HankLloydRight
No Roads
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Front-rear camera touchscreen parking protection switch kit reservations
- Thread starter artsci
- Start date
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- Model S User Interface
I'm pretty sure that only the chassis ground is needed but I want to double check with WhiteP85, who designed the circuit. I'll post when I have an answer.
This is what WhiteP85 had so say:
I really do not think it matters. Engineers will make arguments about ground loops etc and not connecting both so just say one or the other. Either one or both will work.
He designed the circuit so he should know.
Gizmotoy
Active Member
Not that it wasn't expected, but it sounds like Tesla's taken notice. I picked up my backup camera today and got a general "that voids your warranty" warning. They already knew what it was for. I asked for more details regarding their position on the warranty, but the person most familiar with their stance was out. It sounded like the notice came directly from Fremont.
They asked me to hold off on doing anything until they could get clarification, not that there's much I could do yet, anyway.
In general a manufacturer is not permitted to deny warranty claims unless they can prove the aftermarket part was the cause. Practically, they can make it a pain in your ass. Mitsubishi guys joke Evos have no warranty as Mitsu is infamous for telling you to get lost if you so much as sneeze in its general direction.
I probably won't have more info until I go back in to have my parking sensors fixed next month, though.
In any case, wanted to mention it.
They asked me to hold off on doing anything until they could get clarification, not that there's much I could do yet, anyway.
In general a manufacturer is not permitted to deny warranty claims unless they can prove the aftermarket part was the cause. Practically, they can make it a pain in your ass. Mitsubishi guys joke Evos have no warranty as Mitsu is infamous for telling you to get lost if you so much as sneeze in its general direction.
I probably won't have more info until I go back in to have my parking sensors fixed next month, though.
In any case, wanted to mention it.
TXjak
Owner/Investor/Advocate
Placed my order yesterday. I have a low-mount license plate and should be able to mount the camera under the nose cone.
A full width picture of the nose with the camera might be a nice addition to the instructions.
John
A full width picture of the nose with the camera might be a nice addition to the instructions.
John
HankLloydRight
No Roads
The only warranty I could see it voiding is the 17" display and associated computer/CPU. That's the only real thing it taps into/interfaces with, and then it's only a video signal.
Based on what I know this may be a few service centers action on their own.I would be surprised if this is company policy. It would be profoundly ironic if one of the great innovators in auto technology tries to discourage or even penalize innovation by owners.
The odds of damage to the touchscreen from the switch are near zero. The switch is the electronic equivalent of unplugging the camera from the touchscreen and plugging it back in. All the touchscreen electronics know is that a Tesla camera is plugged in with the required signals. They just display the image -- they don't know where the image comes from or where the camera is mounted. All they know is that acceptable signals have been received.
The 2 second display on the touchscreen of the "Camera Unavailable" message when the switch is made is the touchscreen recognizing the the camera is unplugged for a brief moment while the switch is made.
We have 34 at the moment. Once we get to 44 we'll begin production. And of course, the price starts to decline with each order over 50.
The license plate frame bracket will be ready for production a week from Monday. I assume by then the switch will already be in production. so the timing of this all should be good.
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HankLloydRight
No Roads
I'm curious about the production process... So assuming from your previous posts, the minimum production run/order is 100 units, and the initial contributors are funding equally the entire cost of that production run. But if we only have 50 people sign up and pay $225 each, how are the remaining 50 units going to be sold, and for how much? I don't doubt that eventually all 100 units can be sold, but it's kind of unclear how this is going to play out for the early adopters who are in effect subsidizing the entire production run.
The manufacturer of the case and PCB has a requirement for a minimum run of 100. As it's very hard to anticipate and plan for the timing and number of orders, we'll set the final price based on the number of orders we have as of April 5. All orders that have been made at that time will pay that price. If the number is over 50, everyone will get a refund for the difference between what they paid and the final price. If it's under 50 a premium will have to be paid by everyone. After April 5, any new orders that come in will pay the same price.
As WhiteP85 and I are only interested in recovering our development costs (about $1,500), we may or may not achieve that goal with the April 5 price. If and when the development costs are covered, whether before or after April 5, any excess will be provided to TMC, which we believe has made this possible in the first place.
If the number of orders require a second production run at some point in the future, we'll go through this all over again, expect the development costs, if covered by the first run, will not be an issue.
If anyone has a better idea, please share it.
Good idea. We'll consider that.
Someone asked for a full width photo the the front of the car with the front camera in place. The arrow points to the camera. Please note that this camera location is recommended for cars without a front plate as well as those with a low-mounted front plate. The stock plate frame will require the still-under development bracket.
BTW, the lighted T is on in this photo.
P5802
Member
HankLloydRight
No Roads
If just seems there has to be a better way than charging a near 100% early adopter fee if not enough units are pre-ordered.
If close to 100 are sold before the deadline, then everything is honky-dory. But if only 50 are sold, that leads to some interesting numbers:
Say 50 units are pre-ordered at $225 each, that's $11,250. Less paypal fees ($330), your development costs ($1500), leaves about $9400 for the production run. Is that about right?
