Elon Musk vs. Short sellers

[Boomer19]

It coincidences with her move to Bloomberg from the Mercury News. While at Mercury she was definitely more balanced, one might even say slightly 'pro Tesla/EM. The switch to Bloomberg would be considered a move up for a journalist I suspect but IMO Bloomberg wanted more 'clicks' from her articles resulting in a bias towards negative/click bait articles concerning Tesla.

Her pay has probably increased with the move, and, IMO, her objectivity has decreased substantially.

i thought it coincided with the jurvetson scandal, and how draper fisher dropped him but tesla board kept him. pure speculation, but would explain (especially if she had inside scoop on SJ, and it was bad news).
...improbable though
more likely just for clicks

 

[Todd Burch]

It coincidences with her move to Bloomberg from the Mercury News. While at Mercury she was definitely more balanced, one might even say slightly 'pro Tesla/EM. The switch to Bloomberg would be considered a move up for a journalist I suspect but IMO Bloomberg wanted more 'clicks' from her articles resulting in a bias towards negative/click bait articles concerning Tesla.

Her pay has probably increased with the move, and, IMO, her objectivity has decreased substantially.

Ah, good call. I'd forgotten that she moved from Mercury News. That explains it, and goes to show how a journalist's objectivity changes based on that journalist's employer.

Wow, I used to have a positive view of journalism in general. This stuff has really soured me on that. I have to keep remembering not to stereotype--there are good journalists and bad journalists. Tesla just tends to involve more of the latter.

 

[Electroman]

The last one standing, IMO, is Phil LeBeau from CNBC. just facts and no drama.

But I guess it’s only a matter of time. When Tesla starts ramping up, more news outfits and journalists will be bought or coerced. It’s hard to resist the allure of money or the threat of losing sponsorship

The question is when someone dangles a few million in front of Lambert, what would Fred do? -

 

[Foghat]

Question to experts here: If stealing IP information is felony, and if selling that to a third party is also a felony, what about the recipient of that information that profits from it?

Will this slimeball Lopez be behind bars too?

What is the implication to the outfit, Business Insider, that knowingly published articles based on stolen and false information?

Do journalist get a pass on anything just because they supposedly represent the press?

And more importantly because she is a woman, can she play the woman card and turn it into a harassment case against Tesla. This one is not a joke, it is happening already in twitter circles.

If she passively received it, then she’s in the clear. However if she asked for him to do it or put an offer out for someone to get her tesla Insider information, then she could be in legal jeopardy.

 

[Electroman]

If she passively received it, then she’s in the clear.

If someone told me that they stole a piece of jewelry and sold it me and I knowingly buy it - can I go scott free? I guess not.

If a piece of jewelry has that much of protection, a company's IP or internal information on which tens of thousands of families livelihood depends on, somehow doesn't have that status?

Someone is stealing it, only because someone is willing to buy it. It is the same argument that goes with drug peddlers selling to drug addicts.

 

[Foghat]

If someone told me that they stole a piece of jewelry and sold it me and I knowingly buy it - can I go scott free? I guess not.

If a piece of jewelry has that much of protection, a company's IP or internal information on which tens of thousands of families livelihood depends on, somehow doesn't have that status?

Someone is stealing it, only because someone is willing to buy it. It is the same argument that goes with drug peddlers selling to drug addicts.

I understand where you are coming from, but it differs in journalism. If the information came from a source voluntarily, she’s reporting that information. But if she’s paying someone to get it, she is a conspirator in theft.

You can reference the Panama papers, the pentagon papers, the Snowden papers, etc... all were “confidential property” of others. However, the reporter wasn’t part of the operation, just the one who relayed it to the world.

 

[Electroman]

However, the reporter wasn’t part of the operation, just the one who relayed it to the world.

In fact it is the 2nd part - not the theft, but the dissemination part - is the one that does the damage.

If I rig a camera and shoot a clandestine video in someones bedroom and gave it to a reporter for free, can he publish it?

But if she’s paying someone to get it

As long as money doesn't change hands 'explicitly' everything is well and good?

In this case Tripp wanted his revenge and he got it. That is his payback for giving the stolen material to Lopez. So he benefited. The scumbag reporter benefited with all the attention and limelight. Sure might have got some promotion too.

