Wow, see Trumps Climate and Energy Policy just put up on the White House Site

[Krugerrand]

No not about a single day but ironic nonetheless.
I am old enough to have lived through scientists predicting an ice age, acid rain, ebola virus, Zika, bird flu etc.............. all causing mass hysteria. The world will end blah,blah,blah.
I'm not saying global warming is a scam. I get the co2 ppm is over 400 and that is not a good thing. It's just hard to buy into theories when they have been wrong so often.

I'm old enough to remember those things too. And yes people sometimes over react, but maybe the over reaction is what saved many more from dying from ebola, and bird flu and flesh eating disease and now Zika - did you think of that?

And so there hasn't been an ice age - YET - doesn't mean we aren't headed there. And maybe there won't ever be an ice age in human history BECAUSE we reinvented our world and went to sustainable energy and transportation in time?

 

[tomas]

No not about a single day but ironic nonetheless.
I am old enough to have lived through scientists predicting an ice age, acid rain, ebola virus, Zika, bird flu etc.............. all causing mass hysteria. The world will end blah,blah,blah.
I'm not saying global warming is a scam. I get the co2 ppm is over 400 and that is not a good thing. It's just hard to buy into theories when they have been wrong so often.

Excuse me, zika, ebola, bird flu are not real? The mass hysteria is usually caused by media hype, not scientists. What you have with climate change is not a few scientists, but universal consensus. It kills me when people think it is still up for debate. When science says we could get totaled by an asteroid (and it has happened before to the dinos), that's a sad fact, and we have to hope for our odds. When science says we are f'ing with the earth, and there are real alternatives available, why would we not change course, especially since it would be a huge economic stimulant? Only reason I can think of is that it is not in the economic interest of the existing industries, and our leadership (all parties, most countries) are a sham... just in the pocket of the existing money holders.

 

[EarlyAdopter]

It will be put back in once raising sea levels start threatening one of his golf courses.

Already happened.

Trump acknowledges climate change — at his golf course

Thing is, while his business interests acknowledge it and work to protect themselves from it, he is misleading the public against it.

Former Republican Congressman Bob Inglis put it best:

“It's diabolical," said former South Carolina Republican Rep. Bob Inglis, an advocate of conservative solutions to climate change. “Donald Trump is working to ensure his at-risk properties and his company is trying to figure out how to deal with sea level rise. Meanwhile, he’s saying things to audiences that he must know are not true. … You have a soft place in your heart for people who are honestly ignorant, but people who are deceitful, that’s a different thing.”

 

[Canuck]

For a guy who comes from a country where free speech is a privilege and not a right, perhaps you'll find that there are a lot of Americans that don't give a damn about your opinions of their constitutional rights.

In Canada, section 2(b) of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms protects “freedom of thought, belief, opinion and expression, including freedom of the press and other media of communication”.

Free speech is a right in Canada, so the entire basis your unnecessarily angry post shows your ignorance. That is not an opinion or ad hominem attack on you. It's simply a fact in response to your factually wrong post.

It is my opinion that you need to calm down or you're going to give yourself a heart attack if a mostly factual post (with the only exception being that I admire your Constitution -- which is also a fact but contains opinion) makes you so angry. There's no need for such anger. Your guy moved into the White House. You should be happy!

Just to educate you some more, in Canada, we have restrictions on free speech, which are strikingly similar to the restrictions you have in the US. The classic example commonly used is you can't yell "FIRE!" in a crowded theater (unless there is a fire).

 

[Chopr147]

#64Canuck,
FIRE!
Actually I have disagreed with your take on a few things but as an American took no offense. You have a better grasp on our constitution than most American's.

 

[whitex]

I wonder how he will both go "all in" on shale and natural gas AND prop up the coal industry. My understanding is the biggest thing killing coal is cheap natural gas.

If you think a little out of the box, it's not impossible. Repurposing the coal industry (retraining workers, etc) to natural gas would accomplish both, no?

 

[hockeythug]

A welcome wakeup call for many in this country.

 

[nwdiver]

If you think a little out of the box, it's not impossible. Repurposing the coal industry (retraining workers, etc) to natural gas would accomplish both, no?

No... it IS impossible. If this was about 'repurposing and retraining' then solar would be the ideal path. Solar currently employs more people than coal and gas combined. Even more if you count wind. It's the communities they want to save. There's not a lot of work in natural gas, solar or wind in former coal-based communities. Sadly those people are going to have to move if they want to work. They don't want to do that.

No not about a single day but ironic nonetheless.
I am old enough to have lived through scientists predicting an ice age, acid rain, ebola virus, Zika, bird flu etc.............. all causing mass hysteria. The world will end blah,blah,blah.
I'm not saying global warming is a scam. I get the co2 ppm is over 400 and that is not a good thing. It's just hard to buy into theories when they have been wrong so often.

You need to separate that into theories where there never was a strong consensus like global cooling, and things that never got as bad as some predicted (like ebola). Even global cooling was largely based on the observation that SO2 emissions changes the energy balance of the atmosphere toward cooling and caused acid rain.... which we largely fixed with the clean air act.

It's more than a little disingenuous to accuse the scientific community of an error when something doesn't happen that they say we can prevent if we do X... and we did X. Acid rain, ozone depletion, bird flu and ebola never got really bad due to aggressive action.

 

[Ulmo]

"Lastly, our need for energy must go hand-in-hand with responsible stewardship of the environment. Protecting clean air and clean water, conserving our natural habitats, and preserving our natural reserves and resources will remain a high priority. President Trump will refocus the EPA on its essential mission of protecting our air and water."

