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I am a new Tesla driver, about 3 weeks. I started with creep mode on because it was what I was used to with ICE cars. I just turned it off, and suspect I will leave it off. This requires a bit of learning, or maybe more precisely “un-learning”, but it seems to me that it is better and safer to get used to the car not moving by itself. The creep mode seems to be emulating a behavior of ICE vehicles that was unwanted but unavoidable. We got used to that behavior and made ourselves believe it was just the way vehicles oughta work. So having “creep mode” is sort of like having “training wheels” to ease the transition from ICE to EV. Once you get used to it, you discard the training wheels and you are better off.
Of course one can come up with a hypothetical situation in which it would have been better for the car to move on its own. But I fail to see how this changes the overwhelming safety advantage of not moving by itself for the other 99.99%j of situations.
I also don’t understand the claim that there is any situation where creep mode ON will keep the car from moving when you hit the accelerator. If depressing the accelerator will move the car forward with creep mode off, it will move the car forward in the same situation with creep mode is on, period, end of story. Or am I missing something?
Of course one can come up with a hypothetical situation in which it would have been better for the car to move on its own. But I fail to see how this changes the overwhelming safety advantage of not moving by itself for the other 99.99%j of situations.
I also don’t understand the claim that there is any situation where creep mode ON will keep the car from moving when you hit the accelerator. If depressing the accelerator will move the car forward with creep mode off, it will move the car forward in the same situation with creep mode is on, period, end of story. Or am I missing something?
Nerdy_Engineer
Brett - The Nerdy Engineer
I think the benefit of leaving creep mode on, is that you can creep into or out of parking spaces. I think creep mode on makes it easier to perform low speed precision movements. Whenever I park in a tight space, or I'm trying to pull close to a wall, I'll let the car creep and I'll just apply the brakes. I don't have to hit the accelerator to move the car and potentially accelerate too fast and hit an object. I'd be curious to know how many of the 'unintended acceleration' accidents where people claimed the car accelerated on its own while parking had creep mode on vs off.
JeffK
Well-Known Member
You can be sure this number is nearly 100% creep on before Tesla. You're talking thousands of incidents in automatic ICEs.
I'd argue that with creep off there's no such thing as unintended acceleration because if you find yourself accelerating at all (besides rolling downhill) then you're hitting the accelerator.
JeffK
Well-Known Member
You mean besides sudden unintended acceleration, or in stop and go traffic.
Teslas are at least smart enough to park themselves if you leave the driver's seat, but in automatics if you leave it in gear and get out it's going to drive away.
Here's a new thought. Say your 3's display is broken or frozen. How do you know what gear you’re in? An experienced and attentive Tesla driver can deal with it regardless of creep on or off. But how about if you loaned your Tesla to your friend or family member and he or she has limited experience with Tesla? You really want him or her pressing the accelerator to move out of a parking spot? Remember that in panic situations the reflex action is to push harder on the pedal (whichever pedal the foot happens to be on).
JeffK
Well-Known Member
Easy don't guess, put your foot on the brake, press the park button, and switch to the desired gear.
That reflex action you're describing is a learned behavior from years of using the brake pedal with creep.
If the single display is broken or frozen in a Model 3, the car is not drivable. Contact support. The Model X has dual displays.
IMO, Creep mode is neither more or less safe, it has no effect on safety. I find it annoying, so I turn it off.
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Fellsteruk
Active Member
My screen blanks quite frequently prior to driving while the car reboots. I have creep on. If I put the car in gear while the screen is blank, creep is off while the screen boots. So having creep on in your scenario doesn’t work as it just gets disabled while the screen is off.
pvogel
Member
Let me put it another way: You are stopped at a light and creep mode is on. You pass out (or are distracted) and your foot lets up on the brake, what's going to happen? You are going to rear-end the car in front of you (best case scenario) or creep into T-bone territory.
I'll keep Creep off, thank you very much!
There are no reports of that ever happening but there are plenty of reports of unintended acceleration in parking lots. But hey, it’s your choice. They made it an option so people are free to do as they please.
cantdecide
Member
Given that 90% of cars have creep mode on can you find me examples of this actually happening? All the unintended acceleration in ICE cars that cause death to my knowledge are wrong pedal instances.
In creep cars you reduce pressure on the brake for some reason, your body senses movement as the car starts moving quickly, you reapply the brake which your foot hasn't left, so you won't accidentally hit the wrong pedal.