In a lot of situations, there are far powerful intangible benefits than money changing hands.

 

[Foghat]

In fact it is the 2nd part - not the theft, but the dissemination part - is the one that does the damage.

If I rig a camera and shoot a clandestine video in someones bedroom and gave it to a reporter for free, can he publish it?



As long as money doesn't change hands 'explicitly' everything is well and good?

In this case Tripp wanted his revenge and he got it. That is his payback for giving the stolen material to Lopez. So he benefited. The scumbag reporter benefited with all the attention and limelight. Sure might have got some promotion too.

In a lot of situations, there are far powerful intangible benefits than money changing hands.

If you rig a camera and do that, you would be criminally liable. The reporter could turn you in, but has the choice to protect you as a “source.”

For example, Reality Winner leaked docs to the Intercept. However, the Intercept informed the government that she gave them the docs. She got arrested. The Intercept could’ve decided not to do that, but they did.

Tripp is not off the hook, he could be found liable for damages and potentially criminally if tesla decides to go that direction. This is why Tripp is looking for “whistle blower” protections, so tesla would be limited to what they can do him legally.

 

[lklundin]

i do remember seeing this, and i think you need to read the articles

According to the Solar Roof customer, the difference in price between the photovoltaic system and a traditional roof is substantial. Thus, he does not recommend the tiles for those who are financially-sensitive.


Also think about this:

The installation involved a surprising 20 people who worked on the Solar Roof for two weeks.


They dont dig in much more than this but I seem to remember the product revealed claimed to be cheaper than a regular roof once you account for energy savings. And the roof tiles only had 2% loss compared to regular solar tiles. All of this is fabrication, it is make believe. It is not real. It is a lie.


A grossly misrepresented product is the same as a fake product. Ask Elizabeth Holmes

I have some TSLA shares I would like to lend you, for a reasonable price.

 

[lklundin]

So how many degrees of separation between Jim Chanos and Martin Tripp? I'm guessing 2 or 3.

Tesla sues alleged saboteur engineer who also apparently leaked false reports to media

At most 1:

Linette Lopez, who brought the Business Insider "scoop" on the huge scrap waste at GF1, and who also proudly interviewed the Big, Short man, Jim Chanos.

 

[Boomer19]

At most 1:

Linette Lopez, who brought the Business Insider "scoop" on the huge scrap waste at GF1, and who also proudly interviewed the Big, Short man, Jim Chanos.

excellent call! i almost forgot about this:
there’s ~3 chanos posts here’s one
http://www.businessinsider.com/jim-chanos-interview-2018-2
and then she starts writing more about tesla. in march was one, then may, then obv a handful in june. (interesting her number of tesla bashing articles increases with the stock price, as the pressure mounts on chanos and his cronies)

 

[Gerardf]

Just been reading the court filing, and read about the lawyer Tesla hired.

Tesla for sure has proof, it would not risk not winning this case or even bringing things up in that filing without being able to prove them. And that lawyer is very well known, just read up on him yourself (see below) how big a name he is. Having such reputation he would never have taken this case if he was not convinced he would win it. I also think a lawyer of that standing would not have accepted this case if it was 'just' about some small frustrated guy sending some pictures and data to a magazine.

Based on this my guess is there could very well be much more to this.

https://www.hueston.com/attorney/john-c-hueston/
http://articles.latimes.com/2006/may/26/business/fi-prosecutor26

 

[RedOctober]

Just been reading the court filing, and read about the lawyer Tesla hired.

Tesla for sure has proof, it would not risk not winning this case or even bringing things up in that filing without being able to prove them. And that lawyer is very well known, just read up on him yourself (see below) how big a name he is. Having such reputation he would never have taken this case if he was not convinced he would win it. I also think a lawyer of that standing would not have accepted this case if it was 'just' about some small frustrated guy sending some pictures and data to a magazine.

Based on this my guess is there could very well be much more to this.

https://www.hueston.com/attorney/john-c-hueston/
http://articles.latimes.com/2006/may/26/business/fi-prosecutor26

Just read about him and he is one of the best. Elon must be pissed off and is getting tired of people trying to screw his company. I’m not sure what the financial gains will be here but people may think twice about trying to undermine one of his businesses.

