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General Discussion: 2018 Investor Roundtable

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Jim Cramer Defends Elon Musk's Crazy Call: Every CEO Would Love To Go Off Like That | CNBC


OK, it's on YouTube now. If you haven't seen Jim Cramer's response to the CC, you MUST have a look. Cramer's on board with Musk's actions yesterday. Absolutely priceless...o_O
Some place has frozen over... Interesting comments in fact even saying it's more important to understand what is under the hood--it's all electric!!!! Soon they won't be able to give away the oil (that's me!)
 
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Galileo on Cheddar (financial news channel), including some of his thoughts on media and analysts reactions to Musk's handling of yesterday's call vs. feedback he's hearing from investors,

Thank you for recommending this interview. Nice thing is the various images shown of Teslas and Elon were very positive and attractive images. Many news shows show angry or otherwise strange looking pictures of Elon.
 
Nevermind, 27442 assigned, in Canada (amount in Canadian $)

VIN Assignment

tesla_vin-jpg.298497
VIN 29xxx also reported, also for Canada. So the VINs registered on 4/23 from 28297 to 33466 now makes sense, and gap from registration to assignment is down to 10 days again, similar to mid March after the Feb shutdown. I don't know exactly why, but there seems to be a pattern to the registration to assignment gap vs the step-function in the ramp.
 
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Honestly, the short thesis is stronger than ever. I'd love someone to actually engage on some of these topics rather than dismiss it. I am considering shorting more.
  • Tesla's cash position continues to deteriorate:
    • -2.2B in working capital
    • 2.4B CapEx planned this year
    • 2.7B in cash
    • It sure looks like Tesla is facing a 1.9B budget shortfall
    • In line with Moody's and Wall Street's guidance that they need to raise 2B this year.
    • Musk reaffirmed that they will not raise capital.
  • No new Tesla products until 2020 at earliest
    • Semi pushed out to 2020
    • Model Y CapEx won't start until 2019, implying launch in 2020
    • Roadster was never even mentioned.
    • Musk tried to avoid YouTuber's request for Full Self Driving timeline but said it wouldn't be finished until late 2019, implying 2020 launch.
  • Model 3 production is still unstable and "ramping"
    • Major shifts to manufacturing strategy, including 24/7, less automation
    • Teardown video demonstrated high component costs
    • Tax benefits presumably to begin fading this year.
    • Still no week above 2500 output.
    • Lots of references to renegotiating with suppliers.
    • Earnings call mentioned an upcoming company restructure.

The only thing that matters right now is whether you believe Tesla can reach 5,000 weekly run rate of Model 3. The rest is noise. Place your bets accordingly!
 
Now might be a good time for me to mention that I am going to be phasing out my Mod: activities. My semi-retirement has been interrupted by a full-time too-good-to-miss opportunity as CTO of a (different, stealth) startup. Lord Vetinari @AudubonB continues to be Tyrant of All, but he and @doug and @Doug_G would appreciate hearing from people who are riveted to the screen anyway.

For those of you whose posts are being moderated (not all put there by me, either), I will be as quick as I can in approving (or not)postings, but we don't seem to have a way to take you off moderation until the time expires. That's just how it goes, sorry. Expect delays in responding to reports as well.

For all of you, especially those who appreciate good back-and-forth between bulls and bears, this can be a profitable and pleasing forum when everyone is civil. Liberal use of the ignore button, when tempted not to be civil, is recommended. Don't make me come back!
 
VIN 29xxx also reported, also for Canada. So the VINs registered on 4/23 from 28297 to 33466 now makes sense, and gap from registration to assignment is down to 10 days again, similar to mid March after the Feb shutdown. I don't know exactly why, but there seems to be a pattern to the registration to assignment gap vs the step-function in the ramp.
Elon has already admitted VIN tracking is accurate with a week's delay on that call.
 
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Did he clearly state it was VIN tracking that is being crowdsourced? I remember him saying something about how leaky the company is. Perhaps he meant that every time there's an "internal" memo on production, it gets out within a week, so any time they internally announce something everyone else will know it within a week.
 
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Elon has already admitted VIN tracking is accurate with a week's delay on that call.
Yes I think we're staying pretty close to Tesla's production rate with our crowd sourced data. I continue to be impressed by the contribution of forum members and specifically those running the google sheet.

