Did Tesla lose focus by making the Model 3 an autonomous car instead of a great EV?

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

The 3-series is half the price of a 7-series, but it doesn't get rid of any basic driving features. The freakin' Bolt has more interior features than Model 3. You're trying to tell me that a car with a bigger battery that is more expensive by the cell can afford to include buttons and extra screens for about the same price, but Tesla can't? This was not a cost-cutting measure, it was a design choice.

It's realistic to expect a dashboard display. Every single car has one. Tesla can't figure out how to do the same on a $35,000 car without breaking the bank? Sure, the car is half the price, but it's still more expensive than what most people are able to afford. This is not a cheap car, but it's built like one.

Every car displays speed. Not every car does has the speed directly in front of the driver.

Historically cars did not have a large LCD touchscreen display in the middle. So it made sense that manufacturers, choosing where to put the driving displays put it in front of the driver.

But now the large central touchscreen LCD gives a manufacturer another option. Given increasing self-driving capability, which will continue to de-emphasize the speedometer, is it really that surprising that Tesla has chosen to take advantage of the central display to lower cost (less hardware, less wiring, less assembly labor, less assembly time) and clean up the dash?

I'll see how easily I can glance at the speed on the display without moving my head. As long as I can do that, I'll be satisfied.

 

[sparkypete]

It seems to me that people are starting to get really frustrated with the Apple-like approach that Tesla are taking with the drip-feeding of Model 3 information. After a year of holding our money we deserve more.

The lack of a decent dashboard will be a deal-breaker for many. Tesla may not care if they have a 300,000 back-order instead of 400,000. But they will care if those 100,000 buy a competitor from BMW, Audi, etc and their car starts to look like a toy compared to premium brand EVs with a decent interior. Model 3 resale values will then sink and nobody will risk buying another.

I really want Model 3 to be great - and there's still a good chance it will be. But there's also a chance it will feel like a plastic toy car with dull handling and splashing all the tech budget on self-driving that a large proportion of the market don't care about.

Maybe they've got something up their sleeve. Maybe there will be premium options to add the driver information we want to see, or the steering wheel will solve everything.

I bet a lot of us are holding onto cars that we would normally have upgraded by now if we weren't waiting for our Model 3's. The temptation to go for something else is getting stronger.

This arrogant secrecy is starting to make me feel like I might not want to buy into the brand at all.

 

[dsvick]

Is anybody in here feeling compelled by one screen? Looking for honesty. Or is it more of a "sigh, I guess I'll deal with it because TESLAAAAA" *foams at the mouth*

If the lack of or inclusion of one single feature is what makes a car compelling to someone then that means that they aren't sold on all the other features either. Very few people are lucky enough to find a car that meets all of their expectations at their desired price point, most people need to compromise somewhere. The question is if there another car out there that better meets your needs/desires, if so, then that's the car you should be getting, if not then get the model 3.

 

[dsvick]

It seems to me that people are starting to get really frustrated with the Apple-like approach that Tesla are taking with the drip-feeding of Model 3 information. After a year of holding our money we deserve more.
...
This arrogant secrecy is starting to make me feel like I might not want to buy into the brand at all.

We deserve more? Why? Because we gave them money? I don't recall them telling me anything about when we'd find out all the details, all I remember is them saying that they'd start production sometime this year. I'm assuming I'll have all the info I need to make an informed decision in plenty of time to do so. If not, then I'll get upset. So far there is no reason for them to have shown all the info.

I'm also not sure where you get "arrogant secrecy", what's your basis for that? Secrecy? Sure. Arrogant? No, not really.

 

[Reciprocity]

So you're not compelled then, lol.

One screen, two screens, HUD, no HUD, I dont really care all that much. The entire package and Telsa's vision for the future is very compelling to me. I think even naysayers will come around, because there really isnt anything else that even comes close. There are a bunch of vaporware cars and even big companies like BMW and GM dont seem to have a clue. Frankly, I think it would be benefit Tesla greatly if they did have compelling competition because it would help get the word out about electric cars. I also think even with competition, it will be Tesla that wins. Look at Android vs iPhone. Android clearly dominates with market share, but Apple dominates with profits. I see the same thing for Tesla in 10 years.

