All but one supercharger spots used for hotel parking

[Larry Chanin]

You can call Tesla too. This is from their supercharger FAQ. "A non-Tesla car is parked in a dedicated Supercharger stall, what should I do?
Please notify Tesla at (877) 798-3752."

Maybe we should call every time there is an ICE in the stall, not just when we don't have a spot to charge at. That way they know how serious the issue is.

According to Tech Crunch the agreement with Tesla for the Supercharging Partners program is that the parking spots are to be dedicated to Tesla cars. Now, what that means as far as towing, cones, etc. isn't at all clear, at least to me, so while there is an agreement, it may not have any practical effect.

From what I've seen, a lot of public Level 2 chargers have the same ICEing problems as well. Without any incentive to do otherwise, it seems likely that ICE drivers and parking space owners in many cases won't keep charging spaces free for BEV's.

This all really does raise some questions about the real utility of the Supercharging network as more Teslas are sold. While Supercharging will help a lot with range anxiety, if owner's experiences involve frequent significant waits for others charging and/or ICEing there may be a lot of public questioning about their practicality as primary transportation.

That article is from July and given that we are starting to see general parking/supercharger signs being installed at the newer locations I suspect that the agreement has changes somewhat.

I just wanted to emphasize the point rlang59 makes. Tesla have what they call Dedicated parking and Enabled parking. As the name suggests Dedicated parking is dedicated to Tesla vehicles. Enabled parking are Supercharger stalls shared with non-Teslas, including gasoline vehicles. The Enabled spots are undoubtedly dictated by the host location and enforcement can vary from site to site.

Here's a photo of Florida's Enabled parking.

Larry

 

[EchoDelta]

I will call ahead of time and make sure that a spot is kept free from ICEing. In the nicest possible way.

You have a long experience with EVs and this is pragmatic and realistic.
Then it becomes a DIY reservation system; which is at risk when it scales beyond the EV early adopter community. "Hi Bonnie, welcome back. I had to keep some pesky Model S owners from using your spot!" Not sure Tesla wants a reservation-based system (formal or informal) to kick in because of constrained supply (real... or perceived! Has anyone ever been ICEd out of a SC?), so I'm curious how all this could be evolved with some nudges on their behalf.

Some things they could do:

- Supercharger on the maps should indicate how many chargers are being used and for how long when you are nearby, and how many have non-charging Tesla or otherwise cars parked in them. Blink,Chargepoint etc. have this automatic in-use bit available for 3rd party apps as well like plugshare.

- The superchargers should alert the lot owners as long as a non Tesla car is parked, as well as Tesla. Then a measurable SLA can be put in the contract terms for the space. The sensors to do this would be super cheap relative to the supercharger installation and can be done in privacy-conscious ways.

- Superchargers themselves should have a 24x7 customer support number clearly displayed; also in the car dash and app having a clear "problems, ICEd, etc? call 1800 NEED-AMP" for regular consumers to have a "so what now" next step. "Report an issue" should allow you to take a pic w the phone and submit it with some description.

- A more expensive alternative is putting a folding automatic 'orange cone/pole' that swings down as you approach only with a Tesla.

In the meantime, a quick call is a wise, polite and effective way to sensitize lot owners before there is an actual conflict/stressful situation.

 

[smartypnz]

Simple.
Install battery swappers and when the ICE car blocks - the swapper rips out the undercarriage thinking it's a battery.

No, just kidding.

Being ICE'd, as it is titled, can also be done by Tesla owners. As the volume gets bigger, a small problem I noticed at Folsom is also going to get bigger. Stopped there a couple of months ago in the early morning (after dawn). Another Tesla was there at a charge slot - no owner. We went to get coffee as ours charged. Upon return, the other Tesla owners arrived to get the car. They were staying at the motel across the street and had plugged in for the night.

These SC's at motels are going to be a problem - like having SC's at airports (and flying away for two weeks).

