Decreasing rated range.

[islandbayy]

Almost exact the same for me. 229 with 4.5 and 224 with 5.0. This night I GAINED one mile in 12 hours, negative vampire load hahah



15200 miles, 7 month old. Not to happy with 10 %!! range loss in 7 month. I hope it wont go on at that speed.

With the cold temps, at 14,500 miles, my range charge this morning with no vampire losses, I was down to 198 on 4.5
At about 13,000 miles, I had a 208 range charge with about 15 degree warmer temps. I am really hopeing this is not permanent, and only temperature related (though, I thought thats why we had pack warmers so that temps did NOT effect us like this). A 10 mile loss in 1,500 miles is not acceptable. I have been babying my pack!
Ownership is 5 months 1 week and 3 days, 14,500 miles.
I am attempting a balance charge tonight. I am charging to range at 5 amps 240v. 8 hr 48 minutes to go, hopefully it will be done before 8 amp as I have a 170 mile drive in the morning. It will be very difficult to do a road trip this winter when it gets colder if the range keeps dropping like this. I'm going to need to find someone with a heated garage to see if that makes a difference and how much of a difference.

 

[Odenator]

why would you range charge your car and leave it sit there for hours? That's the one thing you're told by Telsa exactly *NOT* to do.

Actually I am range charging every night (for the last 1-2 weeks) - specifically on the advice of Tesla engineers to see if that will allow my displayed range when charge to 100% to increase. As I have posted before, I was on v5.6, now v5.8 and my 100% charge only shows 235 rated miles every time. That's a 12-15% lose of range from when the battery was new. The Tesla engineers think that if I keep the car fully charged, then it will recalibrate the computer so that it will not stop the charging early and show that it is full. At least that is what they think is going on, but I'm starting to have my doubts since the top range has not increased since I have left it on range mode.

 

[Cottonwood]

Actually I am range charging every night (for the last 1-2 weeks) - specifically on the advice of Tesla engineers to see if that will allow my displayed range when charge to 100% to increase. As I have posted before, I was on v5.6, now v5.8 and my 100% charge only shows 235 rated miles every time. That's a 12-15% lose of range from when the battery was new. The Tesla engineers think that if I keep the car fully charged, then it will recalibrate the computer so that it will not stop the charging early and show that it is full. At least that is what they think is going on, but I'm starting to have my doubts since the top range has not increased since I have left it on range mode.

I had something like this happen on my Roadster when they did a warranty replacement of the battery; car refused to move; they never told me what the error code meant. The new battery that had been stored for a while showed something like 25% less range. They advised several range charges. What finally worked was to do a few almost complete cycles, drive down to 10-20%, then charge back to full. I chalk this up to rebalancing the stored battery. Your mileage may vary... :wink:

 

[hans]

What finally worked was to do a few almost complete cycles, drive down to 10-20%, then charge back to full. I chalk this up to rebalancing the stored battery.

Keeping in mind that the displayed range is an estimate and not a directly measured value; it is easier to make more accurate estimates when the battery is charged from near empty to full. The estimation algorithm uses the total amount of energy put into the battery in it's calculations.

I am not discounting that the pack also gets rebalanced, nor am I saying that this is what caused the increase on your Roadster. I am just pointing out some other factors that effect "perceived" range so that people don't start full cycle charging their packs and mistakenly see the positive reenforcement of the resulting better range estimate. It's quite possible to be damaging your battery, reducing the real range, and think you have actually improved it.

 

[Cottonwood]

Keeping in mind that the displayed range is an estimate and not a directly measured value; it is easier to make more accurate estimates when the battery is charged from near empty to full. The estimation algorithm uses the total amount of energy put into the battery in it's calculations.

I am not discounting that the pack also gets rebalanced, nor am I saying that this is what caused the increase on your Roadster. I am just pointing out some other factors that effect "perceived" range so that people don't start full cycle charging their packs and mistakenly see the positive reenforcement of the resulting better range estimate. It's quite possible to be damaging your battery, reducing the real range, and think you have actually improved it.

Exactly!

That is why I did 20%-30% (10% to 20% normal display in a Roadster) to 90% (100% normal display in a Roadster) most of the time.

 

[brianman]

@Brianman

When did you get 5.6? I'm still in 4.5 Oh... and Max Range charges are ~250 with ~25000 miles logged.

I mentioned it on another thread (I think...). I was at the service center on Wed/Thu last week right after they "unleashed the hounds" .. i.e. lucky timing.

 

[digitaltim]

My range charge this morning got to 259 miles - it dropped to 256 miles when I opened the door.

Still running v4.5 and ~33k miles on the car (~22k on the current battery).

 

[DriverOne]

For what it's worth, I have a 60kwh and I've seen my 90% charge go from 181 to 177 now. Forgot what it was when I got it but I swear it was in the 190s. I have about 6k miles on the car running 4.5.

