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2017 Investor Roundtable: TSLA Market Action

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Papa....ain't livin in paradise a bitch. When you've had your cup of coffee on the lanai, while gently ruffled by the trade winds coming off the Pacific Ocean, do you think you could do a mid-day look at the trading. I thought we would consolidate for a couple more days, but the stock seems to want to live at or above the upper bollinger Band, would be interested in what you think.

It's not as easy as you think. I just had to walk all the way to the papaya tree and back to get breakfast.

Anyway, a lot of traders consider the upper bollinger band and we haven't seen TSLA close above it for more than 2 days in a row during the run up of the past few months. So, TSLA has two headwinds today for going much higher: the upper bb, which is at about 280, and the desire of shorts to keep TSLA below 280. The most likely scenario I see for today is for TSLA to close just below the upper bb and a few pennies below 280.

That said, there's significant buying pressure right now, and a big enough leap above 280 could start rattle the shorts enough to get some covering. It would certainly have to be higher than 282. The good news is that time is working on the side of the longs. The combination of a higher upper bb number, a close above 280, and decent delivery numbers of Monday would be enough to get some shorts running for cover, I suspect.

tslamar30chartpre.JPG
 
I think Fidelity is on our side. I'm guessing the reason they made over a million shares available to short when Tesla did the offering at 158 is that they knew it was going to be oversubscribed. Why not let the shorts provide more shares? I'm guessing they know there is a large buyer out there again which is why they're again offering so many shares to short now. Maybe they're even buying the shares themselves, or doing this as a favor for a client.
 
Tesla bear's retreat playing out like scripted:
  1. Tesla can't make cars
  2. Tesla can't make lots of cars
  3. Tesla can't make lots of cars quickly
  4. Tesla can't make lots of cars quickly and grow
  5. Tesla can't make lots of cars quickly and grow and make money
Their GM looks great to me, I really don't think the bears have much substance, but the show must go on
 
I thought the theory was basically that the shorts think $280+ is ridiculously overvalued for TSLA, that it will return lower into the 180-280 band again, and that Model 3 isn't a success yet even if its on time because it won't be profitable.
I think you're right that, having spent so long convincing themselves that "TSLA is a car company in a bubble" that admitting they are wrong is going to be painful and potentially embarrassing. I also have no idea whether someone like Chanos uses technical analysis. That said, if we break out of this almost 2-year range (and it's still an if) then that has to give pause. Given the short interest, this is getting painful, to say nothing about what it does to the fund performance stats, and there's nothing like losing a lot of money for FUD to start playing with your mind and challenging what you thought were certainties.

I also think the tencent buy was a nasty shock to shorts. These guys (tencent) are smart, they have a lot of capital, they now have a vested interest in making Tesla a success in China and I feel this investment was strategic, so they're in it for the long haul.
 
Have not posted here in a bit due to being really annoyed with myself.... I got all stressed out by the Trump/Obamacare repeal/congress drama last week and sold off all my Tsla trading positions Friday last week (at like 262 dca). I feared further Nasdaq breakdown this week. Still heve my core position, but things aren't as exciting as they used to be....

Oil is having one of those cycles again and looks to have bottomed in the short or medium term.... I do like trading oil cycles and bought into CHK around $5. That position has been more exciting for me this week than my Tsla position, and that is really sad.

Congrats to everyone that held strong through the 250 and 240 craziness! I had too much exposure, got rattled by the swings, and chickened out....

Hoping for some 17Q1 prod number or ER price swings to expand my position again.

Edit: to add insult to injury, I wanted to buy back in around 260 Monday morning and slept through the pre-market opportunities.
 
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Tesla bear's retreat playing out like scripted:
  1. Tesla can't make cars
  2. Tesla can't make lots of cars
  3. Tesla can't make lots of cars quickly
  4. Tesla can't make lots of cars quickly and grow
  5. Tesla can't make lots of cars quickly and grow and make money
Their GM looks great to me, I really don't think the bears have much substance, but the show must go on

The argument presented by that article is dumb.

"Tesla is in trouble because European automakers are willing to accept lower margins on their electric cars."

They won't have a choice - Tesla is the only entity with sufficient batteries at a low enough cost. If the other automakers want to compete with Tesla on price and features, they're going to have to accept lower margins, or they won't be able to do it at all.
 
And I'm back to daytrading it.... thinking this is the mid day bottom and up from here to battle with 280 and close a hair under 280 like Papafox mentioned earlier.