That leaves another 50 units to sell at $225 each, which is another $10k of total revenue that has to go somewhere. All that goes to TMC? When the actual cost of each unit is only about $115? So essentially if only 50 units are committed to before April 5th, every buyer of the initial 100 units is also making a $100 donation to TMC. I have no problem at all with TMC getting a cut for creating and maintaining this community, but that seems exorbitant to me.
Alternatively, If only 40 units are pre-ordered, the per unit price jumps to $280, and the total revenue for the remaining 60 units goes up to about $16k, and each of the early-adopters has to kick in an additional $50!.
I think a more equitable idea would be for someone (or a small group of people) to commit to buying up the remaining unsold stock at $115 each, so all the early adopters get the lowest price possible. Then the investment group who put up the initial investment (and risk of holding inventory and opportunity cost of the invested capital) can then turn around and sell them for whatever price they see fit (with some profit built in to adjust for the risks). Say, $175 per unit. That would give all the early adopters the lowest possible price, the non-early adopters a reasonable price, the investment group a little profit (about $3000) to pay for the investment risk and shipping/fulfillment labor, plus some to kick back to TMC.
Since you and WhiteP85 put in all the hard work putting this together, it seems "right" that you should be able to benefit in this manner at selling the remaining units for a small profit to make up for the time and effort you put into it. But I understand if either one of both of you are not in a position to put up the cash (or take the associated risks) up front.
These are just my thoughts on the process. Feel free to challenge/dispute them, I have my flame suit on.
If just seems there has to be a better way than charging a near 100% early adopter fee if not enough units are pre-ordered.
If close to 100 are sold before the deadline, then everything is honky-dory. But if only 50 are sold, that leads to some interesting numbers:
Say 50 units are pre-ordered at $225 each, that's $11,250. Less paypal fees ($330), your development costs ($1500), leaves about $9400 for the production run. Is that about right?
That leaves another 50 units to sell at $225 each, which is another $10k of total revenue that has to go somewhere. All that goes to TMC? When the actual cost of each unit is only about $115? So essentially if only 50 units are committed to before April 5th, every buyer of the initial 100 units is also making a $100 donation to TMC. I have no problem at all with TMC getting a cut for creating and maintaining this community, but that seems exorbitant to me.
Alternatively, If only 40 units are pre-ordered, the per unit price jumps to $280, and the total revenue for the remaining 60 units goes up to about $16k, and each of the early-adopters has to kick in an additional $50!.
I think a more equitable idea would be for someone (or a small group of people) to commit to buying up the remaining unsold stock at $115 each, so all the early adopters get the lowest price possible. Then the investment group who put up the initial investment (and risk of holding inventory and opportunity cost of the invested capital) can then turn around and sell them for whatever price they see fit (with some profit built in to adjust for the risks). Say, $175 per unit. That would give all the early adopters the lowest possible price, the non-early adopters a reasonable price, the investment group a little profit (about $3000) to pay for the investment risk and shipping/fulfillment labor, plus some to kick back to TMC.
Since you and WhiteP85 put in all the hard work putting this together, it seems "right" that you should be able to benefit in this manner at selling the remaining units for a small profit to make up for the time and effort you put into it. But I understand if either one of both of you are not in a position to put up the cash (or take the associated risks) up front.
These are just my thoughts on the process. Feel free to challenge/dispute them, I have my flame suit on.
The idea is worth considering but let's wait to see where we are on April 5.
By my estimate, there are probably about 37 orders so far, with April 5 being far away. If it turns out that only 50 units are sold by April 5 (which I doubt; will likely be higher), maybe you should consider buying 2 units each. The net cost will ultimately be about the same, because the per unit cost will decrease, and you will have a spare unit in the event one is needed at some point in the future.
Rick and WhiteP85 have done a great thing here. If you end up "donating" $100 to TMC, is that really so bad, considering all you have probably benefited from this site? I don't think so.
Rick and WhiteP85 have done a great thing here. If you end up "donating" $100 to TMC, is that really so bad, considering all you have probably benefited from this site? I don't think so.
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HankLloydRight
No Roads
It's not $100, it's $100 times 100 units = $10,000. If you're asking each person if they think that they would be OK with donating $100 to TMC as the early-adopter penalty for the front-camera kit, I don't think very many people would go for that. Personally, I could donate $20 to TMC, but not $100.
Also, if someone were to hypothetically buy the remaining unsold units (say there's 50).. I suspect it would be possible to get a bulk-discount deal on the cameras from Tesla and the cables from chita, and put together a complete "kit" with all the parts, ready to ship for less than what each of us can do individually. But that would require 50x$300= at least $15,000 just to buy the cameras and roughly $2500 for the cables, plus $6k for the kits == someone would need to be willing to invest roughly $25,000 to buy all the parts to resell, say for $600 total each bundle.
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