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Charging: Destination Charging vs. Supercharging speed

Discussion in 'Model 3' started by RedModel3, Jul 25, 2017.

  1. RedModel3

    RedModel3 Member

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    I just got back from an 800 mile trip in my Volt, using mostly gas, and I've been trying to estimate where I will stop to charge on that same trip in a Model 3. I've been trying to find a simple answer to my question and I have yet to find it. In simple terms, as volts, amps, and watts do not compute in my head, what is the speed difference between destination chargers and superchargers? For instance, I can find one estimate that a Model S at a supercharger will get 170 miles per half hour of charging. My Volt, in comparison, charges at home on a 120 volt line at the rate of 4 miles per hour of charging. THAT'S the info I want, not how many amps/volts, or whatnots get charged into the battery. Where I'll be driving has very few superchargers, but many more destination chargers.

    Can anybody give me a rough estimate of the charging speed difference, in terms of the time it might take to charge? I know superchargers are faster, but how much?
     
  2. roblab

    roblab Active Member

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    Supercharging speed varies. That's why there's no real answer. It will charge really fast for a few minutes, and then taper off, maybe giving you 150 miles in a half hour when the battery is one third full, but less than half that when the battery is two thirds full. And it will charge more slowly when the battery is hot or cold, or when the charger or cable is hot. Which is why experienced travelers pull into a supercharger with maybe 25 miles left in the battery, and then only charge up 150 to go to the next charger. The battery charges fastest at the beginning.

    But you want to know how far you can go, and how fast you can charge.

    If you start out with 230 miles and drive The Speed Limit to the next charger, which may be 200 miles away, and the speed limit is 80 mph, you won't make it. If you slow down 5 mph, you will. Too much to figure? Well, that's the way it is. Batteries store about a seventh of what a gas tank will hold, but will go four times farther on the energy. So, gas tanks give you lots of cushion. Batteries do not.

    It actually takes some thought and planning to drive any battery vehicle at present. There are some who just can't do that. They should keep the gas car until chargers are maybe every 130 miles apart.
     
  3. yesup

    yesup Member

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    For Model S with standard on board charger (48A - rumored to be the same for Model 3) and using Tesla Wall Connectors, you can charge at 29 miles per hour.

    Model S also has an option for a dual charger upgrade (72A - probably not available for Model 3, we'll see), you can charge at 58 miles per hour.

    For superchargers, the charging rate is much faster in the first 30min than the second 30min, the real life charging rate for superchargers is around 290 miles per hour if you charge for 1 hour.
     
  4. gregd

    gregd Active Member

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    The on-board navigation / planning software will help guide you through all aspects of travel. It's a bit harder to imagine when you don't have the car there to guide you. Don't stress too much about it yet.

    One thing to consider is that the Model 3's battery will be a lot bigger than the Volt's, so you will probably want to get some sort of 240 volt "Level 2" charging solution in place at home. Your 4 miles range per hour of charging (aka Level 1) means that it will take a long time to fully charge a car that's capable of well over 200 miles of travel, if you come home empty. For most people this should be a rare event, but something to consider. My Roadster has a slightly smaller battery than the rumored lowest range Model 3 (53kwh vs probably 60), and a full charge takes me almost 2 days on a regular outlet. My Level 2 charger at home can do it in about 7 hours. A typical day's commute and errands are replaced in just an hour or two at this rate, so charging for daily driving becomes invisible. Just plug in the car whenever you get home. It's like having magic elves who come and fill up the car every night.

    Destination charging is usually Level 2, like what you would put at home. So it's fast enough to get you charged up during your stay (a day's event, or over night). Then you'd be good to go on your next leg, hopping the superchargers along the way.
     
  5. jsmay311

    jsmay311 Member

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    If I'm not mistaken, the 29 mph charge rate is for 40A and the 58 mph charge rate is for 80A, which is no longer available.

    At 48A and 72A (11.5kW and 17.3kW respectively at 240V) Tesla quotes 34 mph and 52 mph, respectively, for the Model S:

    Home charging installation

    Presumably the Model 3 will be somewhat more efficient than the Model S so it would get more mph at the same charge power. But we don't know yet how much more efficient. And that difference will vary somewhat between RWD and AWD, and maybe also with battery and/or performance versions. And we don't know yet if a 72A charger option will be available.

    Hopefully in a few days we'll have more info to answer this question. :)
     
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  6. Darryl

    Darryl ModelXTracker.com Co-Adm

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    At home on 100 amp circuit which would be equal to a destination charger I get about 48 miles per hour of charge to a 90% charge. On a supercharge I average (to a 90% charge) about 250 miles per hour of charge but it had gone as high as 154 miles per half hour of charge.

    This is on a MX P100DL with a maximum EPA range of 288 miles.
     
  7. RedModel3

    RedModel3 Member

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    Thank you all! This helps a lot, and of course once we really know what our battery options are, things will be more clear.
     

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