 

[bonnie]

You have a long experience with EVs and this is pragmatic and realistic.
Then it becomes a DIY reservation system; which is at risk when it scales beyond the EV early adopter community. "Hi Bonnie, welcome back. I had to keep some pesky Model S owners from using your spot!" Not sure Tesla wants a reservation-based system (formal or informal) to kick in because of constrained supply (real... or perceived! Has anyone ever been ICEd out of a SC?), so I'm curious how all this could be evolved with some nudges on their behalf.

[...]

In the meantime, a quick call is a wise, polite and effective way to sensitize lot owners before there is an actual conflict/stressful situation.

I will, of course, say 'unless other Teslas are using all the spots'.

The property owners agreed to lease that property to Tesla in exchange for drawing people to their location. They DO have some responsibility here. Talking with them in a reasonable way is easy enough to do. If they refuse to do anything about it, Tesla should know. I suspect that will violate the terms of the lease agreement in some way.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Simple.
Install battery swappers and when the ICE car blocks - the swapper rips out the undercarriage thinking it's a battery.

No, just kidding.

Being ICE'd, as it is titled, can also be done by Tesla owners. As the volume gets bigger, a small problem I noticed at Folsom is also going to get bigger. Stopped there a couple of months ago in the early morning (after dawn). Another Tesla was there at a charge slot - no owner. We went to get coffee as ours charged. Upon return, the other Tesla owners arrived to get the car. They were staying at the motel across the street and had plugged in for the night.

These SC's at motels are going to be a problem - like having SC's at airports (and flying away for two weeks).

As contention becomes more of a problem incidents like the above may be relatively less frequent. Just because those owners parked overnight when there's little use, doesn't mean they'd park there if they thought they'd block a spot.

For motels or hotels I'd hope that contention at nearby Superchargers would go hand-in-hand with more destination charging.

 

[Lyon]

How about a little info about the hotel in question? It's a Holiday Inn but they have several conference rooms in the building and host business lunches and the like. I'm pretty sure they have a Rotary club that meets there on a weekly basis. The Supercharger spots are quite close to those conference rooms and are probably much more attractive than the spots on the other side of the building (which are abundant but significantly farther away). Four of the 8 spots are reserved exclusively for Tesla charging, the other four aren't marked. My assumption is that Tesla and the Hotel's management company came up with a compromise given that there are times of the day when that lot is quite full.

The issue at this particular site is that folks coming in for an hour rotary lunch are likely running just on time or late, it's quite possibly raining (it's Oregon) and there are cars parked in front of some of the chargers. It's also possible that folks have done it enough with no consequences that they simply assume they can violate the signage. If there is an ICE parked in one of the reserved spots, whoever sees it should call Tesla and notify the hotel. The Hotel will have to inform its lunch guests that they may not use those spots unless charging and then they might have to tow someone. It certainly won't take many tows to get the message across. If I came up to a SC with signage indicating that the spots were reserved but found them all ICE'd, I would approach the hotel management with the request that they attempt to find the driver(s) of the offending vehicles and have them moved. Failing that I would ask them to have a car towed. I would be shocked to find out that the Hotel doesn't have some enforcement obligations as part of their contract with Tesla; after all, these stations aren't cheap and it would be foolish not to make each party's obligations clear before Tesla spent the money to instal them.

Here are some pictures of the site.

 

[C-NRG-GO]

+1000

This is EXACTLY what we should do. I firmly believe that Tesla does care. Yet if they don't hear from us, they are less likely to take action. If most of us take the attitude of not bothering, they will never be fully aware. Sure, they follow some of these forums and are in tune to many of our needs, but speak up when there is a problem and eventually we'll get our better signage/green paint/cones/etc.