View attachment 220467

Lately, when the volume gets low, after the usual early-morning excitement, TSLA seems to follow the broader indexes. During these low volume periods, is trading based on technicals like the bollinger band more reliable? At least until there's some event that significantly increases volume? I have no interest in getting into day-trading. Just curious.
 
Oil is having one of those cycles again and looks to have bottomed in the short or medium term.... I do like trading oil cycles and bought into CHK around $5. That position has been more exciting for me this week than my Tsla position, and that is really sad.

The frackers have figured out how to get oil out of shale for $40/barrel after the Saudi's shut them down at $55/barrel. So now oil has to get to below $40/barrel for the Saudi's to regain control. Instead, I think they will just give up and let oil prices drift. We may be seeing $40/barrel for some time. Fortunately, TSLA seems to be divorcing itself from the oil trade.
 
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Lately, when the volume gets low, around noon eastern time, TSLA seems to follow the broader indexes. During these low volume periods, is trading based on technicals like the bollinger band more reliable? At least until there's some event that significantly increases volume? I have no interest in getting into day-trading. Just curious.

I have made and lost approximately equal amounts day trading Tsla since the 180 bottom.

What works good is finding a pattern (morning pop, mid day dip, afternoon slow rise for example). And day trading it without accumulation on top of postitions already held.

It's fun to day trade when the stock is going up or topping out, but accumulating a huge position there is a great way to expose ones self to pain that has caused me to sell at a loss or break even.

What killed me is day trading the usual pattern, having the pattern change and what looks like a mid day dip turn into a massive sell off. Followed by me buying into that, refusing to cut my losses, having too much exposure for the next few days worth of turbulence, and selling off on the first tick up to end the pain (which was pretty extreme due to too much exposure).

Lesson learned from this... if one wants to play the day trading game, and the stock is following or above the top BB in a medium term chart, do not accumulate a larger than comfortable position!

I have done good trading Tsla long and medium term. Day trading it has cost me a hundred K or so between the last excursion past 280 and now. Not to mention a lot of stress. That is approx. equal to the daytrading gains from 180 to 250.

I think I better quit day trading hahhaha.
 
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Tesla bear's retreat playing out like scripted:
  1. Tesla can't make cars
  2. Tesla can't make lots of cars
  3. Tesla can't make lots of cars quickly
  4. Tesla can't make lots of cars quickly and grow
  5. Tesla can't make lots of cars quickly and grow and make money
Their GM looks great to me, I really don't think the bears have much substance, but the show must go on

Speaking of GM, there's also the General Motors chapter you neglected:

6. Tesla can't make lots of cars quickly and grow and make money andwhenthatdoesn'tworktossbucketsofcashouttoshareholdersasdividendsandhopetheydon'trealizeit'sbecausetheirbusinessmodel'sfailed
 
Am I the only one here who expects slightly-disappointing delivery numbers followed by a dip next week ?

My reasoning:
- production was stopped for some time during the quarter (10-14 days shutdown ?)
- Elon's recent twitter-storm pointing out that M3 is not a newer=better car, Model-S is still the top model, suggesting to me that he is fighting the Osborne effect and feels the need to pull some demand levers on the S, he wouldn't need that if Q1 numbers were off the chart
- Tencent buying pushed SP up strongly in Q1, which in turn triggered some window-dressing shopping from Fund managers in the last weeks of March, but that stops by the end of this week with the quarter ending
- Shorts feel the pressure and waiting for their last Hail Marry chance, so any small bad news (less than expected delivery numbers) would give them the signal to launch their last-resort desperate attack

So I sold some of my position this week at these close-to-ATH prices and hoping I will get the chance next week to buy back at a discount due to the dip I expect.

Of course, I might be wrong and may regret this selling if the SP keeps climbing...
 
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Am I the only one here who expects slightly-disappointing delivery numbers followed by a dip next week ?

My reasoning:
- production was stopped for some time during the quarter (10-14 days shutdown ?)
- Elon's recent twitter-storm pointing out that M3 is not a newer=better car, Model-S is still the top model, suggesting to me that he is fighting the Osborne effect and feels the need to pull some demand levers on the S, he wouldn't need that if Q1 numbers were off the chart
- Tencent buying pushed SP up strongly in Q1, which in turn triggered some window-dressing shopping from Fund managers in the last weeks of March, but that stops by the end of this week with the quarter ending
- Shorts feel the pressure and waiting for their last Hail Marry chance, so any small bad news (less than expected delivery numbers) would give them the signal to launch their last-resort desperate attack

So I sold some of my position this week at these close-to-ATH prices and hoping I will get the chance next week to buy back at a discount due to the dip I expect.

