2023 Model 3 without USS and proximity functionality [park assist / summon not available]

[dansev]

I’ve made the decision. I backed out of my purchase (with FSD transfer) and will wait to buy a refreshed Y or a car from another manufacturer.

I’ve driven the 23 Y a bunch of times. Great car but the lack of USS and front camera is awful. The 2023 models will be the only models without USS and/or a front camera.

What car were you supposed to trade in?

What makes this so hard for me:

1) FSD transfer. I would never pay anywhere near what Tesla asks for FSD now. But I do LOVE auto lane changes, stopping at stop signs and lights and Navigate on Autopilot. EAP almost gets you there. But that's $6,000 and doesn't have stop sign and red light functionality. So if I can't transfer FSD in the future, I pay $6,000 and get less features.
2) Tax incentives. Here in Massachusetts, including the Federal credits, I will save $11,000.
3) I have 5 kids who were pre-teen when I got my 2019 M3, and are all adult-sized bodies now! I need a bigger car.

I just don't know what to do. But the idea that I could be buying the only Tesla without USS and/or a front camera is soooo painful.

 

[jbrady3324]

What car were you supposed to trade in?

What makes this so hard for me:

1) FSD transfer. I would never pay anywhere near what Tesla asks for FSD now. But I do LOVE auto lane changes, stopping at stop signs and lights and Navigate on Autopilot. EAP almost gets you there. But that's $6,000 and doesn't have stop sign and red light functionality. So if I can't transfer FSD in the future, I pay $6,000 and get less features.
2) Tax incentives. Here in Massachusetts, including the Federal credits, I will save $11,000.
3) I have 5 kids who were pre-teen when I got my 2019 M3, and are all adult-sized bodies now! I need a bigger car.

I just don't know what to do. But the idea that I could be buying the only Tesla without USS and/or a front camera is soooo painful.

I would have traded in a 2019 Model 3 LR RWD. I am in a similar boat in NJ (9k tax credits). I have 2 kids under 5 and 2 dogs so the Y, like you, makes a lot of sense. I could use the AWD as well.

Ultimately, I think the FSD transfer offer will continue or come back. They built the process into the app. I don’t think they would have wasted their time, resources and money doing so if this was a one-time promotion.

It may cost more to upgrade to the next Y model but you will feel better about it. It will certainly cost more to buy a Y now and then another Y in 2-3 years.

Will your kids drive be old enough to drive a car soon? Do you trust them to park using Vision? I’m somewhat joking but I look at the 23 models as a safety concern that could cause a parking accident. Likely? Probably not. But who knows.

I rather wait and buy the car I want and feel comfortable with. The wait won’t be long. Tesla has a ton of pressure to sell and I don’t think prices are going up anytime soon. The competition is catching up.

Additionally, I just don’t trust Tesla anymore.

 

[patmurphey]

They can’t fix parking.

They can’t fix car creep.

They can’t deliver on FSD with current USS-less, vision only driving systems.

I guess we should bow to your expertise over Tesla's engineers.

 

[jbrady3324]

I guess we should bow to your expertise over Tesla's engineers.

I mean… is he wrong? It’s been almost a year and Tesla has not delivered summon, auto park and accurate distant readings on cars without USS.

 

[jecsun]

I guess we should bow to your expertise over Tesla's engineers.

To clarify, I still enjoy the two Tesla’s I have owned for what they are in their current form. But when purchasing Tesla’s, buy them for what they are NOW, and not what’s promised in a future update. If you’re going to pay 12k for FSD, don’t expect to get a product substantially better in 2 years (if so, great). I paid for EAP when Musk was tweeting about ASS, probably on while on his throne. I didn’t make that mistake on my new Y

 

[dansev]

I would have traded in a 2019 Model 3 LR RWD. I am in a similar boat in NJ (9k tax credits). I have 2 kids under 5 and 2 dogs so the Y, like you, makes a lot of sense. I could use the AWD as well.

Ultimately, I think the FSD transfer offer will continue or come back. They built the process into the app. I don’t think they would have wasted their time, resources and money doing so if this was a one-time promotion.

It may cost more to upgrade to the next Y model but you will feel better about it. It will certainly cost more to buy a Y now and then another Y in 2-3 years.

Will your kids drive be old enough to drive a car soon? Do you trust them to park using Vision? I’m somewhat joking but I look at the 23 models as a safety concern that could cause a parking accident. Likely? Probably not. But who knows.

I rather wait and buy the car I want and feel comfortable with. The wait won’t be long. Tesla has a ton of pressure to sell and I don’t think prices are going up anytime soon. The competition is catching up.

Additionally, I just don’t trust Tesla anymore.

I just cancelled my order for a MY. All of a sudden my M3 with USS, a strong battery, 2 more years of drive train and battery warranty, and what will be fully paid off in 2 years, is feeling really good. I had to pay $250 to realize it. But I’m really happy. I hope to get a few more trouble free years with it. By then, hopefully we’ll have significant upgrades.

Thanks, jbrady for helping me see the light!

 

[Geech72]

I guess we should bow to your expertise over Tesla's engineers.

The engineers aren’t the problem, it’s the leadership

 

[nate704]

 

[jecsun]

Why was my post consolidated here?

 

[Geech72]

Why was my post consolidated here?

Because this site likes to consolidate all of the negative posts.

