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Do you think there will be a "luxury" Model X in the future?

swon

Member
Aug 1, 2013
66
16
New England
You're right, I only looked at it once. I must have assumed it was for ride. Although i must tell you the ride feels fine to me. How is it that people think the ride needs to improve? Is it too responsive, or perhaps the opposite of soft? If that's the case then I can see why my opinion would be different, since I come from driving a truck-based SUV. I like a firm ride and tight steering. When I first purchased my Yukon XL, I tried the Denali version and didn't like it because steering and suspension felt too loose.

I was actually surprised at the ride in the X (this was my first, and to date, only test-drive in an X)...I had read a lot of criticism of it online, but I liked it. But then, I like a bit of a stiffer ride & tighter steering response myself. And I did find the ride to be better than the S.
 

swon

Member
Aug 1, 2013
66
16
New England
Don't expect major improvements to the Tesla interior until they have real competition, which should be in about 2 or 3 years when the Germans hit the long range electric segment. Tesla is missing many simple comfort items (did you notice no coat hooks or hand-holds?) that they could easily incorporate, I think they just don't care or want to bother with them. But when people have a real choice from other companies with a good charging infrastructure, they will need to improve, or buyers will just drift away.

Teslas are as or more expensive than the luxury brands because of the power train and batteries, not because of luxury appointments. And I'm fine with that. It's just that there are many things that could easily be improved without adding much cost or complexity, and that's what's frustration.

About being spoiled by driving the top-of-the-line P100D, I would seriously suggest driving the non-P model. I think you'll find that 0-60 in 4.8 seconds will nail you to your seat back pretty impressively. Other than the retracting spoiler and the acceleration, I don't think there's any other difference between the two.

That makes a lot of sense, actually. I think they are focusing more on getting the products out the door than filling out every single feature checklist box right now. And having actually be in an X physically, I think I would be pretty happy in one regardless of the shortcomings that I'd like to see incorporated in a future version.

What's interesting is for the price difference of the Performance version of the X, I could buy a 238-mile Chevy Bolt as a backup vehicle in case the Tesla ends up in a bodyshop for awhile or I have to wait on a replacement tire or something. The performance draw is appealing, but as a daily driver, I think I would be just fine with the non-P version.
 
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swon

Member
Aug 1, 2013
66
16
New England
Regarding the driving comfort comment, you have the choice of 'Soft', 'Standard' or 'Sport'. Was the 'Soft' setting not enough?

It looks like I overlooked this feature, is this for ride adjustment, not steering control? Thanks for the pointer, I didn't realize it offered that if so!
 

swon

Member
Aug 1, 2013
66
16
New England
Ride quality in the X, seat comfort and sound deadening are the only real punch list items left to solve. The rest is nit picking.

I've seen complaints about sound deadening in a lot of Youtube video reviews, although it didn't bother me at all. Certainly not as quiet as certain other cars, but no louder than any regular modern car with a quiet gas engine in terms of road noise. I do agree that most of the list is nit-picking, however. Although for the price, again, I wouldn't mind having more luxury-oriented items available to choose from. Again, realizing that Tesla markets their cars as performance cars, hence the title of the thread. I would much rather sink $20k+ into fit & finish features than into the P model if they were offered, personally.
 

FarmerDave

Supporting Member
Supporting Member
Sep 3, 2015
547
313
Central PA
Hah!

On a tangent, what is the proper etiquette when charging an EV? Do you have to wait until the person comes out of the local store or whatever for them to unplug the charger from their car? I'd imagine that touching someone else's charging flap & removing the public cord is grounds for some sort of lawsuit.
IDK about other brands, but the charging plug on a Tesla can't be removed unless the key fob is in close proximity (Bluetooth LE range).

The owner gets a text message on their smartphone when charging is nearly complete, so they know it's time to move the car.
 
