UAW in a weak position. UAW has not been able to demonstrate its value to the workers at non-union shops because the entire US auto industry was recovering. Now that profits are healthy, I think UAW plans to demonstrate its value. Tesla employees who joined early may have some stock that's worth a lot now, but UAW may look better once Tesla employees see the new contract and if their stock options are underwater.

 

[Unclepaul]

With the government supported Chinese inexpensive cars being primed to enter the US market, it will be challenging for union labor rate plants to compete.
Currently the average auto worker with seniority costs about $120,000 annually in total compensation. This includes overtime and all benefits, including health care and retirement. Low seniority workers make less.
If the auto makers cannot sell enough cars profitably, paying union scale, they will need to either go out of business or move to non-union facilities.

Tesla, while not encouraging unions, has allowed their workers to vote, and they always choose non-union. They have a different incentive plan which often earn them company stock and other benefits. Hard to really compare Tesla pay to union pay, Take a look at the average union auto worker, then take a look at the average Tesla employee. Just the physical and sttitude differences are visible to all. See what the people look like on picket lines. See the corruption within the union management.

Seems like the new UAW president is shooting for the moon on his demands. Over the past 20 years or so, the % of union automotive shops has steadly decreases, while manufacturers determine where to open their new factories.

The Fremont site, was formerly a union shop that failed to be profitable and closed. Tesla purchased the plant and equipment for pennies on the dollar and now it is a profitable non union facility.

Complaining that their line workers make less than the company President is a foolish and mostly emotional argument. Presidents are usually more compensated by improving the value (stock) of the company. If their total compensation completely went away, it would account for less than 2 cents for every union employee. Using envy to extort higher worker pay is a common tactic for unions.

Elon works for Tesla for $1 year. He knows that his true worth to the company will be determined by how well the stock does. He works harder and more hours than any other employee, and is perhaps the one person most responsible for Tesla's success world wide.

 

[TSemi]

It just means that they'll try to organize and get Tesla unionized.
Only be concerned if they win a vote, which they have so fair failed to do.

As UAW Strikes at Big Three, Progressives Eye Next Potential Unionization Target: Tesla​

"This strike could be a bellwether," said one professor. "It's a hot time in the labor movement."
As UAW Strikes at Big Three, Progressives Eye Next Potential Unionization Target: Tesla

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