 

[sparkypete]

I'm also not sure where you get "arrogant secrecy", what's your basis for that? Secrecy? Sure. Arrogant? No, not really.

Not even a little bit arrogant to tell people they do not need something that they clearly ask for and give no explanation as to why you think their concerns are covered and they shouldn't worry? Confidence has its limits.

 

[Sonny Daze]

I'm assuming I'll have all the info I need to make an informed decision in plenty of time to do so. If not, then I'll get upset.

I need that information by 16 April (their date, not mine). I don't have it.

 

[N5329K]

We deserve more? Why? Because we gave them money? I don't recall them telling me anything about when we'd find out all the details, all I remember is them saying that they'd start production sometime this year. I'm assuming I'll have all the info I need to make an informed decision in plenty of time to do so. If not, then I'll get upset. So far there is no reason for them to have shown all the info.

I'm also not sure where you get "arrogant secrecy", what's your basis for that? Secrecy? Sure. Arrogant? No, not really.

Well, two words come to my mind. They are: second reveal. For some reason that will eventually become clear, Tesla came through with the first and neglected the second.
Robin

 

[electracity]

Not even a little bit arrogant to tell people they do not need something that they clearly ask for and give no explanation as to why you think their concerns are covered and they shouldn't worry? Confidence has its limits.

The most likely explanation is that the current design with a single display is the only one that meets Tesla's budget for the car. Tesla may have some cost advantage on the drive train, but is likely at a cost disadvantage with the coachwork.

Musk is always overly optimistic when the target date is sufficiently far into the future.

 

[ModelNforNerd]

This arrogant secrecy is starting to make me feel like I might not want to buy into the brand at all.

Toyota = made trucks for the Imperial Japanese Army

Audi, BMW, Mercedes = Nazis

Ford = Henry was a well-documented racist.

GM = airbags and bailouts

Tesla = even though many have held their breath and stomped their feet like petulant children on internet forums, they decided not to put a HUD in their first mass production vehicle.



One of the above is not like the other........Tesla is clearly run by monsters!!!!






EDIT: Honestly...this is ridiculous. If you want a phone that has iTunes preloaded, do you shout at Samsung for not making one?

If you want HUD that bad, you buy a car that has one, or you get a third party unit. I know, I know.....you'd have nothing else to complain about if you did that.........sorry I brought it up.

 

[shrspeedblade]

Take heart that even today you have horseback riding enthusiasts and people motoring down the road in their Model Ts!
It's just in the future you can choose to drive yourself in your classic car (hopefully), not that you HAVE to.

 

[ModelNforNerd]

Have Ford and GM lost their focus now that they appear to be ahead of Tesla in autonomous vehicles?

Or did Tesla nudge the industry in that direction?


Tesla falls behind GM and Ford in new autonomous driving leaderboard


(FWIW: rhetorical question, as anyone who believes that 2 companies that have no levels of autonomy currently in customers hands are "leading" is an idiot.)

 

[eisbock]

If the lack of or inclusion of one single feature is what makes a car compelling to someone then that means that they aren't sold on all the other features either. Very few people are lucky enough to find a car that meets all of their expectations at their desired price point, most people need to compromise somewhere. The question is if there another car out there that better meets your needs/desires, if so, then that's the car you should be getting, if not then get the model 3.

There is no other car out there that meets my expectations. They were simple. I wanted an affordable EV in an ICE package. By "ICE package" I mean not a weirdmobile.

If you stripped all the bells and whistles off the Model S, that would be the car I was looking for. Basically the Model 3 with proper displays. And don't you tell me that extra screen is what adds $35k to the base price. Maybe a little less weirdness with the body design too.

I was hoping to find the same in the Model 3, because Tesla's mission is supposed to be compelling EVs. The mission is now autonomous driving.

All EVs are strange right now, and Tesla was supposed to change that. Instead, they just added another weird EV to the mix, meaning still only the rich can afford to drive a normal-looking/functioning EV. If Tesla didn't have the legacy of the Model S to back them up right now, they'd be laughed off the stage with the Model 3.

