Did Tesla lose focus by making the Model 3 an autonomous car instead of a great EV?

[slipnslider]

Maybe they just do not agree with you on what is compelling. Just like some didn't agree with Steve Jobs that a touch screen was the way to go and stylus and physical keyboard where destined to disappear. Palm and blackberry dominated then. Where are they now? I have faith in Tesla and crew, not concerned at all with those who bolt.. Pun intended.

But there was a good reason to get rid of the keyboard on the iphone- you have a very limited space on a pocket sized device.
There is no good reason to get rid of the driver instrument cluster, other than saving a few hundred dollars which makes no sense on a 40k car, or showing everyone how "revolutionary" you think you are.

 

[Skotty]

I hope they divorced the display from the other electronics junk so that Model 3 displays can be replaced more easily and cheaply than the S and X displays. Some of us live in fear of things like the display bubbles, and stuff like that would be far less concerning if the display was just a display and easily replaceable.

 

[Sonny Daze]

I hope they divorced the display from the other electronics junk so that Model 3 displays can be replaced more easily and cheaply than the S and X displays. Some of us live in fear of things like the display bubbles, and stuff like that would be far less concerning if the display was just a display and easily replaceable.

This is the only positive I have been able to extract from this implementation.

 

[eisbock]

Again, if it isn't compelling for you, then don't buy it. There are several other car companies working on EVs, perhaps one of those will suit your needs. It is silly to be upset at Tesla for not meeting your expectations.

If there is that much about the car that bothers you then you should really just cancel your reservation and begin the search/wait for a car that will meet your expectations. If you go forward and purchase it with that entire list of things you don't like then you'll have only yourself to blame if you end up not liking it.

Problem is, other car companies are always working on new EVs. They've been working on new EVs for years now. The only company to actually deliver a practical EV has been GM, and it will only be sold in limited numbers to a small part of the US. There is no market for EVs right now and car companies know it. They'll drag their feet for years and keep throwing concept vehicles at us for as long. Tesla is the only option right now. I wouldn't even consider Audi, BMW, Mercedes, whatever even in the future because of the lack of charging network. Nobody cares about long distance travel in an EV.

There are several advantages Tesla has over any would-be EVs even if the car looks and drives like butt. What it boils down to is that Tesla is the only realistic option for EVs right now, and will continue to be the only realistic option for the next decade. I don't want to wait 10 years for a new car because I should be able to buy a compelling EV next year if Tesla upholds their mission statement. I guess we'll have to wait and see if the final product is more compelling than what they've come up with now.

 

[googlepeakoil]

Problem is, other car companies are always working on new EVs. They've been working on new EVs for years now. The only company to actually deliver a practical EV has been GM, and it will only be sold in limited numbers to a small part of the US. There is no market for EVs right now and car companies know it. They'll drag their feet for years and keep throwing concept vehicles at us for as long. Tesla is the only option right now. I wouldn't even consider Audi, BMW, Mercedes, whatever even in the future because of the lack of charging network. Nobody cares about long distance travel in an EV.

There are several advantages Tesla has over any would-be EVs even if the car looks and drives like butt. What it boils down to is that Tesla is the only realistic option for EVs right now, and will continue to be the only realistic option for the next decade. I don't want to wait 10 years for a new car because I should be able to buy a compelling EV next year if Tesla upholds their mission statement. I guess we'll have to wait and see if the final product is more compelling than what they've come up with now.

If you watch "Revenge of the Electric Car" its quite clear Carlos Ghosn (head of Nissan / Renault) is behind the electric car and not just as a compliance / concept car. The Leaf suffers from a poor front design - especially the headlights, and the fact it launched with a 24kW 80-90 mile usable range. They're now at 30kWh and due to debut a redesigned car with 60kWh. It sure as hell won't have 1 display, and it'll also be a hatchback. The GM bolt isn't even down to be released in Europe / the UK for sure. The Bolt by all accounts is quite spritely (0-60 of 8 seconds). The Model 3 will lead with 6 seconds. The Leaf v2 will probably be Bolt nippy and won't have Elon Musk behind it - and the charger won't be Supercharger speed (50kW not 120+ and probably not as cheap - dam I like the Supercharger - so easy to use - no stupid LCD to read and guaranteed to be cheaper) - but the display and hatchback will be a big thing for many people wanting a £30-40k electric car. If the Model 3 is as weird/compromised as it's looking I'll get my £1000 back and buy a 2nd gen Leaf. But I put my £1000 in because I really liked what Elon is trying to achieve... but Elon now seems to care more about pushing self-driving than a cheap, sporty but practical family car.

