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"Battery bleed scan failure" message when starting Roadster?

Discussion in 'Roadster' started by lmore, Sep 10, 2015.

  1. lmore

    lmore Member

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    "Battery bleed scan failure" is sometimes, not always, displayed a second or two WHEN STARTING the Roadster.
    It is a very early 1.5 Roadster.
    Sometimes this error message is displayed after a while:
    "Battery service required" ID: 7
    Anyone experienced this?

    Tesla service claims the battery has problems but the car can be charged and driven.
     
  2. wiztecy

    wiztecy Active Member

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    I'd be very cautious driving, especially if Tesla has determined it is a defect in the pack for that it could fail at any moment. And you don't want that moment to be when you're pulling out through a busy intersection.

    Never seen or read about that error and does it mean the Roadster performs some sort of bleed scan every so often?
     
  3. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    The bleed test involves leaking a little current off through a bleed resistor and measuring the result. It's a way of checking whether each string in the pack is working properly.

    Perhaps this means one of the strings has failed. IIRC the car can disconnect any bad strings, so it probably just means you have a tad less range than you otherwise might.
     
  4. spaceballs

    spaceballs Member

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    if battery bleeding always fails on x bricks, it can become unbalanced from the rest of the pack and you would have less range in the long run. Just to make sure everything is going well, I would look at latest log and see if brick voltages are all about the same.
     
  5. wiztecy

    wiztecy Active Member

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    #5 wiztecy, Sep 10, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2015
    I thought that was only done via computer software on a laptop at Tesla, not by the Roadster's internal firmware. To be honest, this is the first time I ever had heard the bleed test identifying a potential fault in the ESS. I'm sure there's others, but its the first for me.

    What type of failure to the string of bricks brewing up a problem can occur? Couldn't one be a potential fault to blow the fuse? That'll make the Roadster fully inoperable. If it's just a lower current, then it's not as much of a problem but can pull the rest of the pack down. I'm still uncertain what exact problem the bleed test targets and identifies.
     
  6. spaceballs

    spaceballs Member

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    I did a test when I changed the value of the bleed resistor, I can get a bleed test error display. I can't remember if it occurred when I was trying to start the car, or after the car finished a charging.
     
  7. wiztecy

    wiztecy Active Member

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    What test? Just a random test using your own test software and the Roadsters firmware detected some change in the system or the bleed resistor which threw the bleed test error? Any idea what Tesla does to execute the test? So the firmware in itself keeps an eye on the state of the bleed resistor and how much current its allowing to pass through it. So in essence if you know what current to pass through it you can test it I'd take from all this, and if it allows current to pass through too fast then most likely a defective cell in the sheet.
     
  8. spaceballs

    spaceballs Member

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    Bleed test verifies that it can turn on a discharge resistor on a brick.

    For this error and no other errors present, I think the car will be fine. only issue is x bricks that never get balanced, if you have one bleed resistor not working might be fine, as other bricks might compensate. More than two and eventually the gap in voltage between the highest brick and the lowest brick (that energy will be unused). i.e. the car range will be limited by the lowest brick.. a unbalanced pack will have voltage drift over time/use and have less range.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Car firmware performs an "Battery bleed test" on car idle, or after a charge, I can't remember.

    I was testing the existing BMB on my roadster (it has the bleed resistors on them). Not sure why you though I was testing my own software, this was a hardware test, where I did a hardware change.


    Car is checking if it can balance it's ESS pack when it's idle, if it detects that it can't it gets flagged as a error so that it can be fixed.
     
  9. wiztecy

    wiztecy Active Member

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    Thanks for the clarification! Great information to know & understand.
     
  10. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    I'm sure the laptop test is more comprehensive and retains the information, but I'm also sure the car uses any built-in diagnostics it has.
     
  11. lmore

    lmore Member

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    #11 lmore, Sep 11, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2015
    Thanks, here are more pictures and files from some days ago and yesterday including logfile:
    Dropbox - Brabus-Technical
    Feedback is highly appreciated.

    Here is a dump from yesterday that shows cell voltage difference:
    2015-09-10 16.28.56.jpg

    And here is picture of the APS as was mentioned by spaceballs could be a problem since Brabus have connected their LED-stuff to it. Are these numbers a bit low, Vaps=13.1 V and Vsp=12.3 V?
    2015-08-21 13.19.01.jpg
     
  12. warden_clyffe

    warden_clyffe Member

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    fault: battery service required (ID:7)

    hey folks,
    i'm in germany with a european 2009 2.0 roadster, got the fault-message "battery service required (ID:7)" yesterday from one moment to the other, vehicle still rides perfect in all modes and takes charge.
    in service-mode i got still a cac of 146,5 and no faults on sheets - does anybody know this message ? is it possible to sorta "reboot" the vehicle ? i don't wanna contact my friendly SeC immediately...
    thanks in advance,
    conrad

    - - - Updated - - -

    ...ah, just to complete - full service was done only +/- 500km ago
     
  13. BartJ

    BartJ Member

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    I have the impression that errors often occur very shortly after a full service ... Is it because the technicians have no (more) experience to work on a roadster ?? ... certainly in europe....
     
  14. warden_clyffe

    warden_clyffe Member

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    an image.jpg this is what it says in debug-mode:

    - - - Updated - - -

    sorry for the strange layout - navigation here's a bit spooky wit my iphone
     

    Attached Files:

  15. warden_clyffe

    warden_clyffe Member

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  16. djp

    djp Roadster 2.0 VIN939

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    @lmore - your voltages look normal. The battery balancing cycle stops when the difference between Vmin and Vmax reaches 0.02V. I'd keep an eye on it but right now it looks fine.

    My Vaps is 13.1V and Vsb is 12.6V. Your Vsb is on the low side, but could be an older 12V battery. They generally need to be replaced every 3-4 years.
     
  17. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    Since these are identical faults, I have merged the two threads.
     
  18. lmore

    lmore Member

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    Thanks, but this Roadster does not have a 12 volts battery since it is a 1.5.
     
  19. wiztecy

    wiztecy Active Member

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    Possibly this is an indication of a bad brick/cell in either sheets 1 & 2 which the APS uses?
     

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