I'm the original poster. I called Tesla Support from the car as it was charging. They told me that they lease the space, so those spots should be reserved. He thanked me for calling and said that they were logging these events. If the one spot hadn't been open, I might have talked to the front desk of the Holiday Inn to see about getting a guest to move their car. I would have snapped a photo, but it was pouring at the time and no umbrella handy

 

[mitch672]

I think Tesla needs to install these in the Supercharger parking spaces:

View attachment 40753
bebarmatic Automatic parking space bar: Parking Boy

It could even be software-activated - just add the radio signal needed to make the barrier drop to the garage remote feature. Make it GPS-aware, and voila - a Model S drives up to a Supercharger space, the barrier automatically lowers itself, but stays blocked to any other car.

I'll bet they'll eventually have to do something similar to this at one SuperCharger slot at a hotel/motel, it guarantees at least one charging spot for a Model S... But it's probably going to be just one stall, to not cause too much friction between the management, ICE drivers, and Model S owners, it's a good compromise.

 

[NoMoGas]

Surely Tesla doesn't want to go to the expense of putting in a supercharger without some minimal assurance from the property owner that it will be available to Tesla owners for charging.

I'd start with talking to them at the hotel and seeing if they can get a guest to move a car. They have some level of responsibility here, they aren't a passive player in all this. And of course, I'd call Tesla and let them know. It's not a great infrastructure if it isn't usable.

Absolutely. I'll go you one better, advise customers at check in to remain clear of those spaces. (Most hotels have a "map" of some sort but any kind of notification could go a long way.

- - - Updated - - -

How about a little info about the hotel in question? It's a Holiday Inn but they have several conference rooms in the building and host business lunches and the like. I'm pretty sure they have a Rotary club that meets there on a weekly basis. The Supercharger spots are quite close to those conference rooms and are probably much more attractive than the spots on the other side of the building (which are abundant but significantly farther away). Four of the 8 spots are reserved exclusively for Tesla charging, the other four aren't marked. My assumption is that Tesla and the Hotel's management company came up with a compromise given that there are times of the day when that lot is quite full.

The issue at this particular site is that folks coming in for an hour rotary lunch are likely running just on time or late, it's quite possibly raining (it's Oregon) and there are cars parked in front of some of the chargers. It's also possible that folks have done it enough with no consequences that they simply assume they can violate the signage. If there is an ICE parked in one of the reserved spots, whoever sees it should call Tesla and notify the hotel. The Hotel will have to inform its lunch guests that they may not use those spots unless charging and then they might have to tow someone. It certainly won't take many tows to get the message across. If I came up to a SC with signage indicating that the spots were reserved but found them all ICE'd, I would approach the hotel management with the request that they attempt to find the driver(s) of the offending vehicles and have them moved. Failing that I would ask them to have a car towed. I would be shocked to find out that the Hotel doesn't have some enforcement obligations as part of their contract with Tesla; after all, these stations aren't cheap and it would be foolish not to make each party's obligations clear before Tesla spent the money to instal them.

Here are some pictures of the site.
View attachment 40776View attachment 40777

Wonder if there is a signage problem... it doesn't sat Tesla EV parking ONLY, All others subject to tow.

 

[Kraken]

I know they are loving having the landscaping behind the stalls and the stalls near the perimeter, but they really should start putting them in stalls that back up to another stall.... This way it would provide a backup spot. He one stall could be signed, while the other isn't. It would mean that a site of 8 chargers would require 16 stalls to be iced...


further, contact the law enforcement. If there isn't a rule now, there might be one soon if they keep getting calls stating they could be making easy revenue if a law was in effect...

also, while hotels aren't a great solution, the only way to really fix the overnight teslas plugged in is to have 2 additional spots on hpwc... Put signage saying they are for overnight charging tesla driving guests. Put signs on thè superchargers that they are short term charging spots only.

 

[PokerBroker]

Tesla owners should know better than to park overnight and take up a spot for eight hours. The appropriate thing to so is come back outside and move the car in one hour, or go down an hour early to plug it in. This is an affluent enough group to be able to figure that out.