 

[Reciprocity]

But there was a good reason to get rid of the keyboard on the iphone- you have a very limited space on a pocket sized device.

The blackberry fit in your pocket just fine and was selling like hotcakes at the time. Hindsight is always 20/20, looking back now it was a great idea. It could have been a decision that sunk the device completely. Does the lack of a center cluster sink the 3 completely? Highly doubtful. Such a minor feature in a very amazing vehicle. Amazing because its an affordable long range EV that is dead S3XY and not totally fugly like the competition.

I dont think it will sink the product, if im right then people will not cancel their reservations, If im wrong then there will mass cancellations. Its pretty simple really.

 

[ModelNforNerd]

But I put my £1000 in because I really liked what Elon is trying to achieve... but Elon now seems to care more about pushing self-driving than a cheap, sporty but practical family car.

Why does everyone assume the Model 3 won't be BOTH self-driving and practical?


When you wanted an HDTV 10 years ago, the technology wasn't cheap, but over time, the price came down. The same will happen with Self-driving tech. Being an early adopter is rarely cheap.

 

[Sonny Daze]

Why does everyone assume the Model 3 won't be BOTH self-driving and practical?

Because many (not most) people don't consider this practical, and there is little sign that the production version will be any different.

Edit: Personally, I don't think it will be self driving for quite some time either (if ever) .

 

[ModelNforNerd]

Here we are.......spy shots of the production candidate interior....


http://jalopnik.com/this-is-the-ful...ource=jalopnik_facebook&utm_medium=socialflow

 

[n2mb_racing]

Model S is a great car and autonomous. Not worried about the display until I drive one.

 

[electracity]

The jalopnik comments are a hoot. Now the model 3 is hated by many, even though it is the car Elon showed.

Elon's tweets are powerful. He wanted people to expect less of the model 3, and Tesla fans obeyed. Now it apparently sucks.

 

[Reciprocity]

Elon's tweets are powerful. He wanted people to expect less of the model 3, and Tesla fans obeyed. Now it apparently sucks.

I know, this is hilarious. Most people are not fanbois and have no clue what Elon is tweeting or what the interior looks like beyond the initial reveal. Tesla cannot possibly satisfy the current demand for 2+ years. The 3 will be a lesser car then the S/X so that it does not cannibalize those sales. Oh, and all the upset fanbois will buy it to and in 12 months you will see posts about how much they love it as they wait inline to put in reservations for the Y. And maybe another manufacturer will have a respectable competitor by then, but it will really be to late to blunt Tesla.

 

[stopcrazypp]

The jalopnik comments are a hoot. Now the model 3 is hated by many, even though it is the car Elon showed.

Elon's tweets are powerful. He wanted people to expect less of the model 3, and Tesla fans obeyed. Now it apparently sucks.

Jalopnik comments have always been a mix of Tesla fans (which bleed over mostly from Gizmodo, where Tesla articles tend to be cross posted) and absolute Tesla haters/naysayers (with some in between). Many are ICE enthusiasts, and it took a while for them to even acknowledge EVs will be here for the long run. I don't think the impression of the 3 will improve there until the P model comes out (this helped for the Model S).

 

[eisbock]

The blackberry fit in your pocket just fine and was selling like hotcakes at the time. Hindsight is always 20/20, looking back now it was a great idea. It could have been a decision that sunk the device completely.

I know we're off topic here, but the decision to replace the keyboard with a touch screen wasn't just grounded in cost or space savings. It was revolutionary because you could use the screen as a screen or a keyboard. Think about scrolling through facebook. You just regained half of your screen, but can still type stuff if necessary.