 

[ModelNforNerd]

There is no other car out there that meets my expectations. They were simple. I wanted an affordable EV in an ICE package. By "ICE package" I mean not a weirdmobile.

If you stripped all the bells and whistles off the Model S, that would be the car I was looking for. Basically the Model 3 with proper displays. And don't you tell me that extra screen is what adds $35k to the base price. Maybe a little less weirdness with the body design too.

I was hoping to find the same in the Model 3, because Tesla's mission is supposed to be compelling EVs. The mission is now autonomous driving.

All EVs are strange right now, and Tesla was supposed to change that. Instead, they just added another weird EV to the mix, meaning still only the rich can afford to drive a normal-looking/functioning EV. If Tesla didn't have the legacy of the Model S to back them up right now, they'd be laughed off the stage with the Model 3.

At this point, it's tough to have any meaningful, constructive conversation, because your replies all conjure one image in my head:

 

[Sonny Daze]

I was hoping to find the same in the Model 3, because Tesla's mission is supposed to be compelling EVs. The mission is now autonomous driving.

The 3 got caught up in the transition from the Secret Master Plan to the Master Plan Part Deux before the Secret Master Plan was completed. Some may think that's great, others... not so much.

 

[eisbock]

Every car displays speed. Not every car does has the speed directly in front of the driver.

Historically cars did not have a large LCD touchscreen display in the middle. So it made sense that manufacturers, choosing where to put the driving displays put it in front of the driver.

But now the large central touchscreen LCD gives a manufacturer another option. Given increasing self-driving capability, which will continue to de-emphasize the speedometer, is it really that surprising that Tesla has chosen to take advantage of the central display to lower cost (less hardware, less wiring, less assembly labor, less assembly time) and clean up the dash?

I'll see how easily I can glance at the speed on the display without moving my head. As long as I can do that, I'll be satisfied.

This is so frustrating. The first generation of Model 3 will not see full autonomy in its lifetime. I don't have facts or sources, but rather common sense by viewing current progress in self-driving technology as well as regulations and laws and the time they require to implement.

Model S cannot drive more than 30 miles on the highway right now in sunny California. The hurdles with self-driving are enormous and many people are far too optimistic, including Elon Musk. He said we'll have full autonomy by the end of 2017. The latest AP update just now allows highway speed driving. Does anybody believe we'll have level 5 in six months? Full autonomy is always 2 years away. It'll be 2 years away when my Model 3 is 10 years old, and I'll have suffered through 10 years of a sub-optimal driving experience because the car was supposed to drive itself.

For at least the first gen of Model 3, it will be the car that was designed to be autonomous, but can only be piloted manually and could ruin Tesla.

 

[eisbock]

At this point, it's tough to have any meaningful, constructive conversation, because your replies all conjure one image in my head:

View attachment 221171

I just want a normal EV... is that really so much to ask?!

 

[stopcrazypp]

Well, two words come to my mind. They are: second reveal. For some reason that will eventually become clear, Tesla came through with the first and neglected the second.
Robin

It has been said a couple of times, but the second reveal was the self driving hardware announcement. It just wasn't what some wanted to hear and they have been in various stages of denial (same with a bunch of different issues, like the HUD/screen, hatchback, battery sizes).

 

[ModelNforNerd]

I just want a normal EV... is that really so much to ask?!

You want an EV that looks like a normal (ICE) car.

That's the problem with being in our era of ever-evolving technology.

Once an OEM moves on from something (or in Tesla's case, never made a car that way in the first place), they're not going to go back to cater to a shrinking or non-existent customer base.

You don't find many TVs with knobs or built-in rabbit ears these days, do you?

How about home phones that have answering machines built in.....degree of difficulty....answering machines with TAPE....??

There are still plenty of ICE vehicles out there you can buy. But while you're bemoaning wanting a "normal" EV, you yourself even noted:

All EVs are strange right now

So why are you even bothering to look? Clearly this isn't your moment in time to be looking at EVs. Move along. Your blood pressure will thank you.

 

[Skotty]

All they need to do is trash that horrific looking 2 spoke steering wheel and put in a nice one and all will be chill.