Bolt EV EPA range = 238 miles combined!

[AndY1]

Tesla fans are using the same arguments ICE owners used when EV revolution launched about 5 years ago. Looking for that corner conditions where EV doesn't have an edge, that's long road trips.

Tesla fans and we, other EV fans were arguing 'How many times a year does an average person need more than 100miles of range per day?'. Well, Bolt EV can do 200+ more miles. If EV fans found 100 miles/per day adequate 5 years ago, why isn't suddenly 200 miles not enough anymore?
I guess Tesla fans quickly forgot all about that and are starting to use the same arguments ICE drivers used when EV revolution started.

What's wrong now? 238 EPA miles are not adequate for you anymore?

 

[nwdiver]

What's wrong now? 238 EPA miles are not adequate for you anymore?

You're missing the general point. The point is that the 238 EPA rating for the Bolt ≠ a 238 EPA rating for a Tesla at normal highway speeds for the Cd reasons stated previously. 150 miles of range is more than adequate... just don't expect a Bolt of have longer range than a Model 3 under normal highway driving conditions. Nothing wrong with the Bolt... it'll do just fine for most people.

 

[AndY1]

No, you're missing the point. When the issue was comparison between ICE and Tesla vehicles, ICE owners always pointed that EVs aren't for fast road trips and you Tesla owners were arguing, that' there's nothing wrong by driving slower.
Now, that the tables are turned (Bolt EV vs. Tesla), you're using the same argument ICE owners used against EVs.

How quickly you forgot the EV argument from a few years ago, that's, how many users do more than 100 miles/day. Bolt EV can do 200 miles/day and now that's not good enough?

In my personal opinion, first Bolt EV buyers will be existing Volt(2) buyers, who will drive Bolt EV as a first car and Volt(2) for long road trips without the need to SuperCharge or for other family member(s), who drives less miles per day (withing EV range).

Let's say one family member has a 100 miles to work and back, and the other has 30 miles. The firs would drive the Bolt EV and the other would drive the Volt for daily drives.

Best of both worlds and both together for less money as a new Model S.

 

[nwdiver]

How quickly you forgot the EV argument from a few years ago, that's, how many users do more than 100 miles/day. Bolt EV can do 200 miles/day and now that's not good enough?

Perhaps I wasn't clear. So let me state this unequivocally.

'Bolt EV can do 200 miles/day; THAT IS good enough.'

Yeah... that's fine. 200 miles/day is more than enough. The only point that was made above is despite its EPA rating... a Model 3 will likely have longer real world highway range than a Bolt due to the way the EPA rating is derived and the Cd difference between the cars. Will you need that extra range? Probably not. Should you buy a Model 3 over a Bolt? I Dunno... that's up to you. Just don't buy the Bolt thinking it'll go further at highway speeds.

Not saying that as an Elon Musk fanboy... but as an Issac Newton fanboy

My previous statement wasn't meant to suggest that 150 miles isn't enough range... only that 150 miles isn't 238 miles...

 

[AndY1]

a Model 3 will likely have longer real world highway range than a Bolt due to the way the EPA rating is derived and the Cd difference between the cars.

Why not just say Model 3 will have 1000 miles more highway range than Bolt EV, while you're at it? You have absolutely nothing to lean on for your argument. Model 3 is, for now, a paper car.
When EPA numbers for Model 3 will be out, then we'll have something to talk about.

 

[nwdiver]

Why not just say Model 3 will have 1000 miles more highway range than Bolt EV, while you're at it? You have absolutely nothing to lean on for your argument. Model 3 is, for now, a paper car.
When EPA numbers for Model 3 will be out, then we'll have something to talk about.

The Cd numbers are out... it's 0.21 for the Model 3 vs 0.32 for the Bolt. That's a HUGE difference. Not that it matters since range isn't important

 

[AndY1]

And? Do you have Model 3's net battery capacity? It seems that Bolt EV's net battery capacity is 60kWh.

So, without knowing Model 3's net battery capacity, how do you know it's range will be better than Bolt EV's?
Because Elon said so?

How do you know, that in 2 years, when Model 3 is actually available, Bolt EV won't get increased battery capacity? Volt1 got battery capacity increases every 2 years.

 

[nwdiver]

Do you have Model 3's net battery capacity?

Got Google?

The Base will be ~60kWh. Even if it's ~50kWh with a Cd of 0.21 it would still have more real world highway range. You've got all the data. If you choose to believe the Bolt will have more real world highway range than the base Model 3... well... I can't reason you out of a position you didn't reason yourself into...

To reiterate... I'm not saying that superior highway range is a reason to buy a Model 3...

 

[AndY1]

Those numbers are all speculations, nothing more.

 

[sandpiper]

The very good Chevy Bolt reviews are in but everyone forgot to ask the most important question

Excellent article. The point is that the Bolt is excellent, but without superchargers, or supercharger capability it's a rather limited vehicle. The cynic in me wonders if that's not the point. Part of me wonders if GM wants to sell enough to get the ZEV credits, maybe damage Tesla a bit, but not enough to encourage large scale adoption.

 

[Yuri_G]

And the Model 3 owner wants to know if he can call himself an owner even though his car doesn't exist yet. Lol

Keep up the GM hate, zealot.

Please post pics of your Bolt, kthx.

