Chevy Bolt First Impressions

[brucet999]

The question was Volt/Bolt Charging.

It took a whopping 60 minutes to make both the adapter and a quad 120v outlet. Left is L1 / Right is L2. small blade L & R = 244 vac 1 ph unloaded, 241 while charging.

While a Tesla charger does not violate physical laws, it does violate Build Codes and Safety if Brucet999 is correct.

Your description of a home-made adapter to run a Chevy EVSE at 240V leaves out a lot of information. Where did you find a 240V source for your 60-minute "quad 120V outlet"? Unless that outlet happens to be supplied by a three-wire circuit, there won't be 240V available in any 120V outlet box. In my experience, it is rare to find more than one 120V outlet circuit in most garages, and the likelihood is only 50% that any two circuits will not be on the same bus at the panel. Much less likely in a garage is a 240V 15A or a 3-wire circuit. Most such 3-wire circuits were 20A, so if that is what you have, I hope you changed the breakers to 15A in your panel.

Many houses from the 60s to 90s have a 30A dryer plug in the garage, but more recently laundry facilities have tended to be installed inside the house. I wouldn't suggest installing an adapter for a Chevy EVSE on a dryer circuit unless you swap out the breaker for a15A one.

Code violation? Tesla UMC uses adapters for various outlet types' capacities. It will not allow more than 80% of nominal capacity of an outlet to be used for charging the car, so there is no violation of electrical code and no danger of overloading a circuit. It is also smart enough to reduce charging rate below 80%, or to even terminate charging, if voltage anomalies are detected in the circuit.

 

[brucet999]

We have a large modern house in SoCal. The dryer is gas. So are most houses in HB.

I have never seen a washer/dryer location with gas but no electric dryer outlet. I have seen all-electric houses with no gas service.

 

[scaesare]

I have never seen a washer/dryer location with gas but no electric dryer outlet. I have seen all-electric houses with no gas service.

Having lived in CA (Bay Area) and now in VA, that's typically my experience as well.

 

[McRat]

Your description of a home-made adapter to run a Chevy EVSE at 240V leaves out a lot of information. Where did you find a 240V source for your 60-minute "quad 120V outlet"? ...

Right near the panel. Take a tandem 20a breaker, install. Run five 12awg to quad box. Use two 20a outlets.

Left outlet -
L1 hot
Neutral
Ground

Right outlet -
L2 hot
Neutral
Ground

This will work as 4x 120v outlets.

However, if you fab a Y-cable, using L1-L2-GND, it will output 240 single phase with a ground. It can service up to 16a cont.

 

[McRat]

I have never seen a washer/dryer location with gas but no electric dryer outlet. I have seen all-electric houses with no gas service.

My house was built this century. No 240v dryer. No 240v water heater.
240 is pool pump, large garage, AC.

All heaters are natural gas as is the BBQ.

 

[stopcrazypp]

Right near the panel. Take a tandem 20a breaker, install. Run five 12awg to quad box. Use two 20a outlets.

Left outlet -
L1 hot
Neutral
Ground

Right outlet -
L2 hot
Neutral
Ground

This will work as 4x 120v outlets.

However, if you fab a Y-cable, using L1-L2-GND, it will output 240 single phase with a ground. It can service up to 16a cont.

Then that's obviously a very custom solution and not something that is easily applied, for example just visiting relatives.

I thought you were talking about something like the quick220 which does not require modifying the circuit. It also has a safety feature where the other cable is not energized until both are plugged in.
Combining two 120V into a 240V connector

Even the quick220 is dubious in terms of code. Much safer to use a 240v outlet directly.

 

[McRat]

Then that's obviously a very custom solution and not something that is easily applied, for example just visiting relatives.

I thought you were talking about something like the quick220 which does not require modifying the circuit. It also has a safety feature where the other cable is not energized until both are plugged in.
Combining two 120V into a 240V connector

Even the quick220 is dubious in terms of code. Much safer to use a 240v outlet directly.

Using two different 15a circuits, one L1 and the other L2 will work, but there are some issues. Often 5-15 circuits have multiple outlets, sometimes to high load things like freezers. So you can trip the breaker when the freezer cycles (me).

If you want to use an outlet for high 240 loads, you should make it dedicated, and tandem. That way a fault shuts off both hots.