 

[stevezzzz]

You're saying money and common sense are linked? :wink:

 

[PokerBroker]

You're saying money and common sense are linked? :wink:

Good point lol

 

[scaesare]

I was thinking that maybe on a road trip I should just keep a floor jack in the trunk well. An extra 100 lbs maybe. If the establishment won't or can't get an ICE owner to move, I call Tesla and they can't help, and I'm in a location the police won't have the car moved, then maybe I could just push it out of my way.
Maybe the car alarm will go off. Maybe somebody will care and come out to check it out though I doubt it.

Sure, I'd leave a nice note: "Sorry to have to move your car, but I was stranded when you parked in a charging spot."
Can I get in any legal trouble for moving a car if I do no damage? I might have to leave it blocking some other ICE cars.

Get in legal trouble? Perhaps.

Get shot? Definitely.

 

[smartypnz]

Put signage saying they are for overnight charging tesla driving guests.

Now that's a good strategy - especially for Tesla owners just passing through in the middle of the night.

What's a new term for being ICE'd by a Tesla?

 

[InTheShadows]

Tesla owners should know better than to park overnight and take up a spot for eight hours. The appropriate thing to so is come back outside and move the car in one hour, or go down an hour early to plug it in. This is an affluent enough group to be able to figure that out.

Exactly, this shouldn't be an issue. I would hope that Tesla owners would have empathy for other owners that NEED that charge to get to their destination.

 

[PokerBroker]

What's a new term for being ICE'd by a Tesla?

AHOLEd?

 

[Cottonwood]

Tesla owners should know better than to park overnight and take up a spot for eight hours. The appropriate thing to so is come back outside and move the car in one hour, or go down an hour early to plug it in. This is an affluent enough group to be able to figure that out.

Let's take an example that is possible: An MS owner has been driving since waking up before dawn in South Dakota. They roll into Glenwood Springs and decide to check in the Marriott for good nights sleep before another big day of driving west tomorrow. They have every intention of moving the MS after dinner, but after getting to room, decide to take a shower, and order room service. After dinner with a little wine, still in the bath robe, and snow flying outside, they forget and leave the MS plugged in overnight.

The hotel is crowded and ICE's fill up the other 5 spots when I arrive at 2 am. Should I be mad at the MS, at the ICE's? Well, maybe annoyed, but what I will do is give the hotel clerk descriptions and license plate numbers of the ICE vehicles and see if they can get someone to move.

None of us are perfect, even if we a have the proof of choosing an EV. Let's all be patient and polite, but firm, to get our Supercharger spots for charging.

 

[scaesare]

The reality is that intended Supercharger usage patterns are somewhat antithetical to hotel guest needs. Supercharger stalls should be high-rate in & out turnover, hotels typically have low-rate long-term guests.

While I understand the need to try and find space to accommodate supercharger stalls, the reality is that they would be ideally located in parking spaces that are:

1) Not generally needed by ICE vehicles (the LEAST desirable parking spots at the far end of the lot)

2) If occasionally needed by ICE vehicles, in areas where parking stints are relatively short (convenience stores good; movie theaters & shopping malls bad)

3) Not likely to encourage long-term usage by other Teslas (hotels, airports, etc...)


So, if a hotel lot ends up being the best logistical choice for a Supercharger, in the best of all possible scenarios, they would be as far away from general hotel parking stalls as possible to accommodate road-tripping travelers.

The hotel would then install multiple separate Level-II chargers (taking advantage of Tesla's 2-for-1 HPWC deal, of course) for their overnight guests who can plug in for 8-12 hours. These spots should also be selected to reduce the likelihood of ICEing (altho' that tends to mean long electrical runs, making the install more expensive)

Unfortunately, I don't expect may hotels would do the latter... instead thinking "Why should we go through the hassle and expense when Tesla already has their slick super-gizmos in our lot?"

 

[Brass Guy]

Get in legal trouble? Perhaps.

Get shot? Definitely.

All right, I'll need to figure out what owner is less likely to react. Probably choose a Pacer over a BMW.