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ShannonMac

Member
Mar 6, 2017
7
6
New Mexico
I've been reading that the large windshield on the X can cause a lot of heat to come into the cabin while driving.
I've had my Model X for a little over a month. I haven't experienced 100+-degrees day yet in the car, but we have had some 80+-degree days already. The heat coming through the large front windshield is significantly less that what comes in through the (currently untinted) side windows, and also significantly less than what comes in through my husband's Lexus front windshield. The big windshield does have special coatings to mitigate the heat issue. Since we live in the desert and I'm heat-sensitive, I was very concerned about potential heat issue with the giant windshield, but so far it's been just fine. It won't really be tested until we get over 110-degree bright summer days, though. (I will be getting those side windows tinted ASAP!)
 

Jrogville

Member
Dec 7, 2016
661
258
High Springs, Florida
I've been reading that the large windshield on the X can cause a lot of heat to come into the cabin while driving.
I don't know if they're treating the big windshield like they did the pano roof on the Model S, but I've been surprised at how little heat gets through it. While we haven't had the hottest days here in Florida yet, the sun has been pretty strong. And I've driven quite a bit with the sun directly overhead. It hasn't been uncomfortable at all.
 

rush6410

Member
Sep 26, 2016
644
653
Montgomery TX
I have not experienced heat issues with the large windshield. In fact, I have noticed a significant reduction in heat with my car parked sitting in full sun at 90 degree outside temp. All previous vehicles I have owned, the temp inside would hit 140 easily. In my X, 105 degrees is the max it has hit.
 

Jrogville

Member
Dec 7, 2016
661
258
High Springs, Florida
I have not experienced heat issues with the large windshield. In fact, I have noticed a significant reduction in heat with my car parked sitting in full sun at 90 degree outside temp. All previous vehicles I have owned, the temp inside would hit 140 easily. In my X, 105 degrees is the max it has hit.
Is that without the Cabin Overheat Protection turned on?
 

mal_tsla

Member
Sep 29, 2016
698
941
Austin, TX
I have not experienced heat issues with the large windshield. In fact, I have noticed a significant reduction in heat with my car parked sitting in full sun at 90 degree outside temp. All previous vehicles I have owned, the temp inside would hit 140 easily. In my X, 105 degrees is the max it has hit.

Your X interior temperature maxes out at 105 degrees because the car actively ensures that. It ventilates with outside air or runs the AC, as-needed, so long as Cabin Overheat is enabled and the battery is >20% charged. This is the default setting. You can turn it off, but I would leave it on.

FWIW before Cabin Overheat existed, our X was easily >130F inside in the hot sun.
 

PedanticOne

MyTesla Refresh Champion
Supporting Member
Nov 13, 2016
443
315
Bay Area, CA
I don't get the S80 comparison at all. I had one given to me as a loaner the other week and thought, "oh this will be nice". It was instead one of the crappiest cars I've ever driven. I far prefer the interior of my X, and love the simplicity of the dash, as opposed to the 9 million buttons all on the center console and a rear view camera that has the worst fisheye I've ever seen in the S80. This is luxury? Meh. Keep it.
 