 

[Az_Rael]

I guess I don't understand all the EPA range arguments here. Aren't factors like speed, cold, rain stuff we ALL have to learn about as EV drivers? The guess here is that the model 3 will be more efficient than the Bolt at highway speeds. Fair enough. I am guessing the Bolt might end up being more efficient in city driving, though. And isn't everyone here arguing the Bolt is a city car? I know that for many people commuting in LA, this route done by the GM press event will end up being fairly representative. And lots of LA commuters travel farther than a Leafs range daily (because we are crazy) so the Bolt is a great full EV alternative to a Volt.

Now, my commute is 80 miles round trip, all freeway speeds. So for me, a Tesla might be a more efficient car since it does better at highway speeds, and I don't need a hatchback.

This is actually great news for all of us. Now people can choose between TWO long range EVs in the same price bracket! One that is a good city car with a practical hatchback, and one that is a sporty highway driver with a long range network. That is awesome! Now we just need a nice SUV that can haul big families around and maybe that pickup truck all in the $30k price bracket and suddenly lots more people might be considering EVs.

 

[diamond.g]

No, you're missing the point. When the issue was comparison between ICE and Tesla vehicles, ICE owners always pointed that EVs aren't for fast road trips and you Tesla owners were arguing, that' there's nothing wrong by driving slower.
Now, that the tables are turned (Bolt EV vs. Tesla), you're using the same argument ICE owners used against EVs.

How quickly you forgot the EV argument from a few years ago, that's, how many users do more than 100 miles/day. Bolt EV can do 200 miles/day and now that's not good enough?

In my personal opinion, first Bolt EV buyers will be existing Volt(2) buyers, who will drive Bolt EV as a first car and Volt(2) for long road trips without the need to SuperCharge or for other family member(s), who drives less miles per day (withing EV range).

Let's say one family member has a 100 miles to work and back, and the other has 30 miles. The firs would drive the Bolt EV and the other would drive the Volt for daily drives.

Best of both worlds and both together for less money as a new Model S.

I think ICE and EV folks have moved the goal post. At first it was 100 miles isn't enough (for some of us it isn't, I commute 120 miles a day), then it became how quick can you charge (folks swear the current' 50kW CCS is enough). The post will keep moving until most folks are driving EV.

Just like how folk are comparing the Bolt to the Model 3, even though they are not in the same class. It is as silly as comparing the BMW 320i to the Chevy Volt.

 

[SageBrush]

This is actually great news for all of us. Now people can choose between TWO long range EVs in the same price bracket! One that is a good city car with a practical hatchback, and one that is a sporty highway driver with a long range network. That is awesome! Now we just need a nice SUV that can haul big families around and maybe that pickup truck all in the $30k price bracket and suddenly lots more people might be considering EVs.

Do you think the M3 will be a poor city car ?

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Do you think the M3 will be a poor city car ?

It won't be a great one. I think the Bolt will have higher efficiency at lower speeds and better ingress and egress. Also, it should have better rear cargo utility.

We'd need to wait for the Model Y to see whether Tesla could match it for utility.

 

[AndY1]

I think ICE and EV folks have moved the goal post. At first it was 100 miles isn't enough (for some of us it isn't, I commute 120 miles a day), then it became how quick can you charge (folks swear the current' 50kW CCS is enough). The post will keep moving until most folks are driving EV.

Just like how folk are comparing the Bolt to the Model 3, even though they are not in the same class. It is as silly as comparing the BMW 320i to the Chevy Volt.

I agree, but Bolt EV has made such a breakthrough for value EVs. It has doubled the battery capacity and range against every other value EV on the market - and at the affordable price, at an impressive date - way ahead of everyone.

We should be congratulating GM for the effort, instead it's being downplayed by a car, that doesn't exist and Tesla's record on keeping up the schedule isn't all that good. 2 years late for Model S, 2 years late for Model X, 1 year late for Chademo adapter.

 

[Az_Rael]

Do you think the M3 will be a poor city car ?

No, and the Bolt will be a fine highway car. For my 80 mile round trip highway speeds commute either would work fine for me. But some people will prefer the Bolt for its practicality (and maybe it's interior space). Teslas have very angled A pillars for aerodynamics that makes getting into and out of them a challenge for tall folks and reduces headroom.

 

[bro1999]

Please post pics of your Bolt, kthx.

I guarantee I will be able to post pics before any Model 3 "reservation holder". And will when I actually get my Bolt. Don't you worry.

 

[AndY1]

It won't be a great one. I think the Bolt will have higher efficiency at lower speeds and better ingress and egress. Also, it should have better rear cargo utility.

We'd need to wait for the Model Y to see whether Tesla could match it for utility.

I agree. While I can easily ingress and egress out of my Ampera, my and my wife's parent's got older in the mean time and are having troubles, because it's low. Bolt EV should be perfect for the job.

Also, that small trunk opening in the Model 3 is small and perfect to hurt your back putting in and taking out something heavier.

I also believe that all around visibility will be better in Bolt EV.

 

[diamond.g]

It won't be a great one. I think the Bolt will have higher efficiency at lower speeds and better ingress and egress. Also, it should have better rear cargo utility.

We'd need to wait for the Model Y to see whether Tesla could match it for utility.

I would think the Y would be X1 in size, which would be larger than the Bolt (plus more expensive).