I'd like to hear more about the moral and ethical responsibility towards future owners (or the lessor, as otherwise mentioned in this thread). I can't see any possible argument for this responsibility existing, but I'm certainly willing to listen to an alternative viewpoint. Please elaborate.
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For leased TM3P, always charge to full, right?
- Thread starter jesusbowls
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I'd like to hear more about the moral and ethical responsibility towards future owners (or the lessor, as otherwise mentioned in this thread). I can't see any possible argument for this responsibility existing, but I'm certainly willing to listen to an alternative viewpoint. Please elaborate.
Presumably you've read your lease agreement. I just re-read mine, and I think Tesla would have an impossible task trying to recoup any "damages" from the lessee as a result of constant full charging. There is NOTHING in the lease about charging practices, the the sections titled "Maintenance and Use" and "Excess Wear" do not appear to give them any leeway on this matter.
The lease agreement does not give Tesla any opportunity to charge the lessee more (upon lease return) based on charging practices.
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25. Excess Wear. The charge for excess wear will be our estimated or actual cost or repairing wear beyond that reasonably expected with ordinary, everyday use and maintenance according to this lease. It includes (i) parts, accessories and vehicle specifications present in or on the vehicle or provided at delivery being incomplete, modified or replaced with items of inferior quality or design; (ii) any tire with less than 1/8 inch of tread or not part of a matching set of four; (iii) dents, scratches, gouges or cracks in the vehicle's external parts, or glass; (iv) torn or burned interior parts or upholstery; (v) inoperative mechanical or electrical components; and (vi) any damage or neglect resulting from your failure to follow any maintenance schedules or recall advisories we or our affiliate may notify you of.
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Having read this, this actual makes me feel better about not the [un]likelihood of being charged for the odor in the car upon lease return (I smoke cigars in the car all the time, though admittedly I'm generally able to keep the car smelling pretty fresh).
Seems like Tesla left a lot of latitude for you to trash their property. Go for it. Maybe you lease or rent your residence as well. Imagine the possibilities.
Huh.
This is fascinating to me how someone wants it explained to them why there is ethical and moral responsibilities related to this situation. You have been proposing this and cannot understand why there would be anything wrong with it:
I'm going to abuse and mistreat and damage this car on purpose because it won't be any harm to me. It will be harm to someone else instead.
If you don't already understand as a human being why there is a problem with that, I'm not sure anyone can successful explain that to you.
ElectricIAC
Good-Natured Rascal
You can't buy the car at the end of a lease, so you're going to treat it like a rental and trash it. You're willingly harming the battery. Tesla clearly tells us not to do that.
I know there are douche Tesla owners, but I like to think we're all brothers and ambassadors for the cars. The used market is going to have a big impact on the company. You want people who can't afford to buy new to be very happy with their used purchase. If the battery degrades excessively they will spread that gospel like wildfire. Unless you're on a road trip it's unnecessary to charge to 100% anyway. So dumb.
Just don't be a douche man. It's simple.
I know there are douche Tesla owners, but I like to think we're all brothers and ambassadors for the cars. The used market is going to have a big impact on the company. You want people who can't afford to buy new to be very happy with their used purchase. If the battery degrades excessively they will spread that gospel like wildfire. Unless you're on a road trip it's unnecessary to charge to 100% anyway. So dumb.
Just don't be a douche man. It's simple.
I’ve read a lot of ridiculous posts on here.
OP, you’re cracking the top 5 with this one.
It ironic that someone with Jesus in their handle needs help understanding morality, and wants someone to explain why they should be a decent human being.
I doubt Jesus bowls, but he did say “love your neighbor as yourself (Mark 12:31). So, What Would Jesus Do? Would YOU want to purchase your car after lease? If not, that means you’re probably doing something wrong.
OP, you’re cracking the top 5 with this one.
It ironic that someone with Jesus in their handle needs help understanding morality, and wants someone to explain why they should be a decent human being.
I doubt Jesus bowls, but he did say “love your neighbor as yourself (Mark 12:31). So, What Would Jesus Do? Would YOU want to purchase your car after lease? If not, that means you’re probably doing something wrong.
Not true. I came to this thread thinking I should just charge to 100% all the time. Based on feedback, I'm now convinced I should charge to 90/95% max each time, unless heading out on a long road trip or if I otherwise expect to not have convenient access to a charting solution for a couple days. I am thankful to the community for the assistance, as always.
The mods have had to do cleanup because of other members (not me) violating the terms of conduct.
My motivation is not to intentionally damage the vehicle, but rather to operate it in a way that suits me best, within the confines of the lease contract.
My user name has nothing to do with the biblical character of Jesus.
No, I wouldn't want to purchase my (or any) EV off-lease, due to the untested long-term nature of these vehicles.
Here is the manual for the Model 3. The "Charging" section begins on page 142. I see warnings/cautions about not letting the battery discahrge to 0%, and I see suggestions about avoiding extreme ambient temperatures. There's also a note that charging may be limited to 80% at high-usage supercharger sites when not using Trip Planner. Unless I am just not reading this carefully enough, I do not see any suggestion in the manual about avoiding a full charge. I MIGHT BE WRONG HERE ABOUT THE MANUAL LANGUAGE, somebody please point out to me the relevant language if I am incorrect.
From what I see in the manual, I fail to see how a full charge constitutes "abuse and mistreat"[ment]. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
The car itself tells you this. If you charge over 90% for a few days in a row, it shows you a warning on the screen that doing this repeatedly is causing long term damage to the battery. If you ignore that warning, you are intentionally mistreating it and causing that damage on purpose. Q.E.D. Here is a thread about the warning message, which has been in all Tesla vehicles for several years.
New charging message/warning
TimothyHW3
Active Member
I don't think him charging to 100% or 95% every time alone will kill the car(will do, but not alone). But charging to 90%-100% in combination with "flooring" it all the time like he says, will significantly reduce range. But that doesn't seem to be a person who cares a lot about that so no need to argue or give advice.
Also, that warning message gets logged in the car and Tesla has access to it.
He might start seeing reduced range within the ownership though, not only after. We have seen people do what he does and end up with 15% degradation after 30,000 miles so...
Also, that warning message gets logged in the car and Tesla has access to it.
He might start seeing reduced range within the ownership though, not only after. We have seen people do what he does and end up with 15% degradation after 30,000 miles so...
I've had great experiences with used ICE cars, but no way I'd buy a used EV in the near future.
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