Winter driving in a non D car

[mknox]

Then you have different wiper arms than I do. Mine will not stay off the windshield in any mode without permanent damage to the wiper arms.

Right. Nor do mine. You can lift and hold them a few inches off the glass to facilitate swapping blades, but you cannot stand them up such that they stay off the glass by themselves (which many folks like to do in winter to prevent freezing).

 

[mrElbe]

Years ago, all American car models had wiper arms like that while European car wipers could stand up. Looks like Tesla went for some Nostalgia here.

 

[Lon12]

In the settings screen there is a service mode for the wipers isn't there? It moves the wipers halfway up where you can lift them up and they stay up.

I use this when cleaning the car all the time.

Well that is good news. I have not seen that before either. What is your year or number?

 

[snoblitz]

Just please, make sure you buy good winter tires.

 

[ilikechowfan]

Well that is good news. I have not seen that before either. What is your year or number?

2015 70D 080052 maybe because I don't have subzero package? Maybe the heated wipers have something to do with it. Here's some pics.

 

[Jeeps17]

2015 70D 080052 maybe because I don't have subzero package? Maybe the heated wipers have something to do with it.

Off topic, but I agree with you, chow fan is indeed delicious.

 

[green1]

2015 70D 080052 maybe because I don't have subzero package? Maybe the heated wipers have something to do with it. Here's some pics.

That is not possible on my car.
Nothing to do with the subzero package as a) I also don't have that package, and b) the "heated wipers" don't heat the wipers, only the windshield, the wipers are identical. My best guess is that somewhere after my car was manufactured Tesla finally came to their senses on this one (probably got tired of replacing broken wiper arms) and changed how they do things. Good to see them improve that part.

 

[awalia]

Green1

That is not possible on my car.
Nothing to do with the subzero package as a) I also don't have that package, and b) the "heated wipers" don't heat the wipers, only the windshield, the wipers are identical. My best guess is that somewhere after my car was manufactured Tesla finally came to their senses on this one (probably got tired of replacing broken wiper arms) and changed how they do things. Good to see them improve that part.

Green1 I take it yours is an very early build. Mine is a March 2013 and the new arm they put in stands up fine.
Now the next step is to put on aquapel and watch the water bead and slide off in the rain.

 

[green1]

Green1

Green1 I take it yours is an very early build. Mine is a March 2013 and the new arm they put in stands up fine.
Now the next step is to put on aquapel and watch the water bead and slide off in the rain.

Mine is a late 2014 build. You talk about a "new arm", that's the difference. I don't have the "new arm". and when I had to have this one replaced from this same type of incident, neither the Vancouver service centre, nor the local ranger knew anything about a new arm.

 

[Doug_G]

I've got a P90D Ludicrous loaner while the P85 is in for annual service. Even with the crappy Pirelli snow tires that Tesla uses, I can say that it is significantly better on snow than the P85.

That said, I'm just fine with driving the P85 on snow with good winter tires.

 

[mknox]

That is not possible on my car.
Nothing to do with the subzero package as a) I also don't have that package, and b) the "heated wipers" don't heat the wipers, only the windshield, the wipers are identical. My best guess is that somewhere after my car was manufactured Tesla finally came to their senses on this one (probably got tired of replacing broken wiper arms) and changed how they do things. Good to see them improve that part.

Ditto.

Green1 I take it yours is an very early build. Mine is a March 2013 and the new arm they put in stands up fine.

My Feb 2013 build definitely does not stand up like that.

 

[AnitaToronto]

I have a P85 and it's on its 4th winter. Driving around Toronto on Hakka R2s and even getting over small snowbanks is fine - I appreciate the active suspension for that. My only problem is backing up my steep driveway when it's not fully cleared and salted. The rear wheels get to a point where they slip and the car slides forward or just spins. Disabling traction control works some of the time but I have had to shovel and salt the entire driveway many occasions. We never had this problem with a Lexus RX, Mercedes ML or Porsche 911 turbo, which are all 4WD, even if we leave full snow on the driveway. Although I love my car 95% of the time, I'm thinking of getting a D just for the other 5%.