ccutrer

Active Member
Sep 3, 2015
1,348
1,245
Eagle Mountain, UT
1. Ventilated Seats. I have them. They're loud and annoying. And they definitely don't keep you cold. But they do prevent you from sweating. So I guess they do their job. My wife loves them. It certainly seems like they could have been implemented better, though, and hopefully that's why they're MIA at the moment - going through design improvements.
2. Seat comfort. I think the seats are fairly comfortable, especially in ultra white. I could definitely see something more luxurious being more comfortable, though. I think we need to change our wording though for this whole thread. The X is definitely luxurious. It's just not opulent.
3. Shifter. Huh? I love the simplicity of the shifter in a Tesla. Small, simple, easy to use. It's a simple flick, not like a minivan at all where you have to pull a large awkward stick towards you and then down. Oh, and don't worry about putting it back into part most times. When you press the brake, the car goes into vehicle Hold, and won't move. Then unbuckle and get out - it'll put itself into park automatically (actually any time it doesn't have 2 out of 3 of seat buckled, seat occupied, and door closed, it'll automatically put itself into park. That bit my wife once when she lifted her butt of the seat to look backwards, and hadn't buckled yet). And yes, it's the exact same part as in a Mercedes.
4. No 360º top-down view. In theory it sounds nice. And I'm sure if Tesla were to implement it, it'd be great. My comparison is my Nissan Leaf that has it. And my conclusion is that I far prefer my Model X with 360º ultrasonics that show me exact distances on a giant touchscreen, than the top-down view from average cameras on a tiny touchscreen with terrible contrast. But as stated elsewhere, I think Tesla is focusing more on autonomy than improving these sorts of driving experience.
5. Lack of DVR. Definitely! Especially in AP 2.0 cars with lots more cameras. Just remember that only the rear camera is HD and full color. the AP cameras are more grayscale or something. (Another reason you can't use AP 2.0 cameras to implement a 360º view).
6. Driving comfort. I'm pretty sure this just depends on what you're coming from, and what your expectations are. I love how our X rides, but I don't have much experience with high end suspensions. Honestly I think a lot of the ride comfort comes from the smoothness of accelerating and braking.

1. Free supercharging. Meh. I have free supercharging, and I actually use it (as in more than 400kWh annually -- I'm up to 16k miles in 10 months, with several 1k mile road trips). But it's all psychological. If I could have dropped the price of the car $5,000 and paid-as-I-went, I totally would. Tesla's rates are surprisingly competitive. And really the important thing is the experience - you drive you, plug in, and it charges. No futzing about with a touchscreen to activate it, oh crap nevermind I have to use an app on my phone for this one (yes, I'm serious, this is the DCFC experience in my Leaf), figure out how to pay, etc. Credit card on file associated to your car maintains this experience. Other networks need to simplify too -- just accept NFC payments at competitive rates, and screw all this complicated signing-up-ahead-of-time-for-this-network business.
2. Falcon-wing doors. LOVE them! Very very functional, and besides an initial calibration at the service center due my car being an earlier build, they've worked flawlessly. Even the one that has had a run-in with an F-150 (see the Safety point below). But they are definitely showy. We've just kind of learned to tune out all the stares. And if you live in a more Tesla-dense area, it's probably not as bad. They're definitely not slower or worse than electric minivan doors.
3. Giant Screen. LOVE it. We always keep the read camera up while we're driving (why don't other cars let you do this!?). And the UI is definitely far better than any other car I've been in. And keep in mind the UI is well designed to allow many operations without looking by placing key controls at corners or around edges. There are times that I wish some key features could always be accessible (but understand why they can't, and am totally willing to compromise on them in order to get the other benefits of the simplicity and ease of the touchscreen) is door and interior light controls. My other experiences are with an Audis and Mercedes that I've had rentals of. And they're so damned complicated, even with big LCD displays, that I just end up not listening to anything and if I'm lucky I'll find the temperature controls.
4. Having never experience a HUD, I don't know what I'm missing. On the flip side, the fully digital IC is far better than any other car I've been in. I'm sure a HUD would be a nice evolution of the IC, but again, dunno if Tesla will head that way.
5. Keyfob size. Meh. It seems about the same as other keyfobs. Maybe a little bit bigger. But I never ever ever have to take it out of my pocket, and it does fit in my pocket, so I don't care. I'll definitely admit unlocking and locking isn't immediately apparent. But once you've figure out that double tap opens things, I love that I don't have to look at it in my pocket to open any particular door/frunk/trunk (though I do wish I could individually close things, instead of all at once. Oh, and open the passenger door without opening the driver's door first. But at least I can open it at all now).
6. Spare tire. Meh. Again, colored by my own experience. I've never had a flat in my life. Though about a month after we got our X we got a low tire pressure, and I had to keep topping off one tire for about a month until I actually got it looked at and replaced because it had a nail in it, right at some seam that they couldn't repair it. Talk about bad luck. But as others have said, this is getting more and more common with modern cars.

