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#141
This is the sign I think should be used in almost all cases:

Charging Space Sign.jpg


It uses the standard "No Parking" symbol, which is exactly what's needed, since charging spaces are NOT parking spaces, and it also makes it clear that it's only for charging, not a privileged space for EVs or Hybrids or "Green Cars". Designating charging spaces "No Parking" should allow regular parking violation enforcement to be used, and people recognize this symbol and understand that it's generally enforceable. If local legislation allows towing, there should be an extra sign like this (or a recognized tow-away zone symbol) below it:

Tow-away Sign.jpg


These signs don't apply to "dual-use" charging/parking spaces, but that setup should only be the last resort if dedicated charging spaces can't be arranged. And of course, the signs should be adapted to local languages and standard no-parking symbols.

We need to keep reminding everyone that these are "fueling" spaces, not parking spaces. The only time it gets a bit complicated is if an EV parks overnight at a hotel's charging space, but it finishes charging after a few hours. I don't think anyone would expect you to move your car until morning, unless someone requested that in advance and you agreed to it.
 
#142
Peter_M said:
This is the sign I think should be used in almost all cases:

View attachment 58604

It uses the standard "No Parking" symbol, which is exactly what's needed, since charging spaces are NOT parking spaces, and it also makes it clear that it's only for charging, not a privileged space for EVs or Hybrids or "Green Cars". Designating charging spaces "No Parking" should allow regular parking violation enforcement to be used, and people recognize this symbol and understand that it's generally enforceable. If local legislation allows towing, there should be an extra sign like this (or a recognized tow-away zone symbol) below it:

View attachment 58605

These signs don't apply to "dual-use" charging/parking spaces, but that setup should only be the last resort if dedicated charging spaces can't be arranged. And of course, the signs should be adapted to local languages and standard no-parking symbols.

We need to keep reminding everyone that these are "fueling" spaces, not parking spaces. The only time it gets a bit complicated is if an EV parks overnight at a hotel's charging space, but it finishes charging after a few hours. I don't think anyone would expect you to move your car until morning, unless someone requested that in advance and you agreed to it.
Click to expand...

I like it. Most people know that parking in a no parking space can also mean that they return to a missing vehicle or a ticket.
 
#144
Timothy said:
I was in the public garage at the UCSF center at Mission Bay. These are the signs they have up--one for EVs and the other for hybrids:
Click to expand...

The idea of a "Green Car" parking space is silly on many fronts. I get the intention - motivate people to drive an environmentally-friendly car - but I don't think this is the way to do it. It's particularly funny that the Tesla Model S and Roadster are not eligible (check the web site). This has been discussed before; the list of "green cars" used for LEED uses some strange formula that disqualifies Teslas. But besides that, I would prefer not to see "privileged" parking spaces for EVs, hybrids, and so on. EV drivers have no special need to be closer to the door, it's hard to define who should benefit, and those who can't use it might see it as green snobbery - something we don't need.
 
#145
Peter_M said:
The idea of a "Green Car" parking space is silly on many fronts. I get the intention - motivate people to drive an environmentally-friendly car - but I don't think this is the way to do it. It's particularly funny that the Tesla Model S and Roadster are not eligible (check the web site). This has been discussed before; the list of "green cars" used for LEED uses some strange formula that disqualifies Teslas. But besides that, I would prefer not to see "privileged" parking spaces for EVs, hybrids, and so on. EV drivers have no special need to be closer to the door, it's hard to define who should benefit, and those who can't use it might see it as green snobbery - something we don't need.
Click to expand...

Yes, we have several parking lots with that sort of thing here. Usually it's the company trying to make a statement that they support "green". What it does is make people even more resentful of the "smug prius driver". I refuse to use them.
 
#146
PhilBa said:
Yes, we have several parking lots with that sort of thing here. Usually it's the company trying to make a statement that they support "green". What it does is make people even more resentful of the "smug prius driver". I refuse to use them.
Click to expand...

I know this is off topic, but I feel somewhat the same way about the HOV lanes and don't use them for similar reasons.
 
#147
You're right, they are kind of similar. I'll admit to taking advantage of the HOV lanes last week in Toronto when traffic was pretty nasty (when is it not?). There's only one HOV lane in Ottawa and there's rarely heavy traffic there, so I have almost never used them. I'll pledge to stay out of them unless I have a passenger or the traffic is really bad :rolleyes:. In any case, this "special access" expires on July 1, 2015.
 
#149
Peter_M said:
EV drivers have no special need to be closer to the door, it's hard to define who should benefit, and those who can't use it might see it as green snobbery - something we don't need.
Click to expand...

Actually, I have always like parking spots at the far end of the parking lot. That way there frequently is no car next to me, and I don't get 'Alpha Beta rash.' (Affectionately named after the Alpha Beta supermarket here in Santa Barbara. The rash is when the jerk next to you opens his door and dings your car.)

