For some reason, I feel weird having my car charge for that long all night long. I have no reason to feel this way. I’ve been quoted about $950 as the cheapest to get a a 240 install. It’s abour 50 feet of wiring. I’ve been wanting to use the $950 towards PPF
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Converting 110 outlets for home charging ?
- Thread starter bigevil
- Start date
For some reason, I feel weird having my car charge for that long all night long. I have no reason to feel this way. I’ve been quoted about $950 as the cheapest to get a a 240 install. It’s abour 50 feet of wiring. I’ve been wanting to use the $950 towards PPF
I think you can set charging to as low as something like 6A if you need to.
Yes, if done incorrectly, there can be problems charging for hours straight on a standard receptacle. Fires are possible and have been reported by other EV owners. Make sure that you have good quality wiring and plugs, and don't use anything else on the same circuit (well, maybe an LED light or two). I specifically replaced all of my receptacles and I mounted the EVSE brick so that no extra weight is put on the receptacle. I do use the same circuit as the garage door opener and a few LED lights, but it hasn't been a problem. My set up is a bit different than most people with my 1960's panel in the basement, 100+ ft away, and through two 8" concrete walls. I decided that my limited daily driving (10-20 mi) wasn't worth the extra installation cost back in 2011. Now I have two EVs (each on different circuits), but still have the same driving distance. Mostly, I use the 2011 Leaf in-town and use the 70D for road trips, so only charge to >50% a few days before I leave. Since I have superchargers about 75-150 mi in all directions, it's a pretty good setup. Oh, and $0.06/KWh for electricity 24/7, so the 15% loss in charging efficiency is really a big deal. This set up wouldn't work quite as well in CA or with higher mileage drivers.
I have also gone three years on 110V and literally never had a problem. I usually drive 40-45 mi/day. You will easily charge that back overnight at 110v. If you keep your car around 75-80% SOC you can still do 200 mile days every so often and you will recover in a couple days at most. 220V is totally over rated. Who actually drives 250+ miles, goes back home to fully charge and then drives another 250+ miles? Seriously, the time involved to do that at town speeds would be something like 8 hours in the car of just driving alone. It just doesn't happen.
I have also been using the standard mobile connector without any issues. Incidentally, the car will downregulate the amperage if it detects any issues with power fluctuation automatically. Not sure Leaf or whatever does this, but a Tesla shouldn't be able to over stress circuit.
To quote Flavor Flav, "Don't believe the hype!"
I have also been using the standard mobile connector without any issues. Incidentally, the car will downregulate the amperage if it detects any issues with power fluctuation automatically. Not sure Leaf or whatever does this, but a Tesla shouldn't be able to over stress circuit.
To quote Flavor Flav, "Don't believe the hype!"
Thanks everyone! Ordered a second cable and will just plug straight in! ! When I buy a house I’ll do a hpwc but for now this will work
davewill
Active Member
I quite agree, but take the time to find out what other outlets are on the same circuit. Turn off the breaker for it, then go around with an outlet tester or a lamp, and find out what all is connected. You wouldn't want a high current device like a heater or microwave on the same circuit. Also, with an old house like this, I'd go ahead and pay an electrician for an hour's time to inspect the wiring and replace that outlet with a new one. Better safe than sorry.
eladts
Member
The Quick 220 is a hack. Using this as the primary method for charging is just asking for trouble.
I disagree about the device itself. I often hear people saying, "Oh, that's easy, I can build one of those!" That is a hack. With the Quick220, it's kind of expensive because you are getting what you pay for. It has a lot of proper monitoring and indications and safety cutoffs that are needed to make this safe to use, and it's very well built. So I do think it has a good level of safety. It's just very inconvenient and rarely useful. All outside outlets of a building are required to be GFCI, since they are exposed to rain, so they can never be used with it. So you would have to get two circuits from inside the house, which is just going to be a pain running cords through rooms and out to the garage or driveway. That part of it is going to be cumbersome and awkward.
eladts
Member
While I agree that the Quick 220 is better than a simply DIY box, this kind of usage is still explicitly forbidden by the NEC. Even with all the safeguards things can go wrong, especially with an old house with very few circuits to begin with. It might be useful in emergency with constant monitoring, but I wouldn't sleep with such a setup nearby.
