Carbon ceramic brakes

[Graham Jones]

Will Tesla move towards Carbon ceramic brakes on all their EVs ? The weight saving is phenomenal. The environmental reasons are solid: less brake dust, increased range. The performance criteria are pretty compelling: working immediately from cold, no corrosion, less judder. And with heavy cars, better performing brakes....well, reduce stopping distance. Factor in lifetime cost ( possibly just one set of ceramics for life of car) and the arguments for ceramics are pretty compelling ?

And might be adopted across all EVs over time ? Tesla could lead the way with early adoption.

Anyone got any thoughts ?

 

[zanary]

The Next Gen Roadster has carbon ceramic brakes (from what we've seen of the actual car and the model they sell on the shop.tesla.com web site). I suspect that the Plaid+ version of the Model S will also include carbon ceramic brakes...

 

[Doanster1]

All true and positive points about CCBs, but until the cost comes wayyyy down, they won’t make sense on anything except the Roadster IMO. Regen/one pedal driving already renders brake use to “limited” so making them std on the S, even Plaid, seems unlikely. A high priced option, maybe.
Don’t get me wrong, I’d love me some CCBs, but most people wouldn’t even know/care.

 

[Graham Jones]

Prices of CC brakes will come down dramatically as volumes increase. What level would make them practical ? $1000 each corner ? Or less than that ? If you only need one set for the lifetime of the car, that will make them more competitive

 

[Cheburashka]

From my experience CCB brakes are pretty noisy though.

 

[Leo kong]

Will there be more people replacing steel brake with carbon ceramic discs?

 

[beatle]

CCBs were discussed several years ago:

Carbon Ceramic Brakes

Hello, Has anyone added carbon ceramic brakes to their Tesla Model S? Would love to hear your story, recommendations and warnings. Thanks, Greg

teslamotorsclub.com

My $.02 is CCBs are a waste on an EV that will not see track time. Steel brakes are plenty capable of kicking in the ABS, so you don't need more friction. The right street pads already produce so little dust on an EV since they are minimally used. IMO the most important part of brakes on an EV is initial cold bite. With 1 pedal driving, the first time you may use the brakes in earnest may be a panic stop and you need the brakes to provide enough force to stop the car. There is no warm up period driving through your neighborhood.

 

[URBAN LEGEND]

I had CCBS on my Z/28. Those things were epic. The Taycan and RS GT Etron have them. At least we should get it as an option.

 

[Sbaimo]

My 2016 AMG-GTS had ceramic brakes. No squeak. Unbelievably sensitive. Almost threw me I to steering wheel first time I drove it. But great once you get used to them. I believe they saved my life or averted a serious accident as I was driving very fast and suddenly approachied stopped traffic on an off ramp.
I was told if they needed to be replaced it would cost 13k.

 

[red2017s]

I would always swap out the OEM brakes on my Z06 corvettes for the ceramic brakes to reduce the brake dust. If I recall correctly, I had to go on the Corvette Forum to get the brand of the proper ceramic brakes as a lot of them made a very high pitched squealing noise----so loud that it would turn heads of folks on the sidewalk. I guess I am just saying that not all ceramic brakes are created equal and you have to be careful of what you wish for.

 

[gearchruncher]

I would always swap out the OEM brakes on my Z06 corvettes for the ceramic brakes to reduce the brake dust.

You swapped BRAKE PADS.
The brakes being discussed here are Carbon Ceramic ROTORS. Which cost thousands of dollars per corner and require a whole brake system swap.

 

[ngng]

Waste of money imo.

 

[ngng]

You swapped BRAKE PADS.
The brakes being discussed here are Carbon Ceramic ROTORS. Which cost thousands of dollars per corner and require a whole brake system swap.

colloquially, they're just called ceramics.

 

[gearchruncher]

The weight saving is phenomenal. The environmental reasons are solid: less brake dust, increased range.

Less weight does not dramatically increase range. Range is already rated on the highway, where aerodynamic drag dominates.

A rotor weighs maybe 20 lbs. Saving 10 lbs off this will not make your car go farther, particularly if you are using regen. You'd go WAY farther adding 10 lbs of batteries. And even more, you'd go way, way, way farther adding $5K worth of batteries for the price difference on CCB's vs steel.

EV's can reduce brake dust even more with larger batteries because the larger the battery, the higher the regen can be.

 

[gearchruncher]

My $.02 is CCBs are a waste on an EV that will not see track time.

Ironically, a lot of real race cars swap the stock CCB's for steel brakes because the CCB's are so expensive to maintain.

 

[gearchruncher]

colloquially, they're just called ceramics.

colloquially, what is "just called ceramics"?

If someone says "I have ceramic brakes" they mean they have a full CCB system, where the rotor is not steel. Not that they bought a $50 "ceramic" brake pad and slapped it on a steel rotor, which is clearly what the Z06 OP was saying he did.

 

[ngng]

colloquially, what is "just called ceramics"?

If someone says "I have ceramic brakes" they mean they have a full CCB system, where the rotor is not steel. Not that they bought a $50 "ceramic" brake pad and slapped it on a steel rotor, which is clearly what the Z06 OP was saying he did.

a full ccb system is typically referred to as "ceramics". not sure how you determined OP didn't swap the whole system, or just bought off the shelf ceramic based pads

 

[ngng]

Ironically, a lot of real race cars swap the stock CCB's for steel brakes because the CCB's are so expensive to maintain.

it's less about maint and more about pad selection.

 

[gearchruncher]

a full ccb system is typically referred to as "ceramics". not sure how you determined OP didn't swap the whole system, or just bought off the shelf ceramic based pads

Everything about this post below screams pads, not a full CCB swap. How many CCB systems make high pitched squealing noises, and you go on the form to find the right brand to buy when you're spending $10K+ but you don't remember much else even though he's done it more than once...

I would always swap out the OEM brakes on my Z06 corvettes for the ceramic brakes to reduce the brake dust. If I recall correctly, I had to go on the Corvette Forum to get the brand of the proper ceramic brakes as a lot of them made a very high pitched squealing noise----so loud that it would turn heads of folks on the sidewalk.

it's less about maint and more about pad selection.

Porsche disagrees. They are very expensive to run on the track: Porsche tech rep says carbon brakes are not the best for track use

 

[ngng]

Everything about this post below screams pads, not a full CCB swap. How many CCB systems make high pitched squealing noises, and you go on the form to find the right brand to buy when you're spending $10K+ but you don't remember much else even though he's done it more than once...

my ceramic pads made tons of noise. i'm not OP, maybe he just did pads. dunno?

Porsche disagrees. They are very expensive to run on the track: Porsche tech rep says carbon brakes are not the best for track use

you said "real race cars". i don't consider street cars "real race cars". ceramics are widely used when cost is not a factor