Of course, I might be wrong and may regret this selling if the SP keeps climbing...

Totally possible that the results could be disappointing and there be a dip. But...

1) Who is to say what is disappointing? They guided for 47,000 to 50,000 for 1H, (23,500 to 25,000 per quarter if they produced evenly). 23,500 is a pretty low bar, maybe even sandbagged. With most eyes on M3 develeopments, the market likely will look over a 22,500 "miss" or something. But since they provided no Q1 guidance, it is harder for critics to scream miss at all.

2) Shutdown was short, and was to move in equipment. They could work ahead, be efficient with the shutdown, and then get right back to work. This contrasts with other shutdowns that involved line upgrades or product changes which probably involve more slowdown.

3) Elon tweet storm and osborning: Maybe. I read it differently. The fear was probably for Q2, where it would really make sense to wait-and-see, even for people who would end up getting ans S or X. Also, the S is being repositioned to be higher in the market. There was a long time there where the S was being marketed downmarket, with the 60kWh strippers. They are ending that and saying "The Model S is much better than the Model 3". That needed said, and the timing is right. In other words, maybe just pragmatic product positioning, at the proper time, and not any particular fear.

4) I think you are making the point with the other items that the stock is bid up and therefore primed to fall. indeed it might be and every previous time one has been smart to sell at a local top of 280. Maybe this time too. But eventually there will be a time when it doesn't work. When 280 isn't effective resistance, and the script flips. Surging past 290, shorts freak out and momentum traders observe that this darling stock has broken out-- enthusiastic, even ill-informed longs get in and shorts have cascading stops taken out as they cover at ever higher prices. That is what is at stake, and why ANYONE is long at 280-- it will eventually break out.
 
Am I the only one here who expects slightly-disappointing delivery numbers followed by a dip next week ?

My reasoning:
- production was stopped for some time during the quarter (10-14 days shutdown ?)
- Elon's recent twitter-storm pointing out that M3 is not a newer=better car, Model-S is still the top model, suggesting to me that he is fighting the Osborne effect and feels the need to pull some demand levers on the S, he wouldn't need that if Q1 numbers were off the chart
- Tencent buying pushed SP up strongly in Q1, which in turn triggered some window-dressing shopping from Fund managers in the last weeks of March, but that stops by the end of this week with the quarter ending
- Shorts feel the pressure and waiting for their last Hail Marry chance, so any small bad news (less than expected delivery numbers) would give them the signal to launch their last-resort desperate attack

So I sold some of my position this week at these close-to-ATH prices and hoping I will get the chance next week to buy back at a discount due to the dip I expect.

Of course, I might be wrong and may regret this selling if the SP keeps climbing...
I imagine that if his tweet-storm was to drum up business then it is more about their projections for MS sales in q2 and beyond, not q1.
 
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But I agree with him 100%, I just don't post it every day. TSLA will be 500 by October, that's my prediction. Once M3's start rolling-off the line it's over. Only a major disaster can stop it.
Okay dude! You got your wish. From now on I will not post my opinions here anymore . I'm actually making too much money to care one way or other and there is absolutely zero cause for me to post my insights for free on an unappreciative forum when I'm able to better use my time to make more money in a day than most traders make in a year. My option position alone is enough to buy me a stable of Teslas not even counting my stock position
So from here on I'll use my opinions to trade my own accounts and not throw my trading insights out there for free
Have fun!
 
Okay dude! You got your wish. From now on I will not post my opinions here anymore . I'm actually making too much money to care one way or other and there is absolutely zero cause for me to post my insights for free on an unappreciative forum when I'm able to better use my time to make more money in a day than most traders make in a year. My option position alone is enough to buy me a stable of Teslas not even counting my stock position
So from here on I'll use my opinions to trade my own accounts and not throw my trading insights out there for free
Have fun!

Dude just put him on ignore and keep posting !
 
Since you are granting wishes-
I wish to read all opinions, whenever they suit the poster to post. I think we are better for it-- please continue to post your opinions as often as you have them.
Please grant this wish

Yes! Remember the bots are likely reading our posts. So may be @TrendTrader007 has the right idea. The more we all scream bullishly about TSLA, maybe the bots will pick it up and push the SP up higher and higher!

GO TSLA GO!;)
 
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