FSD Beta 11.3.3 Problems #2

I'm done for the time being with trying out FSD beta 11.3.3, especially after the rather dangerous interaction turning left into two oncoming vehicles. I know others have had a lot of luck in urban environments with this build, particularly with left turns, but my experience is quite the contrary. The software can usually handle left turns at simple, relatively flat, perpendicular intersections for the most part, but it can't cope with the types of intersections in my area.

I'm pretty unhappy with the school zone speed sign problem. This should be a high priority for a company that prides itself on vehicle safety.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Sorry I have to disagree with you partly here...just you cause it to kick out of AP because it doesn't steer the path you would have doesn't mean the path it chooses is "out of spec" per se. Nor does it mean that if you let it continue that it would cause an unsafe situation. As long as it follows a safe and reasonable path for the scenario then that is a good thing.

I am curious as to whether the car offsetting lane position because of a large truck would trigger your threshold. I'll have to try that one.

The other thing is that the amount of force required to kick out of AP is not static, nor do I really believe it to be predictable.

Maybe you did not see the video.

This is not a complicated topic and it is easy to determine how and when to intervene. Just don’t let the car deviate from a good path. There really is very little latitude in most situations.

The truck stuff doesn’t trigger it, nor should it. It’s quite small. But should account for all vehicles and avoid their blind spots when possible. (Another situation you should intervene! Don’t sit in blind spots!!!).

 

[islandbayy]

Just had mine try and take a left turn on a red light..... My MX even SAW & Showed the red lights on the dash screen. I disabled FSD and stopped, re-enabled from a full stop, and it started accelerating to turn left, AGAIN, on a red light.

Multiple times as well, it started driving on the wrong side of the road, even though it could see the lane lines perfectly.

add in, random turn signals when not turning, speed offset now being percent causing the vehicle to exceed speed limit by A LOT, and still stopping at both sides of a 4 way stop intersection, I'm not impressed. It did make right turns better, I'd say this was 1 step forward, a good 4 maybe 5 large steps backwards. I'm not impressed, and down right frustrated with this release. After I'm done testing it out a bit, This is the first time I'm at the point I think I will turn off FSD Beta until the next release and try again.

 

[ewoodrick]

Just had mine try and take a left turn on a red light..... My MX even SAW & Showed the red lights on the dash screen. I disabled FSD and stopped, re-enabled from a full stop, and it started accelerating to turn left, AGAIN, on a red light.

Did the light have the blue colorization indicating that it was the one that the car was using?

 

[islandbayy]

Did the light have the blue colorization indicating that it was the one that the car was using?

Yep! The lights were red, and encompassed by a blue colorizing/box.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Yeah I had mine try to go through a red left turn arrow today too. I think it was a head fake though.

Unfortunately did not have full screen mode so the left turn camera display blocked what it thought about the signals. It says “Stopping For Traffic Light” the whole time.

Looks like it may have just misplaced the stop line.

Another thing it did here was turn right before turning left. This is probably something to do with trajectory changes but is obviously very dumb. Just turn like a normal person!!!

There was no one behind me here or in the turn lanes, otherwise I would have never allowed this to occur. I let it go until my curiosity was satisfied, but it looks like perhaps it would have stopped a moment later. Hard to know.

When making videos it is tempting to let it do stupid things. Again no one was really around so seemed like a non-issue.

 

[islandbayy]

Yeah I had mine try to go through a red left turn arrow today too. I think it was a head fake though.

Unfortunately did not have full screen mode so the left turn camera display blocked what it thought about the signals. It says “Stopping For Traffic Light” the whole time.

Looks like it may have just misplaced the stop line.

Another thing it did here was turn right before turning left. This is probably something to do with trajectory changes but is obviously very dumb. Just turn like a normal person!!!

There was no one behind me here or in the turn lanes, otherwise I would have never allowed this to occur. I let it go until my curiosity was satisfied, but it looks like perhaps it would have stopped a moment later. Hard to know.

When making videos it is tempting to let it do stupid things. Again no one was really around so seemed like a non-issue.

Oh, mine was definitely going to go. Wasn't an inch forward, it went past the line, then hard accel. Finding freeway not so good either, the car was wavering back and fourth. swerving back and fourth like a race car behind the pace car.

 

[ewoodrick]

Yep! The lights were red, and encompassed by a blue colorizing/box.

I'm pretty sure that the car wouldn't have actually done it. It's of course something that we won't be able to know.

The WORSE things, I believe, with FSD and Autopilot is that so many people have not been able to slowly get used to it. It's a turn on and panic type of operation.
And the other is that there is too much LA driving baked into the process (appropriately and regrettably) For example Mad Max mode allowing the car to change lanes without a safe distance between cars.

I have it happen all the time where my wife aborts FSD because she doesn't think that it will do it. I then go back and do the same thing and indeed it makes it without a problem. My reaction time is much faster than hers and then I'm watching closely, the car pretty much has to be within feet of a collision before I will turn it off.
She then sees that the car will do it and she's happy.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

The WORSE things, I believe, with FSD and Autopilot is that so many people have not been able to slowly get used to it.

I have to admit that it is hard to get used to driving into a crosswalk at a red light for no apparent reason. Maybe it will just take more time?

 

[ewoodrick]

I have to admit that it is hard to get used to driving into a crosswalk at a red light for no apparent reason. Maybe it will just take more time?

Yep, got to get used to it.

Don't just say that it is FSD only doing it. I'm pretty sure that thousands of other cars have done the same thing. So many people have no idea what a stop bar is.

 

[Dewg]

I have to admit that it is hard to get used to driving into a crosswalk at a red light for no apparent reason. Maybe it will just take more time?

You got used to speeding, you can get used to this.

 

[dgatwood]

More issues:

• Still reliably fails to stop for the stop sign at the edge of the parking lot at the Scotts Valley supercharger.
• Stopped at least 10 feet back from the limit line at the traffic light next to that with no cars ahead. (Have not reproduced, because being the front car at the light is rare.)
• Tried to use the bus stop at UCSC as a driving lane. Back in 10.69.x, it signaled a lane change to the left while traveling westbound, which had I not intervened, would likely have taken the car into oncoming traffic, so something is very, very wrong in the way FSDb handles this spot.
• Tried to hump the gore point at El Rancho Dr. when not exiting. 10.69.x exhibited unexpected slowdowns here and switched out of highway mode into FSDb mode, so again, there's something reliably wrong here.
• Multiple attempts to leave the lane at Shoreline onramp (#1, #2) for no reason — once crossing the dotted line into the CA-85 lane, and once aiming me towards the right side wall.
• Still mostly tries to take speed bumps at 25 MPH.

So interventions on the highway and in relatively simple straight driving are much higher for me in 11.3.3 than they were in 10.69 or any previous build, including pre-FSDb builds. Basic lane keeping and lane decision-making is just seriously bad, and getting worse instead of better.

On the plus side, turns and slowing down at stop signs seems better, when it doesn't blow through the stop signs entirely.

 

[eli_]

Oftentimes it's hesitant to enter a left or right turning lane, and only enters at the last second, obstructing traffic in the through-lanes unnecessarily and/or annoying drivers who enter the turn lane behind me. I've found that if I put the turn signal on earlier, it causes it to enter the lane at the proper time. So it's a useful workaround to avoid disengaging.

 

[browny00]

I'm done for the time being with trying out FSD beta 11.3.3, especially after the rather dangerous interaction turning left into two oncoming vehicles. I know others have had a lot of luck in urban environments with this build, particularly with left turns, but my experience is quite the contrary. The software can usually handle left turns at simple, relatively flat, perpendicular intersections for the most part, but it can't cope with the types of intersections in my area.

I'm pretty unhappy with the school zone speed sign problem. This should be a high priority for a company that prides itself on vehicle safety.

Any chance that first left into oncoming traffic was a consequence of it sensing the oncoming vehicle was slowing down?

Second instance it may not have realized that right lane it was in was straight thru and not a turn lane?

No excuse for the third instance in which it almost turned into oncoming.

Fourth one is a known concern even with base AP.

Not trying to make excuses for the system here, just curious.

 

[GoVols!]

Maybe Telsa should take some notes from Waymo and Cruise. For the life of me, can’t figure out why Tesla FSD is getting worse, while other companies are getting much better. Tesla should be the giant in this field, yet Waymo and Cruise are spanking Elons bottom in this department. Hopefully HW4.5 if release in fall will have more cameras and an active Phoenix radar system that really works.

 

[kgarrison81]

What is the advantage of even enabling this feature when you have to monitor it with anxiety, worse than driving with a teenage driver? I did not spend the $15,000 fee Tesla charges to test their product because of this reason on my new X Plaid. I think this is a waste of money and Tesla should be paying people to risk their lives testing their product.. I'm failing to see why someone would want to use this instead of just driving themselves.

 

[kgarrison81]

Maybe Telsa should take some notes from Waymo and Cruise. For the life of me, can’t figure out why Tesla FSD is getting worse, while other companies are getting much better. Tesla should be the giant in this field, yet Waymo and Cruise are spanking Elons bottom in this department. Hopefully HW4.5 if release in fall will have more cameras and an active Phoenix radar system that really works.

Elon isn't really competing with Wayno and Cruise to be fair. His primary focus (based on his every 5-10 mins of tweeting) is working at Twitter now. His focus used to be on Tesla, now it is on Twitter and tweeting political debates, memes, and arguing with people online.

 

[Yelobird]

Maybe Telsa should take some notes from Waymo and Cruise. For the life of me, can’t figure out why Tesla FSD is getting worse, while other companies are getting much better. Tesla should be the giant in this field, yet Waymo and Cruise are spanking Elons bottom in this department. Hopefully HW4.5 if release in fall will have more cameras and an active Phoenix radar system that really works.

Exactly how many Waymo and Cruise cars are driving around Knoxville currently? My guess is 0

 

[GoVols!]

Elon isn't really competing with Wayno and Cruise to be fair. His primary focus (based on his every 5-10 mins of tweeting) is working at Twitter now. His focus used to be on Tesla, now it is on Twitter and tweeting political debates, memes, and arguing with people online.

Some of his tweets are funny though and I don’t mind his politics…But he needs to hire a PR team and take the CEO position to bring Tesla into the future once again. The guy practically never sleeps and maybe that’s part of the problem.

 

[GoVols!]

Exactly how many Waymo and Cruise cars are driving around Knoxville currently? My guess is 0

Absolutely true. Teslas goal is Robotaxi and Waymo is actually doing it. Now granted, they still use a driver pretty often to co-pilot. I bet if Elon could simply add more cameras, LiDAR and the rest his tech, FSD would be getting praise right now. He has the tools and money to do it. But currently, we can’t even see if we are going to hit something pulling forward

 

[Yelobird]

Absolutely true. Teslas goal is Robotaxi and Waymo is actually doing it. Now granted, they still use a driver pretty often to co-pilot. I bet if Elon could simply add more cameras, LiDAR and the rest his tech, FSD would be getting praise right now. He has the tools and money to do it. But currently, we can’t even see if we are going to hit something pulling forward

Yet my current FSD car drives all states, city, side roads, with minimal issue and minimal boundary so I think they are headed the right direction. I didn’t buy a taxi, I bought an advancing transportation vehicle so I am fine with the direction and company strategy.