Will Tesla Semi be affected if Tesla becomes unionized?

[TSemi]

The anti-Musk sentiment in comment section is unbelievable. I've noticed this in other articles from Electrek about Tesla or Elon Musk as well.

Tesla sues Sweden’s transport agency and gets a small win

Tesla has sued the Swedish transport agency for not delivering Tesla license plates and gets a small victory in the huge battle in Sweden.

electrek.co

 

[Jigglypuff]

The anti-Musk sentiment in comment section is unbelievable. I've noticed this in other articles from Electrek about Tesla or Elon Musk as well.

Tesla sues Sweden’s transport agency and gets a small win

Tesla has sued the Swedish transport agency for not delivering Tesla license plates and gets a small victory in the huge battle in Sweden.

electrek.co

If you can't believe how much people despise Musk, you've not been paying attention.

 

[TSemi]

If you can't believe how much people despise Musk, you've not been paying attention.

I have been paying attention and it's still hard to believe. At Ars Technica it's pretty much the same.

 

[TSemi]

Swedish Union Leader Warns Tesla Is a ‘Threat’ to the Country’s Labor Model

Elon Musk's electric vehicle company has refused to bargain with unionizing workers, leading to an onslaught of work stoppages

themessenger.com

Swedish Union Leader Warns Tesla Is a ‘Threat’ to the Country’s Labor Model​

Elon Musk's electric vehicle company has refused to bargain with unionizing workers, leading to an onslaught of work stoppages​

Tesla's refusal to come to the bargaining table and negotiate with its Swedish mechanics represents a substantial threat to the Nordic country's labor model, according to the union president going head-to-head with the automaker.

IF Metall Chairwoman Marie Nilsson, whose union represents some 130 Tesla striking mechanics, told The Financial Times that Sweden's economic prosperity is primarily due to its labor model, which focuses on employers and unions making joint decisions in the labor market.

“If you look at this in a long-term perspective, it could be a threat to the Swedish model. It’s really important for us,” Nilsson added.

 

[Jigglypuff]

I have been paying attention and it's still hard to believe. At Ars Technica it's pretty much the same.

Why is it hard to believe? He says and does terrible things. He treats people like trash. He magnifies the voices of hatred in the world. He's a one-man wrecking crew. The guy is absolutely horrible. The richest man in the world is literally trying to lower the standards of living for his workers so that he can get even richer. It's disgusting.

 

[TSemi]

Why is it hard to believe? He says and does terrible things. He treats people like trash. He magnifies the voices of hatred in the world. He's a one-man wrecking crew. The guy is absolutely horrible. The richest man in the world is literally trying to lower the standards of living for his workers so that he can get even richer. It's disgusting.

I disagree.

 

[SalisburySam]

I wonder what Marie Nilsson’s total compensation package is, compared to say, several employer CEOs in Sweden.

 

[Jigglypuff]

I wonder what Marie Nilsson’s total compensation package is, compared to say, several employer CEOs in Sweden.

I'm sure it's far less than a percent of what Musk makes, and I'm sure it's not a lot compared to US CEOs, who often screw over their workers.

 

[kpanda17]

Not sure if someone said this but
What if the companies wanting EV semis won’t buy because they fear their union drivers won’t drive a non union manuf vehicle/semi?

Crazy
I’m in a union (just an example/I’m not) and I’m not buying Cheerios because a non union robot put them in the box
Where does it go or stop?!?

 

[stopcrazypp]

Why is it hard to believe? He says and does terrible things. He treats people like trash. He magnifies the voices of hatred in the world. He's a one-man wrecking crew. The guy is absolutely horrible. The richest man in the world is literally trying to lower the standards of living for his workers so that he can get even richer. It's disgusting.

Well it doesn't only make him richer, it also gives us much less expensive EVs and keeps Tesla competitive in the market (the other EVs are struggling because they can't beat Tesla on costs). The only EVs that are poised to be even more competitive are those with even lower labor standards (the Chinese EVs that are starting to flood the EU market).

