I feel pretty good ordering my car in late October and taking deliver in December. Over 6 months of enjoying my car without a major change. As far as playing the Tesla game, I feel ok. If only AP2 was progressing...
-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
75 and 75D variants increased performance from July 1st - software and hardware improvements?
- Thread starter Bluejuice
- Start date
Sure, me too in my Q1/2017 car. My Model X had non-pack trim choices on order, free Supercharging, ventilated seats, adaptive spoiler, Helix wheels I wanted, all/most of those now discontinued, and it cost a five-figure sum less than it now does. And I wanted the 6-seater without a center console, so I'm not missing anything there yet, either. EAP(+FSD) is crap, but well, it is there.
But the thing is, as things stand, we got lucky. Tesla could have had that HUD/interior refresh lined up for early 2017, we know something like that is coming and maybe it comes in Q3 or maybe not... Luck is really not a very good way to buy cars if you care about these details. So I am more looking towards the future than contemplating my own past purchases.
Frankly, I got the Model X because it for me was coming to the point that either I accept it now or move on from Tesla for now (a 2014 reservation, Q2/2016 order originally and really getting long in the tooth). Delaying any more was not an option for me for a multitude of reasons. But were I now buying a Tesla, I would definitely wait - probably several quarters simply because I believe significant upgrades are in the cars and at this rate come at random times over the next months...
As things stand, I expect my next wait will lead me to an I-Pace or an Audi e-tron something. If Tesla improves as a company, maybe that will still change.
@AnxietyRanger -- I agree, Tesla should do a better job communicating but when I say things like that the "true believers" come out in droves and ding me with "disagrees" without explaining why or elaborating on why its in Tesla's best interest to disappoint their existing consumer base.
I think it will be difficult to drum up a lot of sales with their current method because they are creating uncertainty and a lack of information which means buyers are going to be more hesitant to pull the trigger on a new car knowing a better one will be coming down the road. But clearly the market is favorable for the moment.
I think it will be difficult to drum up a lot of sales with their current method because they are creating uncertainty and a lack of information which means buyers are going to be more hesitant to pull the trigger on a new car knowing a better one will be coming down the road. But clearly the market is favorable for the moment.
@croman Yeah, I'm all for realism. Noting Tesla's reasons for doing things is different from accepting them - and I do note their reasons and agree with many on why they do what they do.
That said, I do think traditional demand levers (advertisements, perhaps traditional price campaigning) should have been attempted before some of the demand levers they've had to pull. I think they could help and hurt less than current shenanigans.
That said, I do think traditional demand levers (advertisements, perhaps traditional price campaigning) should have been attempted before some of the demand levers they've had to pull. I think they could help and hurt less than current shenanigans.
Esme Es Mejor
Member
If you buy a Tesla, you can have the greatest, but only until they release something greater. That sucks, but the alternative is buying something other than a Tesla, which means never having the greatest, not even for a short while.
Now is always the best time to buy a Tesla, and there is never a best time to buy a Tesla. It's the same thing, stated two different ways. Trying to time a Tesla purchase is like trying to time the stock market-- just get in when you're ready, and hope for the best.
Now is always the best time to buy a Tesla, and there is never a best time to buy a Tesla. It's the same thing, stated two different ways. Trying to time a Tesla purchase is like trying to time the stock market-- just get in when you're ready, and hope for the best.
Actually no, it is possible - actually even likely in the international setting - that the "greatest" you ordered will not reach you before it is no longer the greatest. IMO a big problem with this fast a pace is that your purchase may old before you even get it - and it is not just an occasional occurrence or something to avoid with planning, it is a constant menace.
Add to that the fact that deliveries tend to be close to the end of a quarter due to the factory cycle that is optimized for as many in-quarter deliveries as possible, and changes often happen at the beginning of next quarter, the next wave of changes hits often very soon after delivery...
Not really the only alternative. The alternative is to wait. Or buy something that is great for different reasons (say best comforts or first Level 3 car on the market). Or wait for that I-Pace or Audi e-tron...
And that IMO is the biggest issue with this policy, especially after you've bought that first Tesla. Tesla's policy is not encouraging repeat purchase or rewarding loyalty. And I think that is rather short-sighted of them.
IMO making a product purchase feel different from investing in the stock market would be wise from a manufacturer, from a customer satisfaction point of view.
There's no reason to believe the increased power will stick. A few month from now Tesla may find that the small motors can't handle the extra power from the new inverter and poof there goes your extra power. At least they didn't charge $10,000 for the extra power.
So maybe this is a prelude to the Model 3 P car. It could be a 400V 75kwh battery, or maybe a software limited 85kwh battery.
It would be hard to sell a M3 for $35k and MS for $70k with the similar range and performance specs. A $70k MS isn't exactly loaded.
sillydriver
Member
I agree with you that changes are more gradual since dual-motor. And certainly, AWD seemed to me to be the most likely major change while I was waiting. Insane mode and autopilot were frosting on the cake: I would have been satisfied with just AWD.
In my post I had two reasons for mentioning an improved interior as a potential trigger upgrade. First, I think Tesla's recently discontinuing alcantara on the dash is a hint that an interior change is coming -- downgrading the interior in this way is not good for business in the long run. They probably didn't want to re-stock the expensive material going into an interior redesign. Second, I think that having the M3 in the line-up demands that the MS/MX interior be differentiated from the new low-end model, as it is between models at different price points from other car companies. Before shipping the M3 there was no lower model to contrast the MS interior with, but now there will be. More broadly, upgrades to the MS/MX are needed once the production M3 becomes visible and gets a lot of press, so that interest in these high-margin cars doesn't fall off. I would expect whatever those upgrades are to be in place by early Q4 so that high-margin shipments don't fade by year-end. That's only three months of waiting.
