Winter Driving Experiences

[zax123]

Had no regen yesterday morning ("Regen Disabled" notice on console) at 17 degrees F. So today (13 degrees F) charged the car a little for about 20 minutes before leaving for work and regen works fine! Car also seemed less sluggish compared with yesterday. FYI I park the car overnight outside in my driveway (and plugged in).

We definitely need some charge programming options... we could set the car to do most of the charge overnight and then finish it off with a 30-minute warmup in the morning as per Robert.Boston's workaround...

Surprised Tesla is taking so long on this. I'm really looking forward to Tesla's take on all this, it's all rather disappointing.

 

[Robert.Boston]

Sorry if you mentioned it already, but is your Model S outside at night or in a garage? At 8*F, did you have any fogging or icing-up issues?

I park outside (private off-street parking, but no garage). I haven't had any issue with fogging since I thoroughly cleaned my windows, inside and out, with Invisible Glass. (I have no affiliation with Invisible Glass.)

However, battery warming sucked lots of energy (Tesla: we need some easy visual indication that battery is being heated).

With software 1.19.31, I get a pop-up notice on the dashboard screen telling me that the battery is heating. But, I agree, it's a huge power draw, and the car with low regen isn't nearly as great to drive. So, I'm going to be pre-heating every morning -- I do wish the app were available so I could do this without going outside!

 

[Doug_G]

I get the "Battery is Heating" pop up on 1.19.29 as well. It's not terribly helpful, though, as it gives no indication of "how much".

I'd love to have a simple one-number "overall pack temperature" number display. With just a little experience that would tell me everything I need to know about impact on range, etc.

 

[Nikoli]

With so many cold battery issues, my idea of incorporating the Tesla's garage into a climate controlled office/man-cave area of the house makes perfect sense. (assuming it would pass OH building code)

 

[Doug_G]

With so many cold battery issues, my idea of incorporating the Tesla's garage into a climate controlled office/man-cave area of the house makes perfect sense. (assuming it would pass OH building code)

I wouldn't be too concerned at this point. I think most of this cold weather stuff can be resolved through firmware updates. Simply having the car keep the pack warm if plugged in will resolve most of it. The Roadster already does that.

 

[mknox]

For today, I would guess that my range (according to my energy history) would probably be 175 km on a standard charge (far from 385 km).

Yikes! That's just a bit over my round trip commute to work. I could be screwed if I can't plug in at the office.

 

[Doug_G]

Yikes! That's just a bit over my round trip commute to work. I could be screwed if I can't plug in at the office.

It's not a realistic number. If you take a series of short trips, letting the car "chill out" between them, your power usage will be huge due to battery heating. But you can't consume the range of the vehicle doing that. There aren't enough hours in the day.

On the other hand if you get in the car and start driving, I can guarantee it goes MUCH farther than that! I have done several 300 km drives in cold conditions and arrived with a significant "safety margin".

 

[mknox]

It's not a realistic number. If you take a series of short trips, letting the car "chill out" between them, your power usage will be huge due to battery heating. But you can't consume the range of the vehicle doing that. There aren't enough hours in the day.

On the other hand if you get in the car and start driving, I can guarantee it goes MUCH farther than that! I have done several 300 km drives in cold conditions and arrived with a significant "safety margin".

Good to know. I am still hoping for some firmware improvements (which I'm sure are coming) to a) keep the pack warm and b) keep the charge topped off whenever connected to shore power.

 

[kbeckley]

One more example of what Doug_G posted.

Car sat cold soaking for a week plugged in while away. Got in this morning (-9C) to take the kids to school on way to work and no center screen. Driver's screen was fine. Car drove normal (zero regen). After dropping off kids (5 minutes) and other couple of minutes main screen comes on like it was never off. Took 15 minutes to get full regen on commute in. New 'Batteries are being heated message' appeared from the start. On version 4.1

A few other points I'll agree with that have been posted before:
Wiper fluid squirts too low.
Rain sensor is not sensitive enough.
Driver's side window fogging up in high humidity (but have not played with the settings yet).
Wiper should not wipe when opening door (wiper left on).

Tesla rep said mobile app should be out this month. Pre-heating will be welcome.

Oh yeah, great car!

 

[jerry33]

I'm sure Tesla isn't casting their own wheels. It may even be possible to find something of higher quality for less money (OEM parts like wheels tend to be very expensive).

I'm sure they're not either. They may be dictating the specs though. It may be possible to find a higher quality wheel for less. So far from what I've seen the higher quality wheels are more--a lot more.

 

[RichardC]

Snow Tire / Traction Control Data Point

I had the opportunity, earlier today, to test the Model S traction control and snow tires against a late model Prius shod with similar Pirelli performance snow tires, starting on an uphill slope. I ran the Tesla with and without traction control (on the Prius it can't be disabled), and when running with traction control, just pinned down the accelerator and let the traction control system do its thing. When running without, I ramped up the power slowly to keep the wheelspin under control. I measured the elasped time and terminal speed. Based on the comments on this thread, and the fact that the traction control on the current Prius is better than that on the previous generation, I was expecting the Prius to prevail. Such was not the result. While there was a couple of inches of snow, it was cold enough (around -5 C) that the tires were getting very good traction (which favoured the Tesla's current, highly interventionist traction control algorithm and greater power). Despite matting the pedal, the Tesla gave no sign of any wheelspin whatsover (not even a single km/hr). By way of contrast, the current Prius traction control algorithm was less interventionish, and the tires immediately spooled up to 10 km/hr before the traction control intervened. In the result:

2010 Prius w/TC 11-12 seconds and 29 km/hr

Tesla MS w/TC 8-9 seconds and 32 km/hr

Tesla MS w/o/TC 7-8 seconds and 33 km/hr

While the Tesla's algorithm worked well today, on cold, hard snow, I could see that it would be terrible if the snow was wet and slippery (our earlier Prius had a similarly interventionist algorithm, and it would take forever to crawl up a hill when the the snow was wet and heavy). In those circumstances the traction control on the Model S will likely be more a nuisance than an aid. I would suggest that Tesla revise the traction control algorithm to permit greater wheelspin at low power settings and at low speed to better address those circumstances.