1. Ludicrous mode. I have a 90D, with 0-60 in 4.8s. I definitely wouldn't accept less from a 75D now! I've had a Model S P85D loaner, and can definitely feel the difference. My X pins you to your seat. A PxxD(L) knocks the wind out of you. Sometimes I find myself wishing I had a bit more in my X, especially when I'm punching it at higher speeds to pass someone. Do you need Ludicrous? Definitely not. Will you enjoy it? Probably. Is it worth the cost? Up to you. It's definitely a very expensive feature for essentially a party trick. Can you part with $30k for something that you'll "need" once a month? I couldn't. When I upgrade my Leaf to a Model 3, I'll be paying very close attention to these performance numbers and prices. It'll be a close call.
2. Safety. You hear lots about this. Besides what Tesla tells you, I feel like they have a long ways to go with active safety features. In particular, why isn't AEB active when you're not in TACC? Blind spot detection (at least in my AP 1.0 car) is definitely subpar compared to similar vintage vehicles. The amazing rear camera that I have on all the time makes up for that somewhat. And I'm hoping AP 2.0 cars are much better in this regard, given better ultrasonics, and hopefully they do/will make use of the rear-face side cameras for this purpose as well. Oh, and AEB with 8.0 is amazing - that it can bounce the radar below the car in front of you so that your car will stop even if they rear-end the car in front of them. This is one of Tesla's best features - not just that it does the radar thing, but that this significant feature was added in a free software update, and my car that had already been built and delivered before the feature was conceived got it. Another aspect of safety is traction control. This last winter, I felt the safest I ever had, regardless of weather and road conditions. The car is heavy, low, and torquey. The reaction time is instant. It's almost impossible to lose traction. It happened only once, for a split second, and a very large smooth sheet of black ice. And final aspect - yes, I got hit. Two left turn lanes, I was in the right lane. The light turned green and the guy next to me tried to go straight... right through me. He was in a large F-150, and my Model X definitely "won". A small dent in the FWD, some scrapes on the rear quarter panel and the wheel. The other guy blew out his tire, nearly ripped his bumper off, and had more damage further down the side. Well... until the repair bill comes through. His insurance will sure know who "lost" then. Anyhow, the moral is I was in a medium speed collision (15-25mph), and I felt completely safe.
3. AutoPilot. Yup. Wish I had AP 2.0 where it can get even better. But I love what I have, and don't regret getting it 6-8 months sooner for an instant.
 
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ccutrer

Active Member
Sep 3, 2015
1,348
1,245
Eagle Mountain, UT
Hah!

On a tangent, what is the proper etiquette when charging an EV? Do you have to wait until the person comes out of the local store or whatever for them to unplug the charger from their car? I'd imagine that touching someone else's charging flap & removing the public cord is grounds for some sort of lawsuit.
You can't remove the charge cord from a Tesla without the car being unlocked. If you're using an adapter (such as the J1772 adapter for public charging), the J1772 can be removed, but the adapter can't be stolen. I'm pretty sure the Chademo adapter locks to its cord as well.

On my Leaf, the car has settings for if the charger locks to the car. It's either never, always, or automatic (unlocks when charging completes). I presume Chademo on the Leaf behaves as automatic when you have it set to unlocked, since it's dangerous to hard-interrupt a DCFC session.
 

ccutrer

Active Member
Sep 3, 2015
1,348
1,245
Eagle Mountain, UT
Oh yes, things I would change about my X:

* The double vision issue. It's not a deal breaker, but it seems fairly petty how Tesla is handling it.
* CarPlay/Android Auto support.
* A few minor nits about the media player. But these are things they're able to change over time with software updates (and have improved, somewhat, since I got the vehicle).
* Yeah, I think that's about it, besides wishing I had a 100D, AP 2.0, and possibly that I could blow the money on P/L without guilt.