Finally, someone with psychology like mine doesn't need to catch the largest upgrade perfectly in order not to feel like a fool. If I placed my order right after some reasonable upgrade I would be satisfied even if a more substantial upgrade came three months later. After all, significant upgrades can be expected within each year.
eJonny
Member
While I appreciate behavioral economics and the psychological impact a new, unannounced "version" of a car has on you, I don't believe that Tesla should hold back on continuous upgrades to its products. Tesla isn't under any obligation to share product roadmaps. Most companies don't, and the stories of freezing sales of existing products in anticiation of new versions are legion (you don't have to look further back than Apple's last quarterly earning call). And while that may "disappoint" some people, it benefits the product and the company.
I understand, and respect that you are disappointed with Tesla. I appreciate your concern that the value of the vehicle for which you just paid a ton of money may have gone down.
But, while your feelings are valid and your disappointment is real, I don't agree that Tesla is mistreating its customers.
I see Tesla making continuous improvements to its products. And, in my opinion, that is to be applauded.
I could tell you stories about how I ended up with an inventory vehicle because I wanted the free supercharging and placed my final order on the day that the free supercharging was re-introduced for one day. But I'm happy with the car I have because I made the best choice with the information I had and I understand that Tesla has the right to share some or none of its product roadmap. And because I feel this way, I don't suffer the same disappointment or feeling that I am being mistreated which means nearly nothing can reduce that feeling of joy I get from driving my model S.
What if they decided it was in everyone's best interest that you no longer have free supercharging, after you based your purchase on it. Would that dampen your joy any?
@eJonny - I'm not actually disappointed in Tesla for this. But I do believe they need to open their communication to avoid disappointment for others. Others argue it will negatively impact sales but full and fair disclosure should only delay not eliminate any sales.
That being said, thank you for your well thought out and well put post. I'm glad that you enjoy your Tesla, so do I. I do want Tesla to innovate and continue -- I don't see how they cannot both communicate and innovate.
That being said, thank you for your well thought out and well put post. I'm glad that you enjoy your Tesla, so do I. I do want Tesla to innovate and continue -- I don't see how they cannot both communicate and innovate.
From my perspective, Tesla has taken a great strategy to alleviate some of the big issues that traditional automotive manufactures have had to deal with and should allow Tesla to maximize profitability through stable production.
One of the biggest problems with automotive sales is the cyclic nature of the product. Several months before a new product release, people stop buying until they figure out what new features will be coming with the new model. This introduces several problems including what you do with your factories when people stop buying a current model year product. You start slashing prices (thus profits) to keep pushing sales. Traditional dealerships get stuck with a ton of inventory that they have to get rid of and whose lower prices will compete with sales of the new models when they arrive
With Tesla's non-traditional cycles, there's no set model year rollover date. So if someone really wants a Tesla, they buy now or maybe wait until a major update - but I contend that's far and few between. There's no big inventory pile-up, no need for discounting - it's pure steady revenues for Tesla.
FlatSix911
Porsche 918 Hybrid
I don't think this correct ... the (+) designation also improved 0-60 performance from 4.2 to 4.0 seconds.
You're conflating hardware and software updates. Do you demand a faster iPhone each year when Apple (or you chosen Android device manufacturer) updates the OS and the phone's components?
I'm just not following your logic. You liked the car enough as it was when you purchased it to buy it, so why are you suddenly so irritated?
For perspective, AP 2 was released a couple months after I got my S (after waiting years to pull the trigger) and the all glass roof came out shortly thereafter. I would have loved both, but not having them doesn't make me love my car any less. And I wouldn't assume that Tesla could swap out my roof or my AP hardware just because the newest cars have them.
⚡️ELECTROMAN⚡️
Village Idiot
Their strategy seems to be working pretty well. They sell a lot of expensive cars and have over 300,000 reservations for their new economy car. Are they going to sell more cars by increasing the 0-60 time by 1 second or by keeping it at the same slow 5.5 seconds that the previous 75 kWh car buyers have to suffer with? I'm pretty sure they are going to sell more cars after they improve them significantly. Pure genius. I sympathize with resent Tesla purchasers. I would be pissed too. There's definitely going to be some significant collateral damage with this strategy, but I don't think it's going to impact the bottom line. If the competition doesn't do the same, they are going to have an inferior product most of the time and lose sales to Tesla. When the Audi I-Pace comes out raising the bar, Tesla will just raise the bar even higher a few months later with new improvements. How long will it take Audi to raise the bar even higher?
⚡️ELECTROMAN⚡️
Village Idiot
So when it's time for you to buy a new car, you won't buy a Tesla, even if it's the best deal at the time? Just because Tesla spontaneously improves their cars every few months?Yes, Tesla will obviously be looking out for their interests. As is everyone.
That said, a good question is what level of "continuous improvement" is best for their overall interests - as those previous customers will come to matter at some point, especially if the word keeps getting out Tesla is like this, even to the new potential customers. I'm not sure Tesla is striking the right balance at this moment.
That's progress, I guess. At one point Elon was saying the best time to buy a Tesla is always now. IMO the best time is never. It will always be possibly a very bad time, though some times are of course worse than others.
Well, that's putting it mildly.But you're right, no. Not unusual.
/1st world problems of Joneses
If you can't live your miserable/full of envy/whatever life without having the latest and the greatest get a lease.
If you can't live your miserable/full of envy/whatever life without having the latest and the greatest get a lease.
Similar threads
