agree. I thought CO2 pricing and fuel duty generally was ok too - its all consumption based. The only caveat being some level of embedded need to travel for some people due to lack of public transport and flexible working, but thats a whole other kettle of fish
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Alternative to UK VED (car tax)
- Thread starter MrBadger
- Start date
agree. I thought CO2 pricing and fuel duty generally was ok too - its all consumption based. The only caveat being some level of embedded need to travel for some people due to lack of public transport and flexible working, but thats a whole other kettle of fish
Lord Farquad
2022 MYLR W/B/20s/Tow bar. Previously 2021 M3SR+
No, and it’s probably the fairest solution. But enough people don’t want to be “tracked” by the government, to make it easily implemented. This will rattle around for a good few more years yet.
How is this being tracked any differently to say a mobile phone, using a card, or even driving a Tesla, if done the way that I have seen being suggested?
It would only indicate that the vehicle was at a particular location at a particular time. It wouldn't know exactly how you got there. Yes you could join up the dots, but you can do that and more with a mobile phone, ANPR, toll booths, card payments, even a Tesla etc etc etc, some of which would be at a personal level rather than an object level. I don't see many people objecting to that. Maybe for those paranoid they could introduce a flat rate plan which exempts you from having time and usage data collected, policed by ANPR cameras to ensure that the vehicle was exempt just like uninsured and untaxed vehicles now - oh wait..... If you wanted to evade the detection and the payment, you just avoid where the sensors are, which is part of the idea as a feature of the pricing would be focusing on areas of high concentration and trying to facilitate behavioural changes to reduce the desire to be at those locations at busy times.
RedMod3
Member
We do 3,000 miles a year in our Smart car, which cost £7,000 plus VAT more than a petrol car. The Govt gained 1,400 in VAT.
Had we used petrol, 3,000 miles is 65 gallons or approx £300 per annum in petrol and other taxes (assuming 2/3 of fuel is tax)
Net saving is £250 per year using an EV instead of a petrol car, for about 6 years.
So, Government have just received their tax up-front, instead of over 6 years.
There is no need for us to be taxed again.
Had we used petrol, 3,000 miles is 65 gallons or approx £300 per annum in petrol and other taxes (assuming 2/3 of fuel is tax)
Net saving is £250 per year using an EV instead of a petrol car, for about 6 years.
So, Government have just received their tax up-front, instead of over 6 years.
There is no need for us to be taxed again.
curmudgeon
Member
curmudgeon
Member
Im in favour of either. Any variation in pricing should be congestion based, not road based, and there's no way that will be successfully implemented from day 1.
I'm certainly in favour of a mileage based charge. Agree that specific road and congestion pricing may be technically difficult. There may need to be an allowance for remote areas where popping to the shops is a serious trip.
Tracking people has a validity from the viewpoints of terrorism and criminal activity, and governments love data. It also does have a validity from the viewpoint of sociology and resource allocation. Unfortunately, such data also ends up being sold as a further money raising venture and used to
I actually agree, but I'm thinking the "battle" is long lost ... in the very ways you describe. When we consider the existing tracking that already takes place as a matter of course (and without much of a peep from the populace) it's not much of an issue if there's some tracking involved in collecting VED. Vehicles are already being tracked in and out of city low emission zones ... it's just the same on a larger scale. (Having said that I would prefer a secure mileage recorder that would simply hold a record of distance ... simpler the better.)
Mr H
Active Member
New Law Means Road Pricing Is Unjustified - ABD
On 30th June 2022 The Electric Vehicles (Smart Charge Points) Regulations come into force (1). All home installed electric vehicle chargers will be required to...
www.abd.org.uk
Wow!New Law Means Road Pricing Is Unjustified - ABD
On 30th June 2022 The Electric Vehicles (Smart Charge Points) Regulations come into force (1). All home installed electric vehicle chargers will be required to...
First the carrot of the EV install grant being taken away at end of March
Now the stick to insist on another power meter to hammer things home to EV converts!
No mention there of retrofitting a second meter and I wonder how many properties could even physically fit a second meter.
That report doesn't appear to be an accurate reading of the actual legislation.New Law Means Road Pricing Is Unjustified - ABD
On 30th June 2022 The Electric Vehicles (Smart Charge Points) Regulations come into force (1). All home installed electric vehicle chargers will be required to...
The draft 2021 bill was converted into a Statutory Instrument ("The Electric Vehicles (Smart Charge Points) Regulations 2021"). I've quoted the relevant section below, crucially this only stipulates that the owner of the charger must be able to see what it has consumed. Nowhere does this say the data would or must be provided to any 3rd party (HMRC or otherwise).
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Mr H
Active Member
scdoubleu
Member
There have been numerous surveys on this very subject.
Apparently the public trust a commercial organisation with their personal data more than they trust the government.
It's all about public perception.
HenryT
Active Member
That’s the way of government finance in any country tbf. Look at health contracts, military contracts etc in any country theres always some brown envelopes being shuffled around surreptitiously. “You don’t really think a toilet seat costs $100’s do you” springs to mind from Independence Day
. A few years ago a very large wind turbine maker had a framework agreement with a developer (who I worked for) to supply 100’s of turbines, end result the tail started wagging the dog in terms of quality. A new CEO was fetched into the developer & 1st board meeting he handed out boxes for desk clearing to several directors saying frameworks would not be a part of his company anymore (true story) & they had to bid like everyone else, quality improved significantly.
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