 

[Geech72]

View attachment 970333

Then give it a rest

 

[BlkDragon]

If USS was an option rather than baked into the cars as a component frankly I would have gladly paid a premium as would a legion of other buyers. Redundancy is what makes any large multi-ton machinery safe and I'm very happy to PAY for such redundancy.

The option to do away with rain/USS sensors as well as turn stalks isn't a cool design aesthetic measure that makes a car safe yet stay cool, it's cost cutting at the cost of safety. Musk can try to whip the software engineers harder but they can't fix totally bad design with good software.

If you're not convinced, research Boeing MAX 8.

Profit >>> Human Lives. Always. Sad that Musk has turned to the dark side. It all started to head to the point of no return when people made fun of him for trying to save the miners. Think he said"screw humanity" after that fiasco.

 

[gglockner]

The option to do away with rain/USS sensors as well as turn stalks isn't a cool design aesthetic measure that makes a car safe yet stay cool, it's cost cutting at the cost of safety.

Also add: horn is not controlled by pressing center of wheel/yoke.

 

[Msjulie]

The option to do away with rain/USS sensors as well as turn stalks isn't a cool design aesthetic measure that makes a car safe yet stay cool, it's cost cutting at the cost of safety. Musk can try to whip the software engineers harder but they can't fix totally bad design with good software.

Yup it's all cost saving not oh-so-cool UI ( sigh, means I won't be replacing my 3 anytime since I want actual stalks especially for the PRND stuff)

If you're not convinced, research Boeing MAX 8.

Profit >>> Human Lives. Always. Sad that Musk has turned to the dark side. It all started to head to the point of no return when people made fun of him for trying to save the miners. Think he said"screw humanity" after that fiasco.

I used to respect Elon, now I have my Tesla in spite of him .

 

[osunick]

If USS was an option rather than baked into the cars as a component frankly I would have gladly paid a premium as would a legion of other buyers. Redundancy is what makes any large multi-ton machinery safe and I'm very happy to PAY for such redundancy.

The option to do away with rain/USS sensors as well as turn stalks isn't a cool design aesthetic measure that makes a car safe yet stay cool, it's cost cutting at the cost of safety. Musk can try to whip the software engineers harder but they can't fix totally bad design with good software.

If you're not convinced, research Boeing MAX 8.

Profit >>> Human Lives. Always. Sad that Musk has turned to the dark side. It all started to head to the point of no return when people made fun of him for trying to save the miners. Think he said"screw humanity" after that fiasco.

Tesla relentlessly reduces build variations to control cost (to great effect, I used to work on this problem at a big automaker and you'd be shocked at how much complexity and cost variants add) so it would actually be cheaper to make USS installed on every car, even if gated behind an activation fee. Removing USS just seems like a head scratcher and a way to force the hardworking AP team to work even harder.

 

[TheJMan]

to

Also add: horn is not controlled by pressing center of wheel/yoke.

To be honest having the horn not controlled by the center is actually much safer.
Yes over decades we have become used to smashing the center with your hand and its hard to adjust but that actually makes it a lot worse in an accident when the airbag pushes your arm / hand that you had pushing down on the horn straight into your face (at tremendous speed btw)
Yes I know people say sure but if I instinctively push there and have no horn it can result in an accident etc.
I have 4 cars of which 1 has the horn not in the center (Landrover Discovery 4 - the horn are two silver long bars running down the steering wheel to the right and left of the airbag that you push with your thumb) and over the last 13 years I have never misplaced my hands / thumbs to the wrong location to press the horn despite switching through the cars frequently depending on what I need.
I understand that some people cant adjust fast enough and yes then its bad but it remains that it is actually safer as described above.

 

[gglockner]

to

To be honest having the horn not controlled by the center is actually much safer.
Yes over decades we have become used to smashing the center with your hand and its hard to adjust but that actually makes it a lot worse in an accident when the airbag pushes your arm / hand that you had pushing down on the horn straight into your face (at tremendous speed btw)
Yes I know people say sure but if I instinctively push there and have no horn it can result in an accident etc.
I have 4 cars of which 1 has the horn not in the center (Landrover Discovery 4 - the horn are two silver long bars running down the steering wheel to the right and left of the airbag that you push with your thumb) and over the last 13 years I have never misplaced my hands / thumbs to the wrong location to press the horn despite switching through the cars frequently depending on what I need.
I understand that some people cant adjust fast enough and yes then its bad but it remains that it is actually safer as described above.

Is the horn button on your Land Rover a physical button or a touch pad? The issue with the horn on the refresh Model S/X is that it's a touch pad that is difficult to find by feel. So when you need the horn urgently, you have to look at the yoke/wheel instead of at the road. Extremely unsafe design.

 

[TheJMan]

Is the horn button on your Land Rover a physical button or a touch pad? The issue with the horn on the refresh Model S/X is that it's a touch pad that is difficult to find by feel. So when you need the horn urgently, you have to look at the yoke/wheel instead of at the road. Extremely unsafe design.

it physical buttons yes.
fair enough ok. I seem to remember reading somewhere that putting your hand across all the buttons on the right side of the model s yoke activates the horn?

 

[gglockner]

it physical buttons yes.
fair enough ok. I seem to remember reading somewhere that putting your hand across all the buttons on the right side of the model s yoke activates the horn?

Correct. A button would still be far better.

 

[Tha_Ape]

Correct. A button would still be far better.

"Just use voice commands"

(Whenever anyone here complains about not having a physical button/switch)