If you read the articles, Tesla isn't really concerned about Sweden specifically. It's a small market and Tesla can certainly afford any labor contract that might be thrown at them. Tesla fears it will set a precedent that will spread to other countries in the EU, especially Germany where they have their factory. That is what will threaten Tesla's EU market.

It's the same reason Tesla refuses to have even one independent dealer in the US, because it will set a precedent that can spread like fire.

 

[Jigglypuff]

Well it doesn't only make him richer, it also gives us much less expensive EVs and keeps Tesla competitive in the market (the other EVs are struggling because they can't beat Tesla on costs). The only EVs that are poised to be even more competitive are those with even lower labor standards (the Chinese EVs that are starting to flood the EU market).

If you read the articles, Tesla isn't really concerned about Sweden specifically. It's a small market and Tesla can certainly afford any labor contract that might be thrown at them. Tesla fears it will set a precedent that will spread to other countries in the EU, especially Germany where they have their factory. That is what will threaten Tesla's EU market.

It's the same reason Tesla refuses to have even one independent dealer in the US, because it will set a precedent that can spread like fire.

It's like a play about the evils of capitalism.

 

[stopcrazypp]

It's like a play about the evils of capitalism.

Well, people vote with their wallets. It's easy for people to claim online they want union made products or domestic made products, but when they actually buy the product, those factors typically end up playing very little role to no role in the purchasing decision (like they will literally not pay a dollar more for a product that is union or domestic made, much less thousands). This is what resulted in the downfall of the big-3 here in the US (two of which had to be outright bailed out and Ford was rescued by a huge ATVM loan) and also what accelerated all the outsourcing that happened.

 

[Jigglypuff]

Well, people vote with their wallets. It's easy for people to claim online they want union made products or domestic made products, but when they actually buy the product, those factors typically end up playing very little role to no role in the purchasing decision (like they will literally not pay a dollar more for a product that is union or domestic made, much less thousands). This is what resulted in the downfall of the big-3 here in the US (two of which had to be outright bailed out and Ford was rescued by a huge ATVM loan) and also what accelerated all the outsourcing that happened.

Mismanagement has dogged the US carmakers for years. Unions were never the issue. The management kept demanding products Americans wanted less and less, and management decisions caused terrible quality issues. Union demands were third tier issues.

 

[SalisburySam]

I'm sure it's far less than a percent of what Musk makes, and I'm sure it's not a lot compared to US CEOs, who often screw over their workers.

Musk makes $1, so doubtful Fain makes less. And while you’re sure Fain’s comp is less than US CEOs, I’d like to see actual numbers with their source, not just feelings. Since we all “feeling” here, I “feel” Fain’s comp is very much in line with the CEO of any organization…but would like proof.

 

[kpanda17]

Well, people vote with their wallets. It's easy for people to claim online they want union made products or domestic made products, but when they actually buy the product, those factors typically end up playing very little role to no role in the purchasing decision (like they will literally not pay a dollar more for a product that is union or domestic made, much less thousands). This is what resulted in the downfall of the big-3 here in the US (two of which had to be outright bailed out and Ford was rescued by a huge ATVM loan) and also what accelerated all the outsourcing that happened.

Btw, the average American looks for GE appliances, which is chinese owned and manuf, because they want to support American manuf

Like the British currently buying MG EVs thinking they are Brit owned and manufactured

Hate these fakeouts
We need smarter citizens

 

[TSemi]

https://www.thestreet.com/technology/tesla-ceo-elon-musk-technology-uaw-unionization

Tesla's Musk has harsh take on unions as the UAW takes bold new step​

The union said in a statement that thousands of autoworkers at more than a dozen nonunion automakers had announced organizing campaigns to join the UAW.