In the same situation in a manual transmission car in neutral the driver takes longer to notice (acceleration more gradual) and might fully release the brake, but probably goes about the same distance or slightly less before reapplying the brake. Except 0.1% of the time they hit the wrong pedal, hear the engine spin up while the car continues to go slowly, then moves foot to brake. This is slightly worse than the creep car (delay with wrong pedal potential), but not by much.
In the same situation in a Tesla without creep the situation is the same as the manual transmission car. Except the 0.1% of the time the user hits the wrong pedal and rapidly accelerates into the intersection. This is bad.
In ICE cars unintended acceleration is dangerous and happens because drivers hit the wrong pedal. This happens particularly for young drivers, old drivers, and drivers of unfamiliar cars.
Having no creep introduces a new method to this... user selects the wrong gear. For an inexperienced Tesla driver there just isn't the appropriate feedback while releasing the brake of what gear the car is in.
We know an Au Pair who totalled their family Tesla through unintended acceleration (wrong gear). That is why we make our Au Pairs have creep on when driving a Tesla. For ourselves we aren't in the high risk group and we are used to non-creep so we keep creep off for us.
In parking lot situations, especially the first moment or two of movement...
Creep Off - your foot is “riding” the accelerator. If you panic and stomp down on the pedal, you crash.
Creep On - your foot is “riding” the brake pedal. If you panic and stomp down on the pedal, you stop.
By panic, I mean any momentary confusion such as when you thought you engaged drive but in fact you engaged reverse or vice versa. When you perform an action and the desired or expected result doesn’t happen, it’s normal human behavior to try again (and try harder). With creep off, if you push the accelerator pedal and the car doesn’t move or moves the wrong way, there’s a strong possibility that you might try pushing harder. Of course as you get more experienced with a Tesla you’re more likely to check what gear you’re in or know what the correct amount of pressure is to initiate movement, but the whole point of this thread is to address the mass market, new owner experience. Creep off is a really cool feature and totally makes sense for an EV. But I would advise all new owners to start with creep on. Again, I wouldn’t have even brought this up if it weren’t for the weekly “my wife who’s been driving 30 years and never lied in her life was in the parking lot and she swears her Tesla accelerated into the wall on its own, has anyone experienced that? Should we sue Tesla?” posts here and on Facebook.
Creep Off - your foot is “riding” the accelerator. If you panic and stomp down on the pedal, you crash.
Creep On - your foot is “riding” the brake pedal. If you panic and stomp down on the pedal, you stop.
By panic, I mean any momentary confusion such as when you thought you engaged drive but in fact you engaged reverse or vice versa. When you perform an action and the desired or expected result doesn’t happen, it’s normal human behavior to try again (and try harder). With creep off, if you push the accelerator pedal and the car doesn’t move or moves the wrong way, there’s a strong possibility that you might try pushing harder. Of course as you get more experienced with a Tesla you’re more likely to check what gear you’re in or know what the correct amount of pressure is to initiate movement, but the whole point of this thread is to address the mass market, new owner experience. Creep off is a really cool feature and totally makes sense for an EV. But I would advise all new owners to start with creep on. Again, I wouldn’t have even brought this up if it weren’t for the weekly “my wife who’s been driving 30 years and never lied in her life was in the parking lot and she swears her Tesla accelerated into the wall on its own, has anyone experienced that? Should we sue Tesla?” posts here and on Facebook.
JeffK
Well-Known Member
Totally disagree.
The pressing harder is a direct result of experience with having creep in an automatic ICE. You press harder because it will brake more.
Creep On - your foot is “riding” the brake pedal (or so you think). If you panic and stomp down on the pedal, you run into a building.
Pedal misapplication is the number one cause of sudden unintended acceleration. With creep off, if I'm trying to go slow and I hit the wrong pedal I stop.
JeffK
Well-Known Member
and yet it happens all the time in automatic ICEs. There are two main situations, one is when the vehicle is already in drive and the driver is coming into a parking spot very slowly, and another is just after putting it into drive sometimes people adjust their foot and don't realize they are covering the accelerator.
This actually happened to me twice in an ICE, I wasn't wearing the same footwear that I normally do and I was half outside the car with the door open just trying to move it up a few feet. I put it into gear and the car wasn't moving yet I adjusted my foot and the car suddenly started creeping forward (after a delay), I was startled and slammed the accelerator. Luckily the car didn't go through a wall or anything.
I agree with that but I think it’s even more likely or common that they don’t adjust their foot, and in panic or confusion they stomp on the pedal they intended to have their foot on. With creep on, your foot is necessarily already on the same brake pedal that you must press to turn on the car and to allow the car to shift into gear.
For the other scenario you described (driving slowly into a parking spot), I agree that creep off may be theoretically safer or at least equal.
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