Great test drive feedback. Have you compared the MYLRorP to the GV70 or BMW iX?So as part 2 of my post above...
We test drove the 2023 Model Y Long Range with the smallest wheels (19” Geminis) and the “new for 2023 Comfort Suspension” – aka the latest suspension part number. We had Turo’d one with the 20” induction wheels back in 2021 for two days – so comparing to that and the 2023 Model Y Performance we drove on Saturday. Unlike the drive on Saturday though, we had a full hour this time around (back to back test drives scheduled)
The details (focusing mostly on the suspension):
Oh and I have one more test drive of an MYP scheduled...you know...just to be sure!
- Power – So after 30 mph or so, the MYP and MYLR feel very similar power wise. Below 30 is where they MYP shines, but it feels less like a “power” difference per se and more like a very, very soft throttle map. It’s almost more annoying than just being “less power” as it feels totally artificial (like a really old school turbo lag where you wait and wait and wait….and then boom. I mean it’s fine of course and not a deal breaker for a MYLR (especially since freeway acceleration for passing feels about the same as a MYP), but I just wish it felt a little less obviously neutered.
- Suspension / Ride / NVH
- Compression - So, I only had to drive about 10 feet in the parking lot before I could tell the compression setting on the shocks was considerably softer than the performance suspension. To be clear, this was NOT just the tires. Yes, the low profile tires on the MYP certainly contributed to the transmission of more road surface info, BUT there was simply a much more gradual compression with more travel, etc. This translated into simply less "busyness" at low speeds and less head toss over surfaces that seemed fine. Also had less impact harshness on expansion cracks. After about 10 or 15 minutes of driving, I felt it drove a lot more like our Volvo XC60 (with Koni FSD in front, stock in back on 20s) than the MYP did…at least from a compression perspective. Unfortunately, it still showed a weakness…rebound
- Rebound - When hitting bumps (small or large) it just doesn’t settle on the rebound as quick as it should. There is no “one and done bounce” where it just takes a set after the initial rebound. So you end up with a bit of a “wallow” that is also somewhat annoying. The MYP had constant movement because of the “too stiff” compression, whereas the MYLR kept moving because the rebound is underdamped. On the freeway that translated to a bit too much uuuuupppp/dooooown....sure to be appreciated by parents of kids subject to motion sickness. Not terrible, but still a flaw.
- NVH – So, we drove it on my washboard surface “test road” and it had less of the boom/buffeting than the MYP but surprisingly not that much less. Heck, it may have been almost the same…ugh! Now, on any other surface we drove on it was tolerable…but still. I would definitely be heading down the same booming/buffeting rat hole again that I did with my Model S. At least the Model Y guys already have a giant thread on it (vacuum tubing in the hatch seal and the 3d printed hatch stops seems to be promising partial fixes).
- Performance Feel – So this one was a bit surprising and definitely a combination of the suspension and tires. The MYP felt connected to the road with the 21s – not as it “it is so stuck and rides on rails” junk but as in “I can tell exactly what these tires are doing and I feel no disconnect between the road surface and the wheel/seat” and "even movement of the pedal or wheel directly translates to immediate movement of the car. The low profile performance tires combined with the firm compression setting shows here. When you hit that throttle on the MYP, it was just there and you knew what the car was doing. The MYLR was a surprise in that it felt noticeably more disconnected…much moreso than I would have imagined had I not test driven them so closely together. It isn’t some terrible mess or anything, but an obvious delta.
- Summary – Both of the comfort versions of the latest suspensions (performance and regular) are better than their predecessors and both still have drawbacks. In reality, the base suspension is simply better for most people in most situations and I might be inclined to lean toward that suspension overall (and just be a bit sad about the disconnected feeling). If I purchased a new MYP, I would probably try to “live with” the new comfort performance suspension for a while to see if I could get used to it, BUT I also would consider swapping in the base suspension and hope the 21s/performance tires would help walk a middle line on the whole “connected” feeling. Swapping to the 19s on the performance suspension probably won’t result in a ton of ride quality improvement (IMO). I would also start at the rear first (like I did with our Volvo).