The organizing drive, the union said, will cover close to 150,000 workers across 13 automakers: Tesla, Toyota, Mercedes, Rivian, Lucid, Hyundai, Honda, BMW, Nissan, Subaru, Volkswagen, Mazda and Volvo.

 

[TSemi]

Radio program is in Swedish

Tesla-teknikern jobbar trots strejken: “Besviken på facket” - Nyheter (Ekot)

Än finns ingen lösning i sikte på den infekterade konflikten mellan IF Metall och Tesla.En Tesla-anställd tekniker som Ekot pratat med är kritisk mot fackets ...

sverigesradio.se

The Tesla technician works despite the strike: "Disappointed in the union"​

Text translated from Swedish to English:

Published today at 12:30 p.m

• There is still no solution in sight for the infected conflict between IF Metall and Tesla.
• A Tesla employee technician that Ekot spoke with is critical of the union's fight for a collective agreement, and chooses to continue working despite the strike.
• "If I hadn't liked my job, if it had been as toxic as they describe, then I would have changed jobs," he tells Ekot.

The technician, who does not want his name to be made public, does not support the union's demand for a collective agreement. He thinks that the conditions he now has are good enough.

- When I had a job that had a collective agreement, the wages were set based on a wage table. This feels nicer because if you do something well, you get a reward, he says.

The technician has previously been a member of the union for 10 years, but chose to leave shortly before the strike broke out in October.
- They didn't ask us how we are. I think that if you start a conflict this big, you should have been asked that question. The union has visited us several times but never asked any questions about how we are doing. They have only asked us to sign and turn their heels when they get a no. I felt betrayed.

Veli-Pekka Säikkälä is contract secretary at IF Metall and does not share the Tesla technician's view of a lack of dialogue between unions and employees before the strike.

- We have recruited members and that recruitment also includes talk about collective agreements. We have had member meetings, but my impression is that there have been broad meetings where they talked about the aim being to get a collective agreement, says Veli-Pekka Säikkälä, contract secretary at IF Metall.

 

[Rocky_H]

It's the same reason Tesla refuses to have even one independent dealer in the US, because it will set a precedent that can spread like fire.

Whoa, no, it is nothing at all like that. There's nothing there about "precedent" with the no dealer situation. It's because of actual published law in a lot of states that is a conditional. It says that if a car manufacturer EVER licenses to a third party dealership, then they are NEVER allowed to sell direct in that state.

There are around twenty-some states that have a law in place like that, so if they license to a dealership even once, they get blocked from direct sales in a huge portion of the U.S. and have massive problems. So that's not about a precedent that might be followed. That's about real negative effects that kick in immediately.

 

[stopcrazypp]

Whoa, no, it is nothing at all like that. There's nothing there about "precedent" with the no dealer situation. It's because of actual published law in a lot of states that is a conditional. It says that if a car manufacturer EVER licenses to a third party dealership, then they are NEVER allowed to sell direct in that state.

There are around twenty-some states that have a law in place like that, so if they license to a dealership even once, they get blocked from direct sales in a huge portion of the U.S. and have massive problems. So that's not about a precedent that might be followed. That's about real negative effects that kick in immediately.

Yes, I'm alluding to those laws, but my understanding is those laws only apply intrastate, so doesn't mean if you have one out of state it would impact that state. So Tesla is not doing any dealers even in states without such a law, for other reasons, which I suggest is the precedent setting.

 

[Rocky_H]

Yes, I'm alluding to those laws, but my understanding is those laws only apply intrastate, so doesn't mean if you have one out of state it would impact that state. So Tesla is not doing any dealers even in states without such a law, for other reasons, which I suggest is the precedent setting.

Unfortunately no. It doesn't only apply inside its own state. They only have the power to forbid sales within their own state of course, but the wording of the condition that triggers it of whether or not a company has licensed to a dealership is just an informational/factual question and in most of those cases is worded very broadly about whether they have done any dealership agreements, which is open to be anywhere! So that goes nuclear if they ever do it.