On that front, I think the concept of a giant touch screen in a car is brilliant. You can customize and shape it whichever way you want. The issue with it though is that fiddling with it is dangerous while driving just like messing with your phone while driving is dangerous.

To that end, you want as much information as readily available as possible in a convenient location so as to distract the driver's attention as little as possible. Removing a screen means the driver will not only be more distracted because there is less room to display relevant information, but that information is also in a less convenient spot. This is fine for autonomous driving, but manual drivers will suffer. This is not only an issue to the driver, but to other innocent people who did not deserve to be run off the road because you were busy trying to dig through nested menus on a screen a foot to your right.

One screen is not as safe as two. How unsafe remains to be seen. It may not be a big deal, or it may be a huge deal. We'll have to wait and see, but the idea of sending hundreds of thousands of people out to be guinea pigs doesn't give me the warm and fuzzies.

 

[Reciprocity]

One screen is not as safe as two. How unsafe remains to be seen. It may not be a big deal, or it may be a huge deal. We'll have to wait and see, but the idea of sending hundreds of thousands of people out to be guinea pigs doesn't give me the warm and fuzzies.

Yeah, except that there are already a lot of cars that have the speed information in the center in a similar location to where the speed is seen displayed in the 3. People are really blowing this way out of proportion without even driving the car.

Redirect Notice

 

[davidc18]

Time will tell of course how this plays out in the market, but for me, the current photos of the interior are very disappointing and make me think "WTF" instead of "hey that is really cool" (which is how I feel even today getting into the ms or mx).

 

[eisbock]

Time will tell of course how this plays out in the market, but for me, the current photos of the interior are very disappointing and make me think "WTF" instead of "hey that is really cool" (which is how I feel even today getting into the ms or mx).

Doesn't make me think of the future at all. Makes me think of the late 2000s when everybody was clipping their cellphones to the vents for a futuristic display. It's embarrassing that Tesla of all companies designed this.

They're focused way too heavily on making this car easy to manufacture so they can sell a ton of them that they forgot that you have make people want to buy them first.

 

[slipnslider]

I dont think it will sink the product, if im right then people will not cancel their reservations, If im wrong then there will mass cancellations. Its pretty simple really.

But why risk ANY cancellations? No one would cancel their reserv if it INCLUDED a driver cluster, and at least some will cancel WITHOUT one. For what benefit? Just to be different and new? I want a different and new powertrain, but I still want it to feel like a car and have normalish controls.

 

[jsydanma]

I have a very mixed feelings about the model 3. I live in Finland and winter here is long and cold. I am very sceptical about the whole autonomous driving thing. I simply don't believe that it could work here because of snow and bad street paintings combined to the fact that it is very dark for most of the year (cameras need light).

Actually I am not even interested about autonomous driving capabilities because I really like driving. One thing is that the law here will not allow cars to drive by itself for a long time...
Now it seems that there will not be even speedometer, big issue because you will get a speeding ticket in Finland if you are driving 8 km/h over the speed limit. I know that some of you will say "why just not use cruise control?". I use cruise control a lot but it is not possible all the time. I just need to have speedometer on my sight when I'm driving.

I wonder how much less the model 3 would cost without all the useless to me autopilot stuff? That would be the EV of my dreams, really good looking EV with awesome driving capabilities.

 

[Reciprocity]

I have a very mixed feelings about the model 3. I live in Finland and winter here is long and cold. I am very sceptical about the whole autonomous driving thing. I simply don't believe that it could work here because of snow and bad street paintings combined to the fact that it is very dark for most of the year (cameras need light).

Thats funny.. Cameras need lights. No more then the the headlights and could need less with the right cameras. FSD is not AP2. They are different and will work differently. FSD will not need to see the lines on the street. I will use high def maps in combination with landmarks. It would still have problems on roads that have no landmarks at all that are completely covered in smooth snow, as in not depressed by cars driving on it and no lead cars. People would have problems with this situation as well.

I wonder how much less the model 3 would cost without all the useless to me autopilot stuff? That would be the EV of my dreams, really good looking EV with awesome driving capabilities.

It doesnt matter because the hardware is the future.. the near future. Tesla does not put that hardware in there for you specifically, they put it in there for the safety features and for gathering data for the entire network of cars.