Thanks ChriZ. I was looking for someone to validate my numbers. I have about 7K miles driven in a 60. Originally after delivery, a night's charge would result in 184 miles (firmware 4.x). Now it's 175 (on firmware 5.6). If this is truly 90%,, a range charge won't be close to over 200 miles, let alone the claimed 208

Hopefully just a firmware change or mis-measurement - or it charges by default to 85%. Otherwise this is rather eyebrow-raising.

 

[bluetinc]

Just a quick note, the % you are referring to is the Battery Packs SOC (State of Charge). This is not a percentage of your total miles available. It's a finer detail, but it is in part why the numbers don't make any sense.

Peter

Thanks ChriZ. I was looking for someone to validate my numbers. I have about 7K miles driven in a 60. Originally after delivery, a night's charge would result in 184 miles (firmware 4.x). Now it's 175 (on firmware 5.6). If this is truly 90%,, a range charge won't be close to over 200 miles, let alone the claimed 208

Hopefully just a firmware change or mis-measurement - or it charges by default to 85%. Otherwise this is rather eyebrow-raising.

 

[mknox]

I'm still on 4.5.

I did a 90% charge on a 120 volt connection over about 20 hours. That's all the hotel/conference center I was at had. I saw it stop in real time on the VisibleTesla app that I just happened to launch with about 1 minute left. I got 223 miles.

 

[gaswalla]

just a thought: has anyone taken the car down to near zero miles and then charge back up to range while changing the charging units to kw/hr's: then we could compare the actual capacity of the battery without looking at algorithms for miles or losses due to vampires.

 

[bigsmooth125]

My first range charge on v.5.6 yielded 253 miles of rated range. Previously, I was getting 255 miles. My car has 13k miles on it.

 

[islandbayy]

just a thought: has anyone taken the car down to near zero miles and then charge back up to range while changing the charging units to kw/hr's: then we could compare the actual capacity of the battery without looking at algorithms for miles or losses due to vampires.

Just did, 0 miles to 203 miles and it was still charging when I had to leave. 58kW used (60kw pack). Previous range charge yielded 196 miles. My pack was VERY out of balance.
Last night, I did another (so 2 range charges 2 days in a row), and yielded a 206 mile range.

14,600 miles on pack in 5 months 1 week 5 days of ownership.

 

[aaron.s]

All -

Did my first supercharger test since getting 5.6 - charged to 90% and only got 223 miles where I had last gotten 227 miles at 90% on firmware 4.5.....

Was surprised - although I know in the release notes they have tweaked Range calculations.

Aaron

 

[tdiggity]

I think I win for the lowest numbers:

85kwH with v5.6, 11k miles, 90%=218 miles.

I live in Northern California, so I don't believe that weather is causing the lower numbers. Noticed these low numbers since v4.5/4 months. Probably started happening right when I started lowering my charge limit to 60-70%.

 

[hans]

I think I win for the lowest numbers:

85kwH with v5.6, 11k miles, 90%=218 miles.

I live in Northern California, so I don't believe that weather is causing the lower numbers. Noticed these low numbers since v4.5/4 months. Probably started happening right when I started lowering my charge limit to 60-70%.

My range estimates got lower after I started babying my pack and only charging to 67% most days. I think this is just a long term drift caused by the Coulomb Counting method of estimating SOC. In English that means that it hasn't seen 100% in so long its estimate is lower than it should be.

 

[SFOTurtle]

Just did, 0 miles to 203 miles and it was still charging when I had to leave. 58kW used (60kw pack). Previous range charge yielded 196 miles. My pack was VERY out of balance.
Last night, I did another (so 2 range charges 2 days in a row), and yielded a 206 mile range.

14,600 miles on pack in 5 months 1 week 5 days of ownership.

Very interesting.

 

[brianman]

I think I win for the lowest numbers:
85kwH with v5.6, 11k miles, 90%=218 miles.

With 5.6, my peak @ 90% so far is 219. So we're about at the same spot. 19.2k miles here.

 

[viet658]

Others in the 5.6 thread have reported some issues with getting the car to go to sleep. Make sure your car is actually on sleep mode as that loss seems a bit high unless the temps were very cold, which I doubt is the case in Pomona right now.

I've tracked the vampire losses over the week and it appears I'm losing about 3 miles over eight hours on 5.6 consistently. The car is going to sleep because when I get in the car it takes a while for the screen to boot up. Not sure why I'm not seeing the reduction in vampire losses as others are reporting. The car is parked overnight in the garage where temps are in the 60's.

 

[Zextraterrestrial]

With 5.6, my peak @ 90% so far is 219. So we're about at the same spot. 19.2k miles here.

My 5.6 90% at 16k miles is 218 / 100% 248

anyone care to interpret these: at least 5 data points per firmware since the ability to change charge %

v4.5(13k mi) y= 2.95x - 33
v5 .0(14.5k) y= 2.89x - 33.95
v5.6(16k) y= 2.77x - 30.9

loaner car on 5.6 (4800mi) y=2.97x - 32.6


Slope seems to change with age and use?