 

[cwave1]

I have a P85 and it's on its 4th winter. Driving around Toronto on Hakka R2s and even getting over small snowbanks is fine - I appreciate the active suspension for that. My only problem is backing up my steep driveway when it's not fully cleared and salted. The rear wheels get to a point where they slip and the car slides forward or just spins. Disabling traction control works some of the time but I have had to shovel and salt the entire driveway many occasions. We never had this problem with a Lexus RX, Mercedes ML or Porsche 911 turbo, which are all 4WD, even if we leave full snow on the driveway. Although I love my car 95% of the time, I'm thinking of getting a D just for the other 5%.

I have felt the same way for a while and just made the decision to trade my S85 for an S85D CPO before the price differences get even bigger..

 

[AnitaToronto]

What did that cost you in terms of difference in CPO vs trade in? My trade in quote is horribly low.

 

[e46jb]

What most people fail to realize about the difference between AWD and RWD is that they are basically the same.

If you took an average or below average driver, their typical driving tendencies would be to brake or lift off throttle in a slipping situation, but the only time an AWD will be more effective is when you are actually ON the gas pedal, otherwise, AWD is just adding weight and complexity to the vehicle. It is not helping these drivers to get out of a bad situation, where applying gas you will see a difference in response. As noted above, the choice of tire is more important than AWD vs RWD.

A driving instructor at a performance driving school spells out surface contact in a simple way......every tire has a contact patch with the road approximately the same size as the palm of your hand.

 

[doubeld]

Someone with more experience can correct me, but I believe the issue with a non-D Tesla is that the braking power is shifted to your rear axle.
For those that are coming from an ICE vehicle, you are used to the braking power being more front-heavy. Putting regen on your rear axle while going downhill around an icy corner spells trouble. If you have a D model Tesla, you get some regen on your front axle too, which will even out the braking distribution and make corners while under braking load more reliable and predictable.

But yes, if you're ever driving in <0 degree or icy conditions, winter tires will do more for you than anything else.

 

[Dax279]

What most people fail to realize about the difference between AWD and RWD is that they are basically the same.

If you took an average or below average driver, their typical driving tendencies would be to brake or lift off throttle in a slipping situation, but the only time an AWD will be more effective is when you are actually ON the gas pedal, otherwise, AWD is just adding weight and complexity to the vehicle. It is not helping these drivers to get out of a bad situation, where applying gas you will see a difference in response. As noted above, the choice of tire is more important than AWD vs RWD.

A driving instructor at a performance driving school spells out surface contact in a simple way......every tire has a contact patch with the road approximately the same size as the palm of your hand.

While I agree with most of what you have to say, I believe slippery hills and also in corners might be areas where an AWD could be helpful. Sometimes when talking a corner on a highway you will be on the throttle and there will be less likliehood of slipping as the car can route power to different tires if it does begin to slip, thus keeping you more on control through the corner and reducing the possibliltu of the rear end spinning out and on some hills you just get up without issue.

Even though I say this my last two cars were RWD and I have a lot of miles through winter on both.

Completely agree on the Tire comments, I just wish they had mandatory snow tires everywhere (here in Canada that is), as it just makes too much sense. I always worry driving through winter that There are too many people with the wrong tires.

 

[doubeld]

I always worry drinking through winter that There are too many people with the wrong tires.

I usually worry about the people who drink through the winter. I mean, it's not that bad!

 

[Dax279]

Whoops a few too many drinks tonight I guess good thing I am at home.

Thank you!

 

[Lon12]

Well I'm on my second winter with the non-D. I can't find any issues with it or icy corners spelling trouble. The stability control never lets the rear end move much.
The one observation I have made though is that the regen does a better job slowing you down on ice than the brakes. I would imagine that a D car with all wheel regen braking would be even better. I have scared myself when transitioning to the brakes on ice as the anti-skid seems to be much more primitive and slow at cycling the brakes compared to the more precisely controlled regen deceleration.

Anyone with a D care to share their experiences on ice?