Parking at the far end of the lot also gives you extra walking to get those 10,000 steps we all need on a daily basis!

So I would be delighted with EV charging spots further from the stores--maybe the ICE vehicles would be less inclined to use them that way!
 
#150
Timothy said:
Actually, I have always like parking spots at the far end of the parking lot. That way there frequently is no car next to me, and I don't get 'Alpha Beta rash.' (Affectionately named after the Alpha Beta supermarket here in Santa Barbara. The rash is when the jerk next to you opens his door and dings your car.)

Parking at the far end of the lot also gives you extra walking to get those 10,000 steps we all need on a daily basis!

So I would be delighted with EV charging spots further from the stores--maybe the ICE vehicles would be less inclined to use them that way!
Click to expand...

Heh heh, I used to do that but my red P85 is a damn magnet. I'll park in the most empty part of the parking lot and, sure enough, when i return there will inevitably be a couple of cars parked near me. Not always right next to me but more often than not. Usually they are also nice cars so it's probably because people figure that's a safe location.
 
#151
Peter_M said:
You're right, they are kind of similar. I'll admit to taking advantage of the HOV lanes last week in Toronto when traffic was pretty nasty
Click to expand...

Are EVs from out of province allowed in Ontario's HOV lanes? Are there places other than California where you need a special sticker to qualify for this benefit?


(In Quebec, they don't discriminate. Neither outsiders nor locals have HOV privileges for the time-being).
 
#154
RiverBrick said:
The language in the sign was clear
Click to expand...
Well, it is if you speak French... :wink:

- - - Updated - - -

PhilBa said:
Heh heh, I used to do that but my red P85 is a damn magnet. I'll park in the most empty part of the parking lot and, sure enough, when i return there will inevitably be a couple of cars parked near me. Not always right next to me but more often than not. Usually they are also nice cars so it's probably because people figure that's a safe location.
Click to expand...
Or some people like to follow you over there and park near the new car at the other side of the lot just to cause trouble.

At a friend's company many years ago, one of the salesguys had a great quarter, and bought himself a 911. He used to park it at the far corner of the lot far away from everyone else.

One of the other guys in the office owned a horse farm. One day he came to work in his farm truck full of horse s--t, and parked way across the lot next to the 911. The 911 guy gave up parking way out in Outer Mongolia after that.
 
#155
Timothy said:
So I would be delighted with EV charging spots further from the stores--maybe the ICE vehicles would be less inclined to use them that way!
Click to expand...

Agree 100% but the problem is the cost of getting the wiring out to the far end of the parking lot. That's why you typically see chargers up near the building. The underground ducts and wiring are by far the most expensive component in installing these stations.
 
#156
In August we were traveling to Portland, OR from Montana in My ICE car :frown: and we decided that Ritzville would work good for us to stay overnight and then could see our first Supercharger. I noticed all the SC's were unused but one space was iced. Then all of a sudden 3 Tesla Model S's showed up and in a few minutes the Ritzville Hotel Manager came out and moved his ICE car, it was he that was using one of the spots. The good thing is he was paying attention and came out ASAP to move his car, just in case another Tesla showed up. He did tell me that 3 is the max he's had so far, at one time.
 
#157
I've traveled all over the U.S. in my Tesla. Most of the time the supercharging parking stall we need is available so, no problem. There ARE those other times!!! Proper signage and enforcement is the only solution. When I got completely ICED in Glenwood Springs at midnight (just traveling through) it was more than just a little irritating, especially because it was so blatant!! (see previous posts) Now, if you are at a hotel that has a supercharger... plug in when you get there. I have, with 2 miles range remaining. Go check in, take your bags to your room etc., grab a bite to eat and then go move your car for the nights sleep. You are probably more than half charged up by this point anyway. The following morning plug back in before eating breakfast etc. and you will be good to go for the next leg in your travels. This way, others that come by the supercharging station in the middle of the night, who aren't spending the night, can use it to charge up and just keep on going. There is just no need or good reason for any of us to be parked at a supercharging stall unless we are charging.:crying:
 
#158
DrGuest said:
In August we were traveling to Portland, OR from Montana in My ICE car :frown: and we decided that Ritzville would work good for us to stay overnight and then could see our first Supercharger. I noticed all the SC's were unused but one space was iced. Then all of a sudden 3 Tesla Model S's showed up and in a few minutes the Ritzville Hotel Manager came out and moved his ICE car, it was he that was using one of the spots. The good thing is he was paying attention and came out ASAP to move his car, just in case another Tesla showed up. He did tell me that 3 is the max he's had so far, at one time.
Click to expand...
Actually that's not so bad, he is preventing the spot from being really ICEd by a car parked there for the night. It's similar to a situation I encountered at Hotel Galvez garage in Galveston, TX with their two J1772 charging stations-- the valets use those as parking spots and if a EV shows up they will move one of the cars immediately. If it was a non-valet parked car in that spot in the garage we would have been ICEd for the night.
 
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