Since the NEC only applies to wiring in the walls of your house up to the point of the outlets, rather than appliances that are plugged into the outlets, I am skeptical NEC says anything "explicitly" about this. Care to give a citation?
It is drawing exactly the appropriate amount of current from a standard outlet. What do you think could go wrong, any differently than a blender or toaster?
Olle
Active Member
measure the voltage between your hots (the narrower blade openings) on the duplex receptacle. If 0 volts they are on the same side of the split phase. If 240 V between hots, you could replace the receptacle with a 6-15, buy a 6-15 adapter for your umc, (or buy a 3rd party evse to plug in your j1772 adapter) and charge at double the speed.
Not sure this is legal in your jurisdiction to do this but it is a very easy way to 240.
I cannot ever picture that any building would run two separate 120V circuits to wire into one receptacle. I don't even think most 5-15 or 5-20 receptacles would be built with the capability to connect the top and bottom outlet to different circuits.
davewill
Active Member
It is unusual, but the last duplex outlet I installed had a removable jumper plate that allowed at least the hots on the two sockets to be wired separately (I just don't remember whether the other neutrals could be separated). Not worth hoping for, though.
I do recall a type of situation that might do that. It wouldn't necessarily be for two different phases. But sometimes a place might have one outlet switchable and the other always on.
As long as you can find two outlets on different circuits you can swap the phase on one of them fairly easily.
That said, I would not use that Quick 220 device. This hack, very likely, involves extension cords (in order to get on two separate circuits). Loads like this (max current on the rated circuit) over extension cords is just asking for trouble. I don't care how "good" the extension cord(s) are. Extension cords should never be considered for anything permanent.
eprosenx
Active Member
I think most receptacles have this ability. You just cut a piece of metal that bridges them together to split them. As mentioned, it is often used for switched outlets, but also can be used for two circuits. Modern code might require them on a handle tied breaker so they are both disconnected at once for maintenance.
I highly doubt it would be that way in a commercial garage. Frankly, I am shocked there are even outlets at all... the load calculations for watts per square foot in a garage must be tiny. They were not thinking about car charging back when it was built. The receptacles are probably intended for basic hand tool incidental use or 12v battery tenders, etc...
TeslaFi reports I get about 70% to 80% efficiency while charging my X at 120V 12A. Works fine for occasional use (while the new 3 is hogging the HPWC) and when we're visiting our son for a week. 20 miles a day on a 3 will only take about 4 hours so you'll have plenty of reserve charging capacity if you have a high mileage day.
I think cold weather is the only thing that can cause problems with 120V charging, when it can't heat the battery enough to start charging in very cold weather. Shouldn't be a problem in L.A..
I think cold weather is the only thing that can cause problems with 120V charging, when it can't heat the battery enough to start charging in very cold weather. Shouldn't be a problem in L.A..
n2mb_racing
Active Member
If you have 12 gauge wire and an the outlet is on its own circuit, you can change the outlet to a nema 6-20, which is 240v 20a. It will charge pretty fast and costs very little for the outlet and breaker replacement .
I've got a HPWC doing 48a and it's pretty awesome to be able to bump the slider from 90% to 100% in the morning before I leave for a long trip and have it done in relatively short order, rather than having to worry about timing it just right on 110. I don't do long trips every day, but it's nice to not have to plan my SOC days in advance before a trip just to make sure I have enough headroom to charge enough overnight. Or the reverse; I got home from a roadtrip late sunday night with about 40 miles of range left, I don't have to put any thought into whether the 50 miles it charges overnight will be enough for my commute plus any errands I run plus if I want to flip on the heater 5 minutes before I get in the car.
110 "works fine" but it seems silly to me to add the extra cognitive load and anxiety for something that can (usually) be solved relatively quickly and cheaply, compared to the price of the car. Obviously in OP's example, as a renter, it's a bit trickier.
But, YMMV, and some people here think those of us who don't see the value in EAP are missing the entire point of the car. So everyone's priorities are different.
I charged this weekend at a rental house 200mi from home and the outdoor outlets didn't work so I had to charge overnight, twice, using an extension cord, 110 @ 9 amps. Snooze. Thankfully it was just to top the car off after a supercharger stop on the way in.
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