 

[BozieBeMe2]

Just read about him and he is one of the best. Elon must be pissed off and is getting tired of people trying to screw his company. I’m not sure what the financial gains will be here but people may think twice about trying to undermine one of his businesses.

Elon may not have 'Started', Tesla, but he damned sure cared enough about Tesla to invest, basically, everything he had to make Us, a fantastic car. I can't say the same for most of the ICE manufacturers.
From what I have seen of their level of involvement, Tesla doesn't go away from their level of care, just because you have already bought the car, so yes, I can see where Elon and Co is like a mama bear when it comes to someone messing with one of her cubs (Tesla)

 

[Reality]

I have some TSLA shares I would like to lend you, for a reasonable price.

you might already be doing that!

 

[lklundin]

you might already be doing that!

Or maybe the shares I just bought were shorted by you...

 

[dc_h]

I pledge $1000 and additional $250 every time Chanos gets on a show.



I'd suggest to buy advertisements to counter those FUD spreaders. Certainly can loan to Tesla for whatever use if there are more than needed for that.

How about a flash mob outside CNBC, with Tesla cars honking and model X doors flapping? We really need FSD for this.

 

[Foghat]

excellent call! i almost forgot about this:
there’s ~3 chanos posts here’s one
Jim Chanos on the return of choppy markets, Tesla, and the 'rent-seeking behavior' that's hurting our economy
and then she starts writing more about tesla. in march was one, then may, then obv a handful in june. (interesting her number of tesla bashing articles increases with the stock price, as the pressure mounts on chanos and his cronies)

Linette Lopez

Here are a few Lopez interviews of Chanos.

Looks like this is actually something to drill down on.

If Lopez theoretically worked for Chanos on this Tripp thing, then definitely a paper trail of some sort of financial payment thru some Chanos orbit entity.

Hypothetically, the advantage of going through Lopez as the middle person is that she can claim source protection and not be implicated in Tripp payments since that could be done thru someone else and she could be the “passive” receiver of the information.

Potentially, in theory, the Tesla insider information is extremely valuable and interested eyes would pay a pretty penny to swing the stock especially as the expected ramp is anticipated to be a success.

It would be fascinating to see if this hypothetical matches reality and if Elon’s message to “shorts” is aimed at Chanos, or potentially others that may be apart of this “operation.” Does Chanos even have a history of operating in such an “active” way in achieving investment objectives?

 

[Boomer19]

Does Chanos even have a history of operating in such an “active” way in achieving investment objectives?

YES!
from the original post in this forum, page 1, by jesse, a book excerpt. written by rolling stones matt taibbi. the divide.
excerpt:
https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/attachments/fairfax-pdf.310679/

while the book is over 400 pgs this excerpt is about 65. worth reading. i bought book and just started this week

absolutely despicable behavior in the excerpt linked above. it will change the way you look at these people. they are the scum of the earth. harassing a lady dying of cancer, also a church pastor, imposturing others to gain access to employees, even tricked the fbi.

 

[Foghat]

YES!
from the original post in this forum, page 1, by jesse, a book excerpt. written by rolling stones matt taibbi. the divide.
excerpt:
https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/attachments/fairfax-pdf.310679/

while the book is over 400 pgs this excerpt is about 65. worth reading. i bought book and just started this week

absolutely despicable behavior in the excerpt linked above. it will change the way you look at these people. they are the scum of the earth. harassing a lady dying of cancer, also a church pastor, imposturing others to gain access to employees, even tricked the fbi.

Example of reporter working with Chanos. Suggests it pays to be his partner.


The Catastrophe Capitalist

“Reporters, too, have a vested interest in cultivating short-selling sources. When a short-seller uncovers fraud, it often translates into the sort of epic story that can make a business reporter’s career. After Chanos tipped Bethany McLean, then at Fortune, to the problems at Enron, she landed a $1.4 million book deal and an Oscar-nominated documentary, and she recently was hired as a contributing editor at Vanity Fair. McLean and Nocera recently nabbed a reported seven-figure book deal chronicling the fall of Wall Street.”