 

[Zas]

.... I scraped off the inside of the windshield and the side windows, ....

Doug_G, how about the auto-presenting door handles - any problems in the that level of cold ? and were they covered in ice at all ?

 

[mknox]

How about stopping?

Sorry if I missed it in this thread, but in some ways, stopping on slippery winter roads can be more critical than starting. Model S is a pretty heavy car, and I'm wondering if any owners can comment on what happens when you hit the binders on snow/ice.

 

[Doug_G]

Doug_G, how about the auto-presenting door handles - any problems in the that level of cold ? and were they covered in ice at all ?

No problems with the door handles. Sometimes I have been greeted by crunching sounds as they extend. But extend they did!

 

[pbrulott]

Cold performance of the S still puzzles me. JonathanFsawyer posted the following in the TM forum.... this is -31C!!!!. I asked for more details but out of the gate, this is a quite different than what we saw posted here while closer to what Doug_G posted:

"Today I drove 170 miles nonstop from Steamboat Springs to Boulder Col. Temperature at Steamboat was -24F. It stayed well below zero for the first half of the trip (-28 in Kremmling!). Model S performed flawlessly. Arrived in Boulder with 90 rated miles left. Energy usage was 304W/mile. Went over two mountain passes (Rabbit Ears @9450ft and Eisenhower tunnel @11000 ft). Speed for the trip ranged from 45 to 75 mph on mostly dry roads.

For the round trip Boulder/Steamboat/Boulder the total energy usage was 110kWH or 324W/mile. Pretty damn good"

 

[Zas]

No problems with the door handles. Sometimes I have been greeted by crunching sounds as they extend. But extend they did!

Glad to hear it !! I was really worried about this.

 

[highfalutintodd]

Surprised Tesla is taking so long on this. I'm really looking forward to Tesla's take on all this, it's all rather disappointing.

I'll bet Tesla is really looking forward to their take on this as well. ;-)

I'm not personally surprised we haven't heard anything from them on the cold-weather performance yet. What's there to say just yet? Some people have great results while others are having a rough go of it. Outside of the fogging there's not a hell of a lot of consistency. I'm sure they're monitoring these boards closely and doing a hell of a lot of testing themselves.

Unless there's a real problem, they're not just going to come out and say, "Whoops, sorry, our car sucks in the winter." Sales will plummet and they can't afford that (especially when, as has been pointed out by smarter forum posters than I, we're talking about a high-performance RWD vehicle that probably performs no worse in winter conditions than other cars in its price range). If there IS a problem (or problems), they'll need to figure out if the fixes are mechanical or electronic. Either way, that will take time, and it's only been a couple of weeks since these reports started trickling in.

So while it truly sucks for those of us dying to hear any tidbit of info on this topic we can get, Tesla will respond when they're ready to respond... And when they have something to say.

 

[Beavis]

Cold performance of the S still puzzles me. JonathanFsawyer posted the following in the TM forum.... this is -31C!!!!. I asked for more details but out of the gate, this is a quite different than what we saw posted here while closer to what Doug_G posted:

"Today I drove 170 miles nonstop from Steamboat Springs to Boulder Col. Temperature at Steamboat was -24F. It stayed well below zero for the first half of the trip (-28 in Kremmling!). Model S performed flawlessly. Arrived in Boulder with 90 rated miles left. Energy usage was 304W/mile. Went over two mountain passes (Rabbit Ears @9450ft and Eisenhower tunnel @11000 ft). Speed for the trip ranged from 45 to 75 mph on mostly dry roads.

For the round trip Boulder/Steamboat/Boulder the total energy usage was 110kWH or 324W/mile. Pretty damn good"

Not bad but that drive is mostly downhill. It makes a huge difference.

 

[William13]

Mknox, the stopping is controlled well on slippery roads, thus no controversy.

 

[ModelS1079]

Drove 40 miles today, RTrip to work, and used over 120 miles in range. Included maybe 30 min time in aprking lot on the phone and another 15 min getting inspection sticker.
For the first 0 miles wH were 600 (!!), for the next 40 they were low enough to bring me to a 470's average for the 80 miles combined. BUT that does not include the energy/range lost while the car sat and I worked for 8-9 hours and then again for 2 hours.

Will follow this along and be sure this is really happening...

- - - Updated - - -

I wouldn't be too concerned at this point. I think most of this cold weather stuff can be resolved through firmware updates. Simply having the car keep the pack warm if plugged in will resolve most of it. The Roadster already does that.

Agree. Will be very helpful. Will still lose range w cold battery at work though, and all of this raises the question: What is the REAL MPGe if we are burning kWh just keepin' the battery warm?

- - - Updated - - -

...Almost no fogging but kept the climate in manual mode (I think I found some proper settings for cold temp.) as AUTO mode is not smart enough for winter...

Tell us what you are using for settings! We'll cal this overall setting the "PatP setting"