[My emphasis.]

Last on the list, of course. Lip service.

The fact it's last offers opportunity to those who excel in it.

 

[hockeythug]

No not about a single day but ironic nonetheless.
I am old enough to have lived through scientists predicting an ice age, acid rain, ebola virus, Zika, bird flu etc.............. all causing mass hysteria. The world will end blah,blah,blah.
I'm not saying global warming is a scam. I get the co2 ppm is over 400 and that is not a good thing. It's just hard to buy into theories when they have been wrong so often.

After Climategate I stopped listening to those people completely.

 

[Canuck]

I am old enough to have lived through scientists predicting an ice age, acid rain, ebola virus, Zika, bird flu etc.............. all causing mass hysteria. The world will end blah,blah,blah.

Acid rain, ozone depletion, bird flu and ebola never got really bad due to aggressive action.

That's exactly right -- there was scientific consensus and action was taken. I'm old enough to remember CFC's in practically every can that sprayed something and now you can not buy one with CFC's due to EPA regulations.

After Climategate I stopped listening to those people completely.

It doesn't matter that you stopped listening. That misses the point. You don't need to listen or care at all about it. But when you go to the store to buy anything requiring a propellant, from deodorant to cleaning supplies to paint to you name it, you won't be buying one with ozone depleting CFC's because of federal regulations enacted in the 1970's. The Clean Air Act and U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) regulations further restricted the use of CFCs for non-consumer products. All consumer and most other aerosol products made or sold in the U.S. now use propellants—such as hydrocarbons and compressed gases like nitrous oxide—that do not deplete the ozone layer.

The past proves the point we are making -- it does not disprove anything -- citing examples where aggressive action made a difference is what we are wanting to do with climate change. I'm old enough to remember the severe smog of the 1970's and the real concerns about acid rain if we didn't take action -- fought by industry but forced by regulation.

We have consensus on global warming. We now need regulations. Those regulations are not coming for 4 years at least and we don't have that time to spare.

This is where it gets scary, for me at least.

 

[nwdiver]

After Climategate I stopped listening to those people completely.

???? There were 7, SEVEN independent investigations. How many do you need? 8? 9?

That's the kind of BS that's ripping us apart. FACTS are FACTS. Either do the work and publish the results or stop whining.

Which fact do you think is untrue? 1) CO2 levels have risen ~40% since humanities fossil fuel addiction started 2) The burning of Fossil Fuels has emitted twice as much CO2 as would be required for that rise 3) Doubling CO2 will cause a rise in temperature of >3C. The radiative properties of CO2 have been known and tested for >100 years... How can all 3 be true but Global Warming false?

 

[Canuck]

The sad reality of the world we live in today is that facts no long matter. How bizarre is it that we now have to be told BS from the President's Press Secretary about crowd size at the inauguration. They are so myopic they can't even see how idiotic and petty they look.

 

[ohmman]

The sad reality of the world we live in today is that facts no long matter.

To many of us, they still do.

 

[nwdiver]

The sad reality of the world we live in today is that facts no long matter. How bizarre is it that we now have to be told BS from the President's Press Secretary about crowd size at the inauguration. They are so myopic they can't even see how idiotic and petty they look.

We need a sad button

 

[hockeythug]

Children just aren't going to know what snow is. Right?

 

[AudubonB]

UH oh.
If some of you think acid rain "never really got bad", then you've not been paying attention. That most massive of all buffered solutions - the world's oceans - didn't become 35% more acidic over the past two hundred years - which it has - as a result of unicorn tears.

If you think otherwise, tell it to Australia's Great Barrier Reef. And effectively every other of the planet's corals.

 

[nwdiver]

Children just aren't going to know what snow is. Right?

No peer reviewed source has EVER predicted that...

There will ALWAYS be snow... unfortunately there will also be rising sea levels, more droughts, floods, famine, disease and extreme weather.

UH oh.
If some of you think acid rain "never really got bad", then you've not been paying attention. That most massive of all buffered solutions - the world's oceans - didn't become 35% more acidic over the past two hundred years - which it has - as a result of unicorn tears.

If you think otherwise, tell it to Australia's Great Barrier Reef. And effectively every other of the planet's corals.

Most of the ocean acidification was due to CO2 not SO2. Acid rain is more a threat to terrestrial life. It's the MASSIVE amounts of CO2 getting absorbed from the air that's the issue for oceans.

 

[jbcarioca]

No peer reviewed source has EVER predicted that...

There will ALWAYS be snow... unfortunately there will also be rising sea levels, more droughts, floods, famine, disease and extreme weather.
.

I have long thought 'global warming' is too simplistic, especially for people who do not understand that diminution of the Artic, Greenland and Antarctic ice reservoirs could diminish the Japanese and Atlantic currents due to desalination of the oceans, which n turn could have perverse cooling effects on Northern coastal areas and dramatic hearing in the rest of the world. There is some substantial evidence of that already, not yet enough to be conclusive.

Extremes, yes. Sad! It was avoidable.

 

[whitex]

Hard for people in the US to believe in global warming while going through freeze spells worse than before (e.g. meet Seattle is having one of the colder winters in a while, CA Silicon Valley is also colder than typical winters). That's the problem with naming something "Global warming" - everyone expects the weather to get warmer.

Second, world climate historically has changed in the past, way before first combustion engine or even before human population explosion (maybe dinosaurs were farting too much ). The issue is that all the studies show correlations, but fall short of proving causation. You could correlate the global warming to lower average murder rate in the western world, yet nobody claims we should be murdering more people to reverse climate change.