 

[gregd]

Right near the panel. Take a tandem 20a breaker, install. Run five 12awg to quad box. Use two 20a outlets.

Left outlet -
L1 hot
Neutral
Ground

Right outlet -
L2 hot
Neutral
Ground

This will work as 4x 120v outlets.

However, if you fab a Y-cable, using L1-L2-GND, it will output 240 single phase with a ground. It can service up to 16a cont.

Be careful on your definition of "tandem breaker" in the context of the brand of panel you have. Some define this as a single-slot breaker with two independent switches / circuits, but depending on the brand of panel these may be on the SAME phase. You need to be sure that you have the two circuits on separate phases for this to work. My panel (Square-D) requires two separate slots to get access to both phases.

Also, if the wires are not in conduit, you should use Romex. We added a pair of 20A duplex sockets in the garage, and used a single run of "12-3 with ground" Romex (4 wires total internally) between the pair of sockets and the panel. As you detailed, one hot (black) to one outlet, other hot (red) to the other outlet, Neutral (white) and Ground (bare) wires each to BOTH outlets.

Finally, be sure to use GFI outlets in the garage.

 

[McRat]

Be careful on your definition of "tandem breaker" in the context of the brand of panel you have. Some define this as a single-slot breaker with two independent switches / circuits, but depending on the brand of panel these may be on the SAME phase. You need to be sure that you have the two circuits on separate phases for this to work. My panel (Square-D) requires two separate slots to get access to both phases.

Also, if the wires are not in conduit, you should use Romex. We added a pair of 20A duplex sockets in the garage, and used a single run of "12-3 with ground" Romex (4 wires total internally) between the pair of sockets and the panel. As you detailed, one hot (black) to one outlet, other hot (red) to the other outlet, Neutral (white) and Ground (bare) wires each to BOTH outlets.

Finally, be sure to use GFI outlets in the garage.

Yes, my bad. A dual width, connected breaker. Tandem is not the right term.

 

[Jeff N]

I wouldn't suggest installing an adapter for a Chevy EVSE on a dryer circuit unless you swap out the breaker for a15A one.

Why?

The house panel circuit breaker is there to protect the house wiring and the outlet. It should be fine to plug in something that draws less than the 30A dryer circuit breaker. The EVSE likely has its own internal fuse and obviously thec ar plugged into it should never draw more than the 12A maximum that the EVSE communicates over the J1772 pilot pin. What's the problem?

I have never seen a washer/dryer location with gas but no electric dryer outlet. I have seen all-electric houses with no gas service.

I've seen this regularly.

 

[diamond.g]

@bro1999 so is the my Chevy app on your phone less slow than the Gen 1/2 Volt (connecting to car and getting updated information takes too dang long)?

 

[bro1999]

@bro1999 so is the my Chevy app on your phone less slow than the Gen 1/2 Volt (connecting to car and getting updated information takes too dang long)?

It's about the same as my G2 Volt.

 

[diamond.g]

It's about the same as my G2 Volt.

Is it correct to assume that it is faster than Gen 1 due to 4G LTE? Wondering if getting the 4G module would be helpful.

 

[Ulmo]

Yesterday after a surprise doctor visit, I needed to charge at a turnaround point which had no SuperChargers, so once again, Chademo came to the rescue, this time at the 30 cents per kWh (!!!!! too expensive) ChargePoint headquarters location in Campbell. While there, another car came up to charge. Well, it was a Chevy Bolt. When he was getting ready to go to his doctor's office that was conveniently next door for him (an institution I refuse to use but many do use), I was getting ready to leave, so we chatted a little, and I got to sit in the Bolt. It is roomy enough for me; it has that not-as-luxurious car squeeze feel to it, as well as a number of normal-car feelings to it, but I'd have to say from the interior, that car is almost as good as, and in some ways better than, my Model S, and it had some aspects to it which were slightly roomier than the Model S. It also felt like it was made by a traditional auto company that didn't skimp on every interior luxury in some sort of minimalist attitude.

In addition, up close, in full 3D, the exterior of the Chevy Bolt, while nothing to write home about, is less insect-like than in the advertising media. It's as if the car designers wanted something to look halfway decent, but the advertising that GM is putting out is meant to dissuade drivers from buying it. (We've already seen other examples of GM (and their dealers) doing things that make it less desirable to buy a Bolt, so that is consistent.)

Now I see why Mr. Wozniak was so appreciative of this vehicle. Overall, in the two minutes I had to look at it, it felt like the Tesla was in most ways a step above the Bolt, but not the many steps I had originally thought. Plus, the Bolt had a larger advertised range than my car. Time to look at the safety ratings, again?

 

[Ulmo]

Just a use note: I am at the SuperCharger right now, and my car's front fans went wild, scary even. I decided to try to sponge some heat up by turning on my interior heater. A few minutes later, the front fants stopped going crazy. I don't know if it's related; it's very cold outside (40º), so perhaps the fans got what they wanted from the exterior temp.

I've heard that fans go wild sometimes at SuperChargers, and so far we think it's normal. I'm surprised they don't ramp up with need; does the chemistry cross the need threshold that quickly?

 

[bro1999]

it's very cold outside (40º)

That's cute.

Getting back on topic now: Here’s how Chevrolet built a practical electric vehicle with the 2017 Bolt EV

That's what the Bolt offers....practicality (in a <$40k, 238 mile EV range package).

You want the ooos and aaaaahs of passerbys and passengers launching in Insane/Ludicrous mode and "Autopilot" and whatnot? Get a Tesla.

You want something that is more down to earth and doesn't scream "LOOK AT MEEEE!!" and has high utility for everyday life and driving at a price point less than the average cost of a new car in the US (after fed tax credit)? You take a hard look at the Bolt.

 

[Reeler]

It is roomy enough for me; it has that not-as-luxurious car squeeze feel to it, as well as a number of normal-car feelings to it, but I'd have to say from the interior, that car is almost as good as, and in some ways better than, my Model S, and it had some aspects to it which were slightly roomier than the Model S. It also felt like it was made by a traditional auto company that didn't skimp on every interior luxury in some sort of minimalist attitude.

Very utilitarian design inside with tons of storage. I hate the minimalist design of the Model S too. Plus, the seating position in the Bolt is more to my liking with my legs more bent.

 

[scaesare]

Just a use note: I am at the SuperCharger right now, and my car's front fans went wild, scary even. I decided to try to sponge some heat up by turning on my interior heater. A few minutes later, the front fants stopped going crazy. I don't know if it's related; it's very cold outside (40º), so perhaps the fans got what they wanted from the exterior temp.

I've heard that fans go wild sometimes at SuperChargers, and so far we think it's normal. I'm surprised they don't ramp up with need; does the chemistry cross the need threshold that quickly?

While the "use the heater" trick works on ICE vehicles, where the heater core actually extracts heat from the engine cooling system, this isn't the case with the Model S. The heaters are electric heating elements, with the cooling loop for the battery back being separated for any heating purposes.

It's plausible that by turning on the heaters, you diverted some energy from the superchargers form the pack to the heater, reducing the thermal load on the pack... but I rather doubt this would make a big difference...

 

[scaesare]

Getting back on topic now: Here’s how Chevrolet built a practical electric vehicle with the 2017 Bolt EV

Some interesting quotes from that article:

The Bolt itself was present, too, of course, ... Also strangely present in absentia was Tesla...

A bit of an odd non-sequitur, given this was a specific visit with GM for their car...

Chevrolet was quick to point out than in Canada at least, it’s outselling Tesla two to one when it comes to electrified vehicles, before the Volt has even launched. That’s if you count the Volt, Chevy’s hybrid electric with a 53-mile pure electric range and gas-powered extend range of 420 miles total. “We are the leader in the electrification of vehicles,”

Hmmm... Given the cold-weather impact to BEV's, and the fact that 87% of the Volt's range is provided by gasoline, that's an interesting take on being the leader "electrification", given that there can't be (m)any Bolt's in Canada yet...

That battery is also uniquely designed, with continuous rectilinear shape that undergirds the vehicle, making it possible to have a low, flat continues floor throughout the car while distributing battery weight evenly and helping create a low center of gravity.

"Unique"? I don't think that word means what they think it means...

 

[brucet999]

Elektrek revisits Bolt test drive.

Electrek