The rear entertainment thing isn't a huge deal. It really bugs my wife, but we just let each row (we have 4 kids) borrow one iPad (mine, and an old one). We use a hair elastic to hang it over a headrest. Honestly I like it better this way. And I don't have to worry about physically packing DVDs (just have to remember to download a few movies ahead of time). And the UI and general purpose use of a tablet is far far better than any media system Tesla could possibly make, even with their better reputation of software updates.
 

rush6410

Member
Sep 26, 2016
644
653
Montgomery TX
Your X interior temperature maxes out at 105 degrees because the car actively ensures that. It ventilates with outside air or runs the AC, as-needed, so long as Cabin Overheat is enabled and the battery is >20% charged. This is the default setting. You can turn it off, but I would leave it on.

FWIW before Cabin Overheat existed, our X was easily >130F inside in the hot sun.
I forgot about that feature and it totally nullifies my point when parked. To make a different but similar point, in 90+ degree driving days with the sun directly overhead, I do not feel the heat or even am aware of the sun directly over head. This was a big concern of mine at purchase. I have had no issues with it being noticeably hot. My wife almost saw that as a deal breaker before purchase. I assured her the windshield screen would resolve the issue. She has not complained once with out the screen. I few times while driving I pointed out to her that the sun was directly overhead and she was completely unaware. So, I would say the tint on the windshield satisfied our concern.
 

Jrogville

Member
Dec 7, 2016
661
258
High Springs, Florida
I forgot about that feature and it totally nullifies my point when parked. To make a different but similar point, in 90+ degree driving days with the sun directly overhead, I do not feel the heat or even am aware of the sun directly over head. This was a big concern of mine at purchase. I have had no issues with it being noticeably hot. My wife almost saw that as a deal breaker before purchase. I assured her the windshield screen would resolve the issue. She has not complained once with out the screen. I few times while driving I pointed out to her that the sun was directly overhead and she was completely unaware. So, I would say the tint on the windshield satisfied our concern.
I second that about the effectiveness of the factory provided tinting. Before I got my Model S with the pano roof, I speculated that I would need to buy the shades for those panels, but I after I started driving the car, I found that the sun has no appreciable effect. I have never felt the need for additional tinting. The A/C can sometimes be underwhelming, but the heat I feel isn't coming from above.

I wonder if the people that apply all that after-market tinting have actually trying driving the car as is before they had the tinting applied?
 

Blastphemy

Member
Jan 11, 2012
644
303
Los Angeles, CA
Then it wouldn't be a Tesla.
And why would that be a problem? Pretty soon there are going to be a lot of BEV competitors from experienced luxury car manufacturers, and if Tesla doesn't step up its game, then Audi and others will keep its own customers and probably add quite a few Tesla owners too who have been waiting for the complete package.
 

vandacca

ReActive Member
Oct 13, 2014
3,371
2,248
Hamilton
And why would that be a problem? Pretty soon there are going to be a lot of BEV competitors from experienced luxury car manufacturers, and if Tesla doesn't step up its game, then Audi and others will keep its own customers and probably add quite a few Tesla owners too who have been waiting for the complete package.
I used to think that way (big automakers will soon come out with BEV) in the late 90s. Pretty soon that decades-long promise may finally come true. But I assume it's going to be hard for those experienced luxury car manufacturers to focus on a disruptive vehicle that will harm their existing lucrative ICE business.

But if/when they do, Tesla may have access to cheaper and better batteries than the rest of the industry (price advantage). Not to mention the SuperCharger infrastructure. They might as well focus on building city cars if they don't have access to a SuperCharger-like network. Not to mention that Tesla's BEV drive-train has at least a 5-year head start on an industry that innovates as fast as molasses.

In other words, I'm at the point now where I'll believe it when I see it.
 
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mal_tsla

Member
Sep 29, 2016
698
941
Austin, TX
The sun through the windshield on our X is obviously hot. We can both feel it on our torso and the dash is clearly warm to the touch when the sun is overhead.

We added tint to the windshield (mostly heat blocking but not dark) and it helps a bit but still the heat can be felt.

Maybe the heat is more severe down in Texas
 

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