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Comfort Suspension Not Much of an Improvement
- Thread starter Engi_Nerd
- Start date
I think the suspension travel likely makes "fixing it" a bit of a challenge. Ideally, they would increase the travel (might require raising the car...you know, like an SUV)...which would probably give them more to work with here. The fancy options like magnetorheological adaptive dampers would be nice, but just a decent, better tuned damper (rebound/compression) using high quality components would probably go a long way. I might also invest more time in the bushings - maybe lean toward a softer durometer rubber...although I don't think that is terrible on the cars now. Still I used to Joke that BMW's suspension "secret" (for making good handling suspensions that didn't beat you up) was "rubber". Their bushings always wore out to dang fast compared to most cars, but I think it was because it was simply softer and they used a lot of it - really helps with impact harshness. Heck, the ball joints on my old E36 ('97 328i) were encases in rubber surrounded by a thin metal sleeve!
I have not. I did drive a Polestar 2 (non-performance). Will have to dig up my review there (note: It was "OK", but the short wheelbase really impacts the ride on that car...hard to correct it w/o going much softer. I wanted to test a performance model with the Ohlins, but never got around to it...I suspect it would ride firm (even on the softest setting), but the ride "quality" would be more sophisiticated.
I actually like my recent test drive. The ev thing is all new to me. I test drove the MYLR with the 20”s and on most cars, I have always had issues with bigger wheels above 19” being more stiff on any vehicle plus more susceptible to damage. The test ride was great on smooth surfaces and highway driving was great. However, once I went over expansion joints, potholes and city driving over road patches it wasn’t that pleasant. I bet if I installed a set of 18” wheels and lowered the pressure a couple pounds on a pilot 4S, the ride would absorb the impact much better. Any confirmation from others on this?
Xenoilphobe
Well-Known Member
I didn't know Audi made cluster munitions, must be the new Audi CBU - cluster bomb unit.
Xenoilphobe
Well-Known Member
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The P2 with Ohlins on the stiffest setting is just brutal. Rented one for 10 days... No passenger could hold a coffee in their hands without it spilling something. But I LOVED how the P2 handled (no bad habits). Best handling EV I've driven/owned.
The iX M60 with air suspension is probably the most compliant suspension of any car I've driven. There's no comparison with the MYLR, Ioniq 5, EV6, Mach-E, etc. or any mainstream EV. If I had $140K lying around I'd pick an iX M60.... and also smoke every other EV except a Plaid or Taycan.
I used to be a huge BMW stan so this statement interested me, even though I cant afford the car. Perhaps I am missing something, but when I looked at the ix M60 it says "0-60 in 3.6 seconds." Thats pretty much the same as a model Y performance (leaving model X plaid out). A taycan is a sedan to me so I am leaving that out, as well as any model 3 or S).
I feel like I am missing something, because from my time here, you have never been much for hyperbole or exaggeration, so I figure I would ask what I am missing.
3.2 in the real world. BMW loves to understate numbers.. including range.
"Acceleration to 60 mph consumes but 3.2 seconds, and the quarter-mile is covered in 11.5 seconds at 120 mph"
It's a crystal glass covered mommy SUV with performance EV acceleration and air suspension that's better than the Model S and X versions.
I don't know who the iX appeals to... but it's awesome. Too expensive for certain.
Makes sense, and yeah BMW has under rated power consistently for years, across multiple models.
Back to suspensions, I am always surprised (but I guess I shouldnt be at this point) at the amount of vitriol that springs up around this topic in threads here. I am perfectly happy with my 2018 Model 3P and my 2022 Model Y P. My wife doesnt complain about the model Y either, after coming from a BMW X3 M40i that we had with the adaptive suspension.
With that being said, does it bother me if someone else doesnt like it? No, and I have no idea why it bothers anyone else when someone likes or doesnt like some specific feature enough to argue about it.
/shrug
Back to suspensions, I am always surprised (but I guess I shouldnt be at this point) at the amount of vitriol that springs up around this topic in threads here. I am perfectly happy with my 2018 Model 3P and my 2022 Model Y P. My wife doesnt complain about the model Y either, after coming from a BMW X3 M40i that we had with the adaptive suspension.
With that being said, does it bother me if someone else doesnt like it? No, and I have no idea why it bothers anyone else when someone likes or doesnt like some specific feature enough to argue about it.
/shrug
Curious…Did you buy the car without test driving it?
Or did this become an issue after owning for long period of time?
I test drove it and it seems find, but wonder if it’ll hit different after having for a year.
I can tell you when I test drove it I didn’t notice the harshness of the bumps because I pretty much didn’t find any to hit.
My model three was a lot better than the model Y in this regard.
OK, so here is part 3...and maybe the final part...who knows!? So we, or rather "my wife", did the second MYP test drive today (2023, "comfort" version of performance suspension, etc.) - she had a full 30 minutes behind the wheel. I was either in the passenger seat or the rear seat for the entire drive. This was the same car I drove on Saturday.
My assessment that the ride is simply "busier" than the MYLR still stands...and it is true at both low and freeway speeds. It is less about "big" bumps and more about just general small movements happening most of the time. The buffeting on the washboard road was basically the same or even slightly better than the MYLR. My wife felt it was BETTER...I felt it was close to a wash...minimally, not materially worse than the MYLR (surprisingly). We drove over another road section with uneven expansion cracks. The LR definitely handled those better (no worse then the Volvo), but the MYP was better than expected here....not awesome, but not kidney busting. I mentioned "other factors. While I don't know for sure, I suspect the Michelin PS4s have a softer compound than the Eco Continentals...this may have helped the MYP a tad. Of course, as those PS4s wear...
The freeway ride was also busy, but the rebound did seem a bit better controlled than the MYLR (now that I knew to look for it) - probably still an overall worse ride than the MYLR, but at least a trade off. I am hesitant to comment more on freeway ride as we just didn't get much time there.
The biggest surprise though was the aforementioned performance feel from my last post. My wife described the feeling of accelerating while in the MYLR as "hovering over the road". My interpretation of that after discussing with her is that she was feeling the "disconnected" feeling I described above. Conversely, she felt the MYP was more "grounded" and less "hovercraft". Now, to be clear, she drove our old 2013 Model S P85+ (Rear wheel Drive with the sport Performance Plus package) for 6 years from July 2016 - May, 2022. She still prefers that suspension (air+sport for the win) of course, but it is what it is for the Y.
She did NOT want to like the MYP more as she sort of dreads the low profile tires (and is concerned about blowouts, etc.)...however, she was a little underwhelmed with the MYLR (and even concerned the "buffeting" wasn't better), while she was legitimately enthusiastic about the MYP. She really didn't care about the acceleration delta (well, maybe a little) - it was the connectedness to the road that drew her in.
One final aside for BOTH cars with regard to the cabin boom/buffeting that plagues these cars (and I had in my Model S). When she originally climbed in the backseat on our first test drive she said she could no longer hear it. I thought we just didn't drive on bad roads in that part of the test drive. However, for these last two test drives I was in the back seat for all or part of the drive and well, she was right. The boom/buffeting was almost impossible to hear back there. I mean, I could feel the dang washboard road through the rear seat back but wasn't HEARING it or feeling it my ears. I was stunned. I spent HOURS AND HOURS dealing with this on my Model S years ago (creating firmer hatch stops back then was the closest thing I got to an answer) and would not have believed the backseat would be so different here. I won't head down that rat hole here in this thread, but did want to note it.
Oh, and yeah...for tonight anyway I just changed my Model Y reservation from a MYLR to a MYP. We'll see if I change my mind in the morning!
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