The pattern that intrigues me is the gap between VIN registration and VIN assignment. A common perception here (the one I subscribe to) is that the registration is a leading indicator, the VIN exists before a car goes into production, while the VIN assignment is a lagging indicator, meaning that the VIN is assigned when a car comes out of production. I think Elon may be referring to this lagging indicator, when he said that we're seeing things a week behind Tesla.

The gap between the two indicator is interesting, and one would expect to be somewhat constant, basically the time it takes for a car to go through the production line. Ideally if we can understand the relationship between the two, we can then predict the production rate using the leading indicator, instead of the lagging indicator.

The difficulty in that is that we saw the gap as high as 37 days during the Feb shutdown, then went down to 10 days in March, then ballooned up to 27 days during the April shutdown, and now down to 10 days again. Why would a 5 day shutdown wag the gap by so much? The two indicators don't seem to directly correlate with a constant time shift, but some "rubber banding" effect as well.

One possible explanation is that Tesla is preparing a big bucket of VINs just before the shutdown, so if the rate increases quickly after the shutdown, they can start building a lot of cars with that big bucket of VINs. But in reality the production rate doesn't step up to a new plateau immediately after the shutdown, so the bucket takes a while to empty out.

It makes VIN registration not very exact as a predictor, basically, if we see some VIN registered, we should expect to see if assigned anywhere between 10-27 days, which is probably not too useful.
 
Did he clearly state it was VIN tracking that is being crowdsourced? I remember him saying something about how leaky the company is. Perhaps he meant that every time there's an "internal" memo on production, it gets out within a week, so any time they internally announce something everyone else will know it within a week.
He 1st said Tesla is pretty leaky, then also said people track registration pretty closely


starting around 1:09:45 mark
 
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I think it also means J.B. is following closely new cathode design(s) requiring no cobalt at all. Increasing cobalt production is more problematic than Lithium and other key battery metals. Could be one more moat developing for 2020 - 2025.

I think this was glossed over after the debacle with the call. This is bigger then people understand. The real issue with Cobalt is that there was only one way to use less of it and that was NMC 811, which if I understand is a ratio, 8:1:1 with Cobalt content being the least. As we all know Tesla used nca chemistry in cars and nmc in storage. The major difference is energy density vs charge cycles. It appears that Tesla will have a battery more like NMC in terms of less Cobalt but higher density like nca. They also said it was lighter, which topically means less expensive when you are working on the scale of a gigafactory.

Competitors will be forced to use heavy, low energy dense cells to avoid the issues with Cobalt when compared to Tesla. This compounds the issues they will have with supply in general.

Nmc does have an advantage of having less degradation over many more cycles, but maybe Tesla has a solution to that if the data holds for Tesla's current nca packs and they can make some minor improvements. Even if they can't, they can pad the size of the pack with some spare range that is saved for degradation and dynamically unlocks over time. A million miles for the pack at 80% should be the goal.
 
Honestly, the short thesis is stronger than ever. I'd love someone to actually engage on some of these topics rather than dismiss it. I am considering shorting more.
  • Tesla's cash position continues to deteriorate:
    • -2.2B in working capital
    • 2.4B CapEx planned this year
    • 2.7B in cash
    • It sure looks like Tesla is facing a 1.9B budget shortfall
    • In line with Moody's and Wall Street's guidance that they need to raise 2B this year.
    • Musk reaffirmed that they will not raise capital.
  • No new Tesla products until 2020 at earliest
    • Semi pushed out to 2020
    • Model Y CapEx won't start until 2019, implying launch in 2020
    • Roadster was never even mentioned.
    • Musk tried to avoid YouTuber's request for Full Self Driving timeline but said it wouldn't be finished until late 2019, implying 2020 launch.
  • Model 3 production is still unstable and "ramping"
    • Major shifts to manufacturing strategy, including 24/7, less automation
    • Teardown video demonstrated high component costs
    • Tax benefits presumably to begin fading this year.
    • Still no week above 2500 output.
    • Lots of references to renegotiating with suppliers.
    • Earnings call mentioned an upcoming company restructure.

As I mentioned before, current liabilities included 1 billion in deposits and 500 million in deferred revenue. This is money that most likely will never be paid back on net, but rather converted into revenue. So reality negative working capital approx 700 million.

Secondly, they can use deposits for operations if they want to. I am almost certain that was part of the agreement when I signed up for M3.

So they have 3.1 billion of planned cash outflow, 2.7 billion in cash, and working quickly towards breakeven, and soon hopefully positive cash flow, so they will be fine. It